Chinese in Flushing are such FOBs that their neighbors resorts to learning Mandarin (New York: lawyers, living)

[page3000]

Originally Posted by bx718

I wonder if all the americans who go to cancun for spring break speak spanish!

That's for a vacation...NOT TO LIVE lol. We aren't establishing businesses down there and refusing to learn spanish while expecting them to learn english.

[Green Irish Eyes]

Originally Posted by page3000

That's for a vacation...NOT TO LIVE lol. We aren't establishing businesses down there and refusing to learn spanish while expecting them to learn english.

^^ What you said ^^

[lxl]

Originally Posted by page3000

That's for a vacation...NOT TO LIVE lol. We aren't establishing businesses down there and refusing to learn spanish while expecting them to learn english.

Not entirely true -
New expatriate American resorts in Mexico - Feb. 14, 2006
Panama is paradise for retirees - MSN Money

There are actually a lot of Americans now moved South of the border to live in all inclusive communities. What's one of the biggest selling point of those communities? You don't have to speak Spanish to survive.

[Green Irish Eyes]

Originally Posted by lxl

Not entirely true -
New expatriate American resorts in Mexico - Feb. 14, 2006
Panama is paradise for retirees - MSN Money

Neither of the articles you quoted discusses whether the ex-pat Americans learn Spanish or not.

Originally Posted by lxl

There are actually a lot of Americans now moved South of the border to live in all inclusive communities. What's one of the biggest selling point of those communities? You don't have to speak Spanish to survive.

Not to beat a dead horse, but moving to New York City is not the same as moving to an "all-inclusive community."

[page3000]

I agree squeezebox. Thank GOD someone said it.
Also..I am from San Diego, Cali...so believe me..I know what's "poppin" in Mexico. Very FEW people want to move down there. An article on a handful of people moving down there still makes no point against the fact that we have a problem with people coming to this country and expecting us to learn their language. Who the hell do they think they are? Seriously. It's enough that they can sign up for food stamps and wick..but they can also sign up for those free ESL classes while they are at it.

[lxl]

First of all, I don't think there are people coming into this country and expect you to learn their language nowadays. In the bad old days, certainly, but I don't want to go back that far.

Anyway, if you learn a foreign language, it is your gain. If they don't learn English, it is their lose. What's the problem here? Should we expel them because they don't pass an English exam after a certain years of living in America? If so, how do we set the time limits? By age? By level of education? How do you know they won't learn in the future when their conditions are better suited for further learning? What about the rest of the population? Do we give them English exam and expel them if they fail as well?

America is not the only country where multiple languages are spoken. Travel around a bit and enjoy what humanity had to offer. Whose language is it anyway? Think.

[lxl]

Originally Posted by squeezeboxgal

Not to beat a dead horse, but moving to New York City is not the same as moving to an "all-inclusive community."

Yeah, we have more romantic names like Chinatown, Little Italy, etc..

[NooYowkur81]

Originally Posted by lxl

First of all, I don't think there are people coming into this country and expect you to learn their language nowadays. In the bad old days, certainly, but I don't want to go back that far.

Anyway, if you learn a foreign language, it is your gain. If they don't learn English, it is their lose. What's the problem here? Should we expel them because they don't pass an English exam after a certain years of living in America? If so, how do we set the time limits? By age? By level of education? How do you know they won't learn in the future when their conditions are better suited for further learning? What about the rest of the population? Do we give them English exam and expel them if they fail as well?

America is not the only country where multiple languages are spoken. Travel around a bit and enjoy what humanity had to offer. Whose language is it anyway? Think.

Yeah its definitely a loss. People who fail to learn English limit themselves of a lot of opportunities and limit the places they can move about in this country. In the end they hurt themselves more than anything by not learning English.

On the other hand people often have this romanticized notion of a lot of first generation Euro immigrants. The truth is a lot of them didn't learn English either.

[page3000]

Originally Posted by lxl

First of all, I don't think there are people coming into this country and expect you to learn their language nowadays. In the bad old days, certainly, but I don't want to go back that far.

Anyway, if you learn a foreign language, it is your gain. If they don't learn English, it is their lose. What's the problem here? Should we expel them because they don't pass an English exam after a certain years of living in America? If so, how do we set the time limits? By age? By level of education? How do you know they won't learn in the future when their conditions are better suited for further learning? What about the rest of the population? Do we give them English exam and expel them if they fail as well?

America is not the only country where multiple languages are spoken. Travel around a bit and enjoy what humanity had to offer. Whose language is it anyway? Think.

NO! We definitely shouldn't harm those that don't speak english. That was a silly assumption. BUT...if you can't speak or read english...do you think it's safe to be driving on a freeway where the signs are in english? If you don't comprehend the language of our country...how can you go to school...or even college at that? And unless you're working somewhere that you don't have to interact with common citizens..how could you possibly communicate with the rest of us...since we speak english and you don't? <I'm not saying that PERSONALLY to you..But my point is.....you can't really function at full capacity without learning the language of our country. In the end, it doesn't necessarily hurt anyone..just them.
I will not learn mandarin..spanish...faarsi <whatever it's called...ever unless it's something I gain an interest in. Why? Because it's not a requirement for me or anyone else.

[holden125]

Originally Posted by NooYowkur81

On the other hand people often have this romanticized notion of a lot of first generation Euro immigrants. The truth is a lot of them didn't learn English either.

Absolutely. I have heard of many a Euro immigrant from the old days who didn't learn much English over many decades. A lot of people who came from Italy wanted to make some money and go back; many did. The thing is, when did you ever hear of that lasting into future generations? With the kids born here, the bigger problem is that they will speak only English and won't have much mastery of their family's language.

I have a number of friends with parents from other countries, and what I find most striking is how the kids, mostly highly educated and hearing that language from a parent who was a native speaker since birth, are so-so in the other language. This is true of friends whose parents speak French, Spanish, German, Italian, Cantonese, Russian, Greek, Arabic, etc.

I have lived abroad at a couple of points and two things are clear: (1) unless you have a niche business (like a Chinese restaurant) or you slip into a dense community of people who speak your language, your opportunities will be limited not speaking the predominant language; (2) it is REALLY HARD to come to a new place and pick up a new language as an adult, especially if you don't have a ton of schooling to begin with and were not exposed to it as a kid. Most English speakers I encountered abroad all but stopped trying.

Honestly, people here who can't speak English doesn't bother half as much as native-born Americans' general total ignorance of any other languages. We are going to start falling seriously behind if we don't start making more of an effort. The inability to even order dinner in another language when we are traveling abroad also plays no small part in our unpopularity around the world. If you travel outside the US, it is very clear that English is hardly an endangered language in the world.

I have driven on highways in Germany and Italy; my knowledge of those languages is very rudimentary. There are a few words (usally with pictures) that tend to be on road signs, it's easy to become familiar with those. It is much harder to have a conversation in the language. Especially with your typical NY'er. We speak fast, use slang, some have accents, etc. When I was learning languages I found that I could understand a formal anchor's voice on the news, but it was much more difficult to understand normal people on the streets.

People are also correct that, legally, the US has no official language.