Questions about the term "Hipster"

[tpk-nyc]

Originally Posted by Reverend TV

Wouldn't being here to stay means that the social/economic forces that gave rise to hipsterdom are static?

Affluence with critical theory?

More likely affluence with too much free time.Taking over the means of production of thought? When I think of "the power of manufactured thought", I'm thinking of the Wall Street bailout not some dude in a fedora and a guitar strapped to his back. Hipsters seem more like affluent youngsters interested in navel gazing, then putting out media to document/justify their importance.

Self importantance born of affluence is nothing new. People can get behind/understand/ appreciate self importance stemming from being a master of capital, rather than self importance brought upon by the onset of general ennui.

In a knowledge (or "creative" in the Richard Florida sense) economy, style and design are capital. When a dumpy Scottish woman makes international news for singing showtunes, we have become a society of quasi-hipsters.

Whenever you watch a reality TV show or forward a YouTube link you are a quasi-hipster and Andy Warhol is your patron saint. You're granting the proverbial 15 minutes to people famous-for-being-famous. Critical theory comes into play in that it provides the means of "reading" such cultural ephemera. The real hipsters (and similar types) see it for the ludicrous joke is actually is. Being able to "read," i.e., analyze and critique something (it can be anything: a restaurant, a pop song, a cocktail, a city) gives you power because you can control and recreate it.

If mainstream culture, including 70 year old grandmothers in Topeka, has become obsessed with this patently manufactured reality, what else is left? Rather than sitting on the couch watching it, a hipster can turn his life into manufactured reality show.

Why do many people trust "fake news" more than "real news"? Because they know it's fake. It provides a way of "reading" the so-called real news. It's a form of critical theory for the masses. Postmodernists, including hipsters, apply that same process to the culture as a whole. They are their own Jon Stewart.

Is talking about the new underground club over brunch in Williamsburg any different than talking about American Idol at the water cooler? It's all about bogus celebrity: what's hip, what's funny, what's new. Navel gazing in this context seems a comparatively noble pursuit. It is the search for meaning in a culture where everything is contrived.

In this town, creativity, be it financial or cultural, is all we have left besides the services industry. We don't produce anything else. It's all ideas and information. We manufacture thought. We decide what the rest of the country (and much of the world) reads, sees, listens to, eats, wears, etc. We also decide how it's packaged, marketed and sold. Our critics even decide the what the rest of the country thinks about our decisions.

And who writes the blogs, and designs the shoes, and tests the recipes at The Food Network, and designs the packaging, and programs the slots at MTV? New Yorkers: the postmodernists their new interns, the hipsters.

[Reverend TV]

Originally Posted by tpk-nyc

In a knowledge (or "creative" in the Richard Florida sense) economy, style and design are capital. When a dumpy Scottish woman makes international news for singing showtunes, we have become a society of quasi-hipsters.

Whenever you watch a reality TV show or forward a YouTube link you are a quasi-hipster and Andy Warhol is your patron saint. Critical theory comes into play in that it provides the means of "reading" such cultural ephemera. The real hipsters (and similar types) see it for the ludicrous joke is actually is. Being able to "read," i.e., analyze and critique something (it can be anything: a restaurant, a pop song, a cocktail, a city) gives you power because you can control and recreate it.

If mainstream culture, including 70 year old grandmothers in Topeka, has become obsessed with this patently manufactured reality, what else is left? Rather than sitting on the couch watching it, a hipster can turn his life into manufactured reality show.

Why do many people trust "fake news" more than "real news"? Because they know it's fake. It provides a way of "reading" the so-called real news. It's a form of critical theory for the masses. Postmodernists, including hipsters, apply that same process to the culture as a whole. They are their own Jon Stewart.

Is talking about the new underground club over brunch in Williamsburg any different than talking about American Idol at the water cooler? It's all about bogus celebrity: what's hip, what's funny, what's new. Navel gazing in this context seems a comparatively noble pursuit. It is the search for meaning in a culture where everything is contrived.

In this town, creativity, be it financial or cultural, is all we have left besides the services industry. We don't produce anything else. It's all ideas and information. We manufacture thought. We decide what the rest of the country (and much of the world) reads, sees, listens to, eats, wears, etc. We also decide how it's packaged, marketed and sold. Our critics even decide the what the rest of the country thinks about our decisions.

And who writes the blogs, and designs the shoes, and tests the recipes at The Food Network, and designs the packaging, and programs the slots at MTV? New Yorkers: the postmodernists their new interns, the hipsters.

Dumpy singers making the international news isn't thought provoking. Elvis was dumpy (zing)!

As for reality tv, what you allude to a societal changing/controlling force, I'd call a unfortunate way to spend free time. Being able to control and influence anything is made possible by affluence.


You (collectively) decide what a subset of society reads, listens to eats, wears, etc. Are skinny jeans big in the trailer parks? Don't think so. Why? Because you (collectively) are the arbiter of what is cool in your own sphere of influence and it isn't as big as you make it out to be. You decide what YOU think is important/worthwhile and act like the rest of the world is listening.

Or (hold on to your latte) is the non-proliferation of skinny jeans in certain parts of the country/world also by hipster design? So not only do YOU (collectively, of course) say what is cool, but people instinctively know not to wear it if they aren't hip enough?

Woooow!!

If anything is being sold, it is analogous to selling a wheel to a person that already owns a car. I already own the car, I've seen a wheel before. In other words, not new to me or most other people. The hipster is not on the cusp/forefront of anything except his or her own musings.

I'd argue that obsession with a "patently manufactured reality" was in full effect in America when it was founded. How else would one explain the dissonance of the words of the Constitution and the actions of empire building? Of course, reality depends on those who control the means of dissemination of history and political discourse.

Besides what is "bogus celebrity"? What is real celebrity? The very notion of celebrity has a falseness at its core. How many people would be celebrated if the totality of their being was known? Celebrity is a manufactured reality that predates the hipster since....ever. I'd agree that thought is capital, but controlling it is hardly new.

The Pharoahs invented the wheel before the hipsters and built lasting monuments to their control of "thought capital".

[NooYowkur81]

I was in Billy-burg yesterday, along bedford avenue. I know, I know, it was a Friday night on Bedford ave no less, but the place was flooded with hipster types. Flooded. A lot of them were literally just standing around. Maybe with the rougher times that's what they do now, just stand around.

[aninaction]

Originally Posted by tpk-nyc

This is true, but I disagree that the culture is in its death-throes. Hipsterdom, like its antecedent slackerdom, is what you get when you mix affluence with critical theory. Whereas slackers felt impotent in the face of postmodernism, hipster embrace it. The rationale is, if all thought is manufactured, why not take over the means of production? After all, we have the education and training to do it. We understand how game works and can sell it back to the general public.

It's here to stay because mainstream society (including most of the of the people who rail against hipsters) buys into the product, even if they don't understand (or are unaware of) the theory. Any time you watch "reality" television, much of which is produced by former slackers and current hipsters, you cement the victory of postmodernism and the power of the hipsters.

People who know their Foucault and McLuhan have a lot of power, though not in the way those authors intended.

Is it decadent? Certainly. Is it nihilistic? Perhaps. It is inevitable? That is the question.

are you seriously suggesting that reading foucault gives ANYONE an edge in the real world? Listen, I've read all those authors, and though, for example, foucault is overally optimistic about his own conclusions (as you are about your own), i still enjoy his work. however, these books don't give anyone any edge outside the world of college (And even there marginally so), and honestly, in most cases, only a hipster would suggest that they do. Plus the majority of hipsters in my city, know of foucault, but have never actually read him, though they would only admit this fact on pain of death. They pretend they've read him, and throw out some general catch phrases, nothing more.


anyone know a city that lacks hipsters? my friends in key west tell me there arent any there yet. id love to find a mid to big sized city that was decent and also didnt have these kids.

[JaasNYC]

Well, I went to Greenpoint last night and had to transfer to the G at Lorimer so I got a snap-shot of the hipster species. I'm a live and let live kind of guy so I believe that everybody plays their own part in this world. However, while sitting there looking at them I just got a sense of phoniness. They just seemed like characters and it just annoyed me.

PS - When I was on the L to Lorimer, there were some loud hood rat chicks on the train and they were annoying too but they were authentic in their behavior where as the hipsters just seem so contrived.

[JaasNYC]

PPS - And from experiences I've had with them, there not as kumbaya of a group as they portray themselves to be.

[Reverend TV]

Originally Posted by aninaction

anyone know a city that lacks hipsters?

The Bible Belt. They aren't big on self important street mimes.

[CazzaM]

From UrbanDictionary.com:
"Hipsters are a subculture of men and women typically in their 20's and 30's that value independent thinking, counter-culture, progressive politics, an appreciation of art and indie-rock, creativity, intelligence, and witty banter..."

Please refer to Urban Dictionary for the full text.

[Mekitor]

Madonna was a Hipster back in the day. And countless of other artists and actors.

[sxr71]

Originally Posted by 71196

Everyone's giving great advice. It does sound as if I'm in for a huge culture shock and I do think I'm pretty naive, too. A lot of things I hear about the 'hood in NY are so far outside my normal experiences that I'm not sure I fully understand what I would need to do to be safe there. We have an inner city here too of course, with some rough areas, but NY doesn't sound anything like any of the neighborhoods here in Cleveland. I've applied for jobs in the Bronx too... Comparing Bed-Stuy to places in the South Bronx, which would be a more desirable area to live? The real problem is that I don't have much money, so I need to live somewhere very, very cheap. I think most of the areas that bmw mentioned are a little more expensive. I can't rent my own apartment regardless of neighborhood, so I'm planning on renting a room in someone's house or finding roomates. The most I could pay would be maybe $600 a month but that would be reaching...

I don't know about that, I have my memories of East Cleveland. I somehow doubt Bed Stuy is less safe that East Cleveland was, but there are issues in NY that potentially could make your difficult.