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Old 01-08-2009, 09:20 AM
 
274 posts, read 737,042 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tpk-nyc View Post
For a certain group of people, New York is the ultimate. Once you star on Broadway, or are a managing director at Goldman Sachs, or design the Christmas windows at Bergdorf's, or write for the New Yorker, etc., you have reached the pinnacle of career possibilities.
True, but that applies only to a very small percentage of people.

The vast majority of transplants are poseurs merely trying to bask in the reflected glory.

NYC is nothing but a BRAND and most transplants are like kids wearing a name brand shoe because they see superstar athletes wearing them. But being able to afford expensive shoes doesn't make them superstar athletes.

Just look at neighborhoods like SoHo or the Village, where rich folks and suburban kids now live because it's "artsy" and "bohemian". But the people who made it cool have mostly long moved on.
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Old 01-08-2009, 10:11 AM
 
Location: New York City
3,947 posts, read 4,562,773 times
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It doesn't matter if it's "real" or even rational. Most people live, or fantasize about living, a contrived lifestyle. Is living in a McMansion, driving an SUV and going to a mega-church any more authentic than living in Williamsburg and wearing $300 jeans? Who is the poseur? Both are idealized lifestyles that some people are able to turn into reality. At least the latter is more environmentally sustainable.

The question is not whether people should move to New York but why they do. People move to Phoenix because it's cheap and warm; people move to New York because it's hip and exciting. It may be reflected glory, but it still glimmers in its way. And why not? You only live once. New York has constant influx of educated young people. I'm sure that Detroit or Cleveland would love to have such a problem.
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Old 01-08-2009, 10:45 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn
40,060 posts, read 18,444,154 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tpk-nyc View Post
It doesn't matter if it's "real" or even rational. Most people live, or fantasize about living, a contrived lifestyle. Is living in a McMansion, driving an SUV and going to a mega-church any more authentic than living in Williamsburg and wearing $300 jeans? Who is the poseur? Both are idealized lifestyles that some people are able to turn into reality. At least the latter is more environmentally sustainable.

The question is not whether people should move to New York but why they do. People move to Phoenix because it's cheap and warm; people move to New York because it's hip and exciting. It may be reflected glory, but it still glimmers in its way. And why not? You only live once. New York has constant influx of educated young people. I'm sure that Detroit or Cleveland would love to have such a problem.
And two silver stars for you! One for hitting the nail squarely on the head. And another for responding to the previous poster with obvious restraint; I can see where you could have answered in a very different manner.
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Old 01-08-2009, 07:59 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
1,440 posts, read 1,380,806 times
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It's one of a handful of American cities with art culture and a full urban atmosphere. It's vibrant, catchy, and exciting.

However, I think a lot more people hate NY than love it. Everyone here in Texas thinks it's a crowded Mod cut: language. It pisses me off... Can't wait to get out of this suburban wasteland.

Last edited by Viralmd; 01-11-2009 at 12:42 PM..
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Old 01-08-2009, 10:16 PM
 
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I think there's a mild delusion running through this thread that New York City is somehow unique in attracting young white suburbanites. It's not. San Francisco, Seattle, Chicago, Austin, etc. are overrun with coffee-sipping hipsters and sushi-eating yuppies. Hell, even Kansas City has a very visible hipster infestation.

Don't brainwash yourselves into all this "New York City is unique", "arts, local communities, history make them come" nonsense. Yuppies and hipsters decidedly make New York City a lot more similar to the rest of the country, not distinct from it.

The uniqueness of New York City that made it survive the 20th century without turning into a complete ghetto was those Fifth, CPW and Park Avenue co-ops. Even in the darkest 70's, the affluent entertained their friends in their 14-room spreads. No other city had a substantial enough concentration of affluent apartment-dwellers. Everywhere else the rich lived in houses, which for the most part meant the suburbs. Without those pre-war apartment buildings, New York would've quite likely turned into Detroit. Just a speculation. The upper middle class refusing to abandon the urban core is a truly unique event in the history of 20th century urban America. They saved the city. Thank you, William F. Buckley, Jr. You saved New York City.
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Old 01-09-2009, 12:03 AM
 
Location: New York, New York
4,828 posts, read 3,895,655 times
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tpk-nyc and woozle have mad excellent points ! Many NYers think that they are better than the rest, even better than their neighbors that came from somewhere else, and yet many don't because we have all walks of life! Imo what makes NY truly great is that this city has embraced all that have come and embraces all that will! If we could take more time and look at that beautiful statue that was given to us from France we might understand that Ny is the greatest city on earth because its like everywhere else except in one place! If it exists and you look hard enough you will most likely find it here!I think that is why so many want to live here!
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Old 01-09-2009, 08:19 AM
 
Location: Living on the Coast in Oxnard CA
9,798 posts, read 12,386,429 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaReSe67 View Post
I've seen a couple of threads on here with people who are from out of town who want to live in NYC so much. Let me tell you Manhattan is full of people who are not really in fact New Yorkers. Tourists, Transplants, and stupid people with money. And once you've been in New York for a decent amount of time its just like anywhere else its what your used to. I mean it'll always be my home and I wouldn't live anywhere else but its not exactly like the streets are paved with gold.
Some people like me just want to visit. Others as you said are from other areas and living there. They are not what you would call a New Yorker but what is a New Yorker? How long do you have to live there before you are one? Aren't many people moving to the area because they are transfered or find work in the city? I don't understand why anyone would just move to an area unless they had family there, a job, or as you say so much money it doesn't matter where they live.
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Old 01-09-2009, 09:15 AM
 
274 posts, read 737,042 times
Reputation: 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpk-nyc View Post
It doesn't matter if it's "real" or even rational. Most people live, or fantasize about living, a contrived lifestyle. Is living in a McMansion, driving an SUV and going to a mega-church any more authentic than living in Williamsburg and wearing $300 jeans? Who is the poseur?
I like the distinction you're making between Brooklyn hipsters and McMansion folks because it is patently FALSE.

Those "Williamsburg hipsters wearing $300 jeans" are nothing more than the kids of those who live in "McMansions, drive SUVs and go to mega-churches" from Anonymous Suburb, USA.

What I said is still correct: Most transplants are not here gunning to be Broadway actors, Wall St. bigshots, artists, writers, fashion designers, etc. They're here because they want to feel the reflected glory of the above folks and just happen to be able to afford to live here.

Poseurs.
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Old 01-09-2009, 11:37 AM
 
Location: New York City
3,947 posts, read 4,562,773 times
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Are you somehow privy to the hopes, dreams and ambitions of the (supposedly homogeneous) group of New Yorkers commonly known as hipsters? They may be poseurs, the point is that everyone is a poseur to some degree. We live in a culture and, whether we like it or not, our thoughts and desires are shaped by that culture. Our tastes and opinions are formed on Madison Avenue and disseminated via the media and our peers. Branding is inescapable: we see brands, we buy brands, we are brands. The difference is that some brand-obsession is environmentally destructive.

What you're really writing about, as evinced by the line, "just happen to be able to afford to live here," is class. As Woozle correctly points out, there are hip, college graduates in many places. Why should it be more of a problem in New York than in Austin or Minneapolis? The answer is housing prices. Even the comparatively wealthy can't afford to live precisely where they wish. Until housing costs drop significantly (which, given current economic conditions is quite possible) there will be continued resentment against newcomers, whether young, trendy, neither or both.
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Old 01-09-2009, 11:54 AM
 
217 posts, read 360,513 times
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Again, Ace Rock, this is a common delusion. Most hipsters couldn't possibly care about Broadway stars and Wall Street bigshots. They're here, because their COMMUNITY is here. Yes, that's right. For the same reason there's a Mexican community in New York, there's a hipster community. Their friends are here. Their favorite rock groups play in Williamsburg night clubs. They feel more comfortable living in the same neighborhood as people just like them. If you feel bigoted toward the hipster community, how would you feel about bigoted statements made about Mexican, or Dominican, or Italian communities?

You may find whatever reason to despise the hipster COMMUNITY and blame them for making any particular place in New York unlivable.. but the truth is, there's barely a community in the city that has not been blamed for making the city unlivable for some other group of people.
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