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Old 11-06-2009, 06:46 AM
 
943 posts, read 3,716,049 times
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My friends and I had a recent argument on the two and being a Harlem resident naturally makes me bias. Aside from the gentrification, is there a parallel between the two. What makes each neighborhood unique, better/worse than the other. Which neighborhood has more upsode at this point. The economy has exposed a lot of neighborhoods and has changed the perception of some neighborhoods. Anyway just looking for opinions. I am not looking to purchase a home in either place or looking for a answer related toward anthing, just want unbiased opions, if possible.
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Old 11-06-2009, 09:36 AM
 
Location: Out of this world
277 posts, read 1,284,918 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ogplife View Post
My friends and I had a recent argument on the two and being a Harlem resident naturally makes me bias. Aside from the gentrification, is there a parallel between the two. What makes each neighborhood unique, better/worse than the other. Which neighborhood has more upsode at this point. The economy has exposed a lot of neighborhoods and has changed the perception of some neighborhoods. Anyway just looking for opinions. I am not looking to purchase a home in either place or looking for a answer related toward anthing, just want unbiased opions, if possible.
I believe Harlem and BedStuy have a lot in common. For example, they both have wonderful brownstones They are both in close proximity when traveling to downtown or midtown Manhattan for work (Harlem is closer though). Harlem's gentrification is moving much faster than BedStuy, although I'm not sure why. The cost of the brownstones are almost twice as much in Harlem as opposed to BedStuy. So, maybe someone can get a deal when investing long term Lastly, when it comes to New York black history Harlem is the winner. During the 1920's and 30's was the Harlem Renaissance. It brought lots of talented and creative artist, musicians, writers and dancers. BedStuy don't have that
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Old 11-07-2009, 02:11 PM
 
2 posts, read 7,760 times
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Default Bed Stuy is re -creating Harlem renaissance of the early 1989-90 era

Bed Stuy is re -creating Harlem renaissance of the early 9989-90 era I Lived in Harlem 89- 90 when the big boxes were not in yet, recession in full bloom, and the European entrepreneurs and adventurous Buppies/Yuppies started renting/buying .( When the NYT articles appear the gentrification is almost complete ) Then Harlem had a Nice Mix of artists and free lancing was the only way to make $$. Unfortunately drugs still paid subsistence rent or retirement funds on houses paid for (finally) were the only real estate So no real $ floating around all of a sudden though it popped. HOW? (When the retirees died without enough $ to be buried the local church would bury the retiree's deed/morgage for exchange of the title to the house/brownstone and when it was time to flip brownstones the Harlem Churches became the biggest players...selling out some would say...) Anyway during the Harlem gentrification of 90-91 I was the only one on my block with a real job. It was not too bad: People were friendly/ cops were starting to appear on the corners, drug spots beginning to dry up.... as a result some momentum but not the kind where the process got impossible . Then in less than a year I started noticing mixed couples, and Europeans buying not renting - these are are first signs of escalating gentrification i.e. as are DINKs (double income no kids professionals including lesbians and gays and cohabitating unrelated well paid freelancers etc) AND that's what is happening right now in Bed-Stuy 2009 Fall. I suggest you read the New York Times articles mentioned here, Then do the math !!! in 2001-2005 the gentrification was in the Big Box stage and if you subtract the recession year 1990 -2001 it took @ 10 years before Harlem became less interesting and basically Unaffordable. So Bed Stuy is the last Harlem- like Harlem since it too was founded by freedmen and ex slaves living below Fulton (see Weeksville in wikipedia) These blacks saved their money and moved in after the Depression forced whites to lose these brownstones and white flight in the 70s completed the cycle - but the descendants of freed blacks stayed on the hill which is Stuy Heights /Bed Stuy and managed to hang on thru thick and thin till about now. Why do I say that? I moved to the Bed Stuy historic section in fall 09 and on either side of me are the retirees who have just enough money to hang on scattered in between the nicer brownstones are the familes who are a multi generational group doing anything to keep the lights on ( Mom / Dad knows about the drug dealing and the social security money goes toward the morgage too...), and if I made them an offer tommorrow- they would move out.- its too much for them to hang on anymore - the utilities are also killing them. You can walk around and name the blocks with the cops on them 24-7 . That is another sign of making the neighboorhood ready to pop.... I know them all and I know they are there because there are just enough priced out ex Williamsburgers and Midwesterners like me to make a difference- The Foodtown is carrying organic, there are cafes with wifi and my mojo knows that by walking around and making a list of abandoned looking houses .....If you have a real estate buddy figure out exactly which ones are going to the auction block for back taxes . water liens, as well as foreclosures..... Bed Stuy - it reminds me of Detroit, with better transportation - see Canfiled Block Indian Village in Detroit - 2 historic enclaves which are gentrified and are still hanging in there despite everything you have heard about how Detroit is dying.... So in summary I know when a neighboorhood is dying and when its going to pop - especially if it is a traditionally "Black " neighborhood that was not always Black when it first got built. I moved in because its cool and cheap yet I can blend in and take notes.That should give you some clue to my ethnicity...Unfortunately am still a renter and I can not scare up the 175K I need in cash to scoop up something before it is too late. Maybe you can.Remember you will need another 175K to restore a typical brownstone to its former glory- right down to the Aubusson rug on the highly polished parquet floor. Expect to redo the heating, electric , plumbinjg. roof, basement, floors, roof, kitchen etc. ) As a vanguard renter , I make do by furnishing my apt as If I purchased it- (got the look but pay rent instead) . If I come into $$$ I a m making my owner an offer - I am not crazy!!!! Bed- Stuy vs Harlem - It is Bed- Stuy---do move in now This time the gentrification will last 5 years if the recession is over as of Jan 2010 .... You should be noting that the NYTimes just did an article on this area- August 23 2009 (History with Hipper retailing and fewer hazards) You better move quickly... but if the recession holds or gets deeper maybe you have some time before its gets too cool and you are priced out again.But Harlem has gone thru the cycle as has Gort Green and its is done, maybv only East NY - Brownsville is left... and theose areas were full of European immigrants back in the WW2 days... and could change again. Eventually we will run out of space anyway and you will have to do rthe edgy thing in Alberquerque ( condos in the new downtown are only 349K and rent around U NM is only topping 1200. The barrio/off reservation central city Alberquerque rent is about 500 dollars- 800 a month tops. Go there with the right job that lets you be creative and you will be living like some hipster ex actor from L.A.)or buy the condo and live like a tired of it all needed a change New Yorker...

Harlem Gentrification articles
Luring Fashionistas Uptown
By PENELOPE GREEN NYTimes Sept 4 2005 and If you are thinking of living in West Harlem By Maggie Garb NYTimes Feb 25 1001

Last edited by Viralmd; 11-08-2009 at 03:08 PM.. Reason: This is illegible. It would be easier to read if you put in paragraphs.
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Old 11-09-2009, 09:42 AM
 
46 posts, read 148,582 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by margothefoodie View Post
Bed Stuy is re -creating Harlem renaissance of the early 9989-90 era I Lived in Harlem 89- 90 when the big boxes were not in yet, recession in full bloom, and the European entrepreneurs and adventurous Buppies/Yuppies started renting/buying .( When the NYT articles appear the gentrification is almost complete ) Then Harlem had a Nice Mix of artists and free lancing was the only way to make $$. Unfortunately drugs still paid subsistence rent or retirement funds on houses paid for (finally) were the only real estate So no real $ floating around all of a sudden though it popped. HOW? (When the retirees died without enough $ to be buried the local church would bury the retiree's deed/morgage for exchange of the title to the house/brownstone and when it was time to flip brownstones the Harlem Churches became the biggest players...selling out some would say...) Anyway during the Harlem gentrification of 90-91 I was the only one on my block with a real job. It was not too bad: People were friendly/ cops were starting to appear on the corners, drug spots beginning to dry up.... as a result some momentum but not the kind where the process got impossible . [...snip]
Please use punctuation and paragraphs. Would love to understand what you are writing, but it's basically impossible...
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Old 11-09-2009, 11:25 AM
 
Location: Confines of the 101 Precinct
19,136 posts, read 32,666,756 times
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harlem has the clear advantage because its on manhattan island. other than that, i think the 2 neighborhoods are similar in terms of history, evolution, demographics, etc...
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Old 11-09-2009, 06:51 PM
 
Location: Houston, TX
1,141 posts, read 2,783,325 times
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Both areas do have a lot of similarities. However to me though Harlem is much more livelier and fast-paced than Bed-Stuy...you can't beat the hustle & bustle vibe on 125th St -- Lenox Ave - St. Nich...whether it's the people on megaphones hollerin about religion...street lectures on Black History...the aggressive sellers of all thing counterfeit lol. Bed-Stuy from my observation though seems more family-oriented/community-based. I notice more grassroots black organization activity in Bed-Stuy than in Harlem (although some may defintely disagree with this). Overall though both neighborhoods are undeniably the centers for Black culture in NYC.
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Old 11-10-2009, 12:28 AM
 
Location: Medina (Brooklyn), NY
656 posts, read 1,430,041 times
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Well bottom line in regards to the displacement (or gentrification as Europeans call it) that the Moorish (so called Black/African American/Hispanic/Latino/Native American) American population in these neighborhoods don't own the property (being that when you use false labels such as Black, Negro, Colored, Afro/African American, West Indian, Native American, Indian, Hispanic and Latino that don't exist and are outside of law and the human family you cannot legally own property). Therefore, other nations (groups of people) can come into your neighborhood and remove you anytime they get ready and you don't have the legal, moral or financial grounds upon which to protect your land (real estate).

But I'm sure most of the brothers in this thread aren't ready to deal with what's REALLY going on as usual this information is WAY over most of people's head and requires you to think outside the box (put your thinking caps on so to speak). We'll just continue to blame it on "racism" and then go march and sing we shall over come with good ol Rev. Al and the gang.
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Old 11-10-2009, 03:44 PM
YBF
 
Location: Atlanta, Ga
1,260 posts, read 2,921,912 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dbatiste View Post
Harlem's gentrification is moving much faster than BedStuy, although I'm not sure why.
Bill Clinton moving in didnt help.
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Old 11-10-2009, 03:47 PM
YBF
 
Location: Atlanta, Ga
1,260 posts, read 2,921,912 times
Reputation: 578
Quote:
Originally Posted by ogplife View Post
My friends and I had a recent argument on the two and being a Harlem resident naturally makes me bias. Aside from the gentrification, is there a parallel between the two. What makes each neighborhood unique, better/worse than the other. Which neighborhood has more upsode at this point. The economy has exposed a lot of neighborhoods and has changed the perception of some neighborhoods. Anyway just looking for opinions. I am not looking to purchase a home in either place or looking for a answer related toward anthing, just want unbiased opions, if possible.
When it comes to Black history Harlem wins. Its that about Harlem that the Stuy cant compete with. But I have always had a soft spot for Bedstuy....I mean like always. For me Manhattan is too busy and Brooklyn is just right. So IMO Id say Brooklyn is better.
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Old 11-10-2009, 06:32 PM
 
Location: Houston, TX
1,141 posts, read 2,783,325 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YBF View Post
Bill Clinton moving in didnt help.
Has Bill Clinton ever even been in that office on 125th St???
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