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The problem with a bottling plant upstate as for many industries is not the resources or the people but the cost to ship your goods. New York's excessive gas taxes combined with the roadway tolls makes manufacturing elsewhere far more cost efficient.
The tolls may be negated by location along I-81, I-86 or I-88 in parts of Upstate. So, it would have to be strategic in terms of location, if tolls are an issue.
Also, sometimes other available resources may be more valuable.
The problem with a bottling plant upstate as for many industries is not the resources or the people but the cost to ship your goods. New York's excessive gas taxes combined with the roadway tolls makes manufacturing elsewhere far more cost efficient.
Trains and boats?
Moreover, I think it's that New York shouldn't be competing for bargain basement prices and it's not a complete killer as Chobani has shown. It's the efficiency of having a major metropolitan area close by, several actually, and natural resources. I think a PepsiCo bottling plant that's also meant to be an experimental and configurable unit makes a lot of sense in that respect.
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Trains and Boats? This isn't the turn of the 20th century especially for consumer goods such as the example of soda. Be realistic any company who is into manufacturing is going to look at the cost to produce their goods and ship them, where does NY rank on those lists?
Chobani has been great but has run into problems where the dairy herds can not provide enough milk to meet the demand, they are further hobbled from expanding their Dairy Farms by New York's draconian laws in regards to herd side/effluent/environmental concerns. As such Chobani has had to go out of state for additional milk sources how long before they need to build a plant in another state because NY cannot provide what they need?
As suggested using other state routes is not a solution as posters are stating NYC is a primary market to tap. Avoiding the Thruway means taking 81 south into PA then head east back to NYC a bit round about. All will then have to pay a toll of $60+ for a truck although I will admit any truck heading into NYC will get stuck with the toll.
Trains and Boats? This isn't the turn of the 20th century especially for consumer goods such as the example of soda. Be realistic any company who is into manufacturing is going to look at the cost to produce their goods and ship them, where does NY rank on those lists?
Chobani has been great but has run into problems where the dairy herds can not provide enough milk to meet the demand, they are further hobbled from expanding their Dairy Farms by New York's draconian laws in regards to herd side/effluent/environmental concerns. As such Chobani has had to go out of state for additional milk sources how long before they need to build a plant in another state because NY cannot provide what they need?
As suggested using other state routes is not a solution as posters are stating NYC is a primary market to tap. Avoiding the Thruway means taking 81 south into PA then head east back to NYC a bit round about. All will then have to pay a toll of $60+ for a truck although I will admit any truck heading into NYC will get stuck with the toll.
They already have a facility in Idaho.
As for taking I-81, it is actually common for people in say the Syracuse area to take I-81 to get to NYC, as there are no tolls and it is actually a faster route versus taking the Thruway.
Trains and Boats? This isn't the turn of the 20th century especially for consumer goods such as the example of soda. Be realistic any company who is into manufacturing is going to look at the cost to produce their goods and ship them, where does NY rank on those lists?
Chobani has been great but has run into problems where the dairy herds can not provide enough milk to meet the demand, they are further hobbled from expanding their Dairy Farms by New York's draconian laws in regards to herd side/effluent/environmental concerns. As such Chobani has had to go out of state for additional milk sources how long before they need to build a plant in another state because NY cannot provide what they need?
As suggested using other state routes is not a solution as posters are stating NYC is a primary market to tap. Avoiding the Thruway means taking 81 south into PA then head east back to NYC a bit round about. All will then have to pay a toll of $60+ for a truck although I will admit any truck heading into NYC will get stuck with the toll.
I was being facetious, but trains and boats actually are still heavily used to ship consumer goods and in a lot of ways more efficient than truck though rail infrastructure has suffered from relative disinvestment. I just don't know if the Hudson River north of NYC really has decent ports for container shipping. Actually, given the slow moving, estuarial nature of the Hudson River and that it's decently navigable, is there commercial port shipping on it (supposedly quite a bit)? It'd make sense if there was actually a substantial and regular amount of commodities being shipped. I think there is a great point to be made in that freight railroads into the NYC region need better infrastructure. The last mile is truck, but that's still far less of an issue than long haul trucks navigating the congested NYC streets. Like getting Metro-North and potentially Amtrak to carry passengers over to the west side of the Hudson, there needs to be investment in infrastructure for carrying freight as well including rail and boat.
The Chobani plant upstate has expanded pretty often--the massive Idaho plant is also a result of it being a substantially larger expanse of cattle country. How was New York going to supply that much dairy given how rapidly the company grew? It's not like Coca-Cola keeps all its bottling in Georgia.
Last edited by OyCrumbler; 06-26-2017 at 04:28 PM..
You can ship from the port of Albany, from where coal is shipped. But for goods further up West, it becomes challenging and it will cost a lot to revive the Erie Canal. It will be difficult to create production jobs in the upstate regions that need it the most. They make good places to buy weekend homes for big city people with money, though.
You can ship from the port of Albany, from where coal is shipped. But for goods further up West, it becomes challenging and it will cost a lot to revive the Erie Canal. It will be difficult to create production jobs in the upstate regions that need it the most. They make good places to buy weekend homes for big city people with money, though.
The tolls may be negated by location along I-81, I-86 or I-88 in parts of Upstate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod
The Erie Canal still exists:
Ironic that the Erie Canal is the reason why we still have tolls on the NYS Thruway. If not for the Thruway Authority taking over the Canal Authority in 1992, Thruway tolls would have been abolished in 1996 when the bond issue was paid off (as originally promised).
Of course, now that a court ruling struck that down, seems the NY Power Authority will start paying for the Canal - so everyone gets to fund it through higher electric costs.
And the Thruway will continue to have rate hikes. Gotta love NY - they get you coming and going.
Ironic that the Erie Canal is the reason why we still have tolls on the NYS Thruway. If not for the Thruway Authority taking over the Canal Authority in 1992, Thruway tolls would have been abolished in 1996 when the bond issue was paid off (as originally promised).
Of course, now that a court ruling struck that down, seems the NY Power Authority will start paying for the Canal - so everyone gets to fund it through higher electric costs.
And the Thruway will continue to have rate hikes. Gotta love NY - they get you coming and going.
What is also interesting is that municipalities and rural based co-ops that get their electricity through NYPA tend to have lower electric/power rates, but in some cases may have higher property taxes to offset that to some degree. Customers
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod
They already have a facility in Idaho.
As for taking I-81, it is actually common for people in say the Syracuse area to take I-81 to get to NYC, as there are no tolls and it is actually a faster route versus taking the Thruway.
You missed the point on the factory, I didn't believe that the NY plant was the only one for the country I was implying that NY could lose expansion opportunities because an adjoining state could better serve the companies needs.
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