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Old 01-31-2011, 11:49 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thelazyone View Post
Reminds me of the conversation I had with my mom the other night. She doesn't understand why I moved out of Brooklyn. I said "Mom unfortunately you have no idea how overinflated goods are in the NYC metro area." I have friends who own houses in PA and don't pay anything close to what I pay for my house in the hudson valley and have equal services and decent schools.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
You could say the same thing for Upstate NY as well.
Except that upstate NY gets spillover from NYC's bad policies. The gas taxes in upstate NY are similar to what you would find out west.

Gas prices edge lower around Syracuse; diesel rises | syracuse.com

That's a good 30 cents more per gallon than what you'll find in central FL. You also pay higher sales taxes compared to much of the rest of the country (like NYC), and suffer from high property taxes.

NY and NJ residents suffer some of the highest tax burdens in the country: http://www.taxfoundation.org/news/show/23451.html
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Old 01-31-2011, 12:40 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopchop0 View Post
Except that upstate NY gets spillover from NYC's bad policies. The gas taxes in upstate NY are similar to what you would find out west.

Gas prices edge lower around Syracuse; diesel rises | syracuse.com

That's a good 30 cents more per gallon than what you'll find in central FL. You also pay higher sales taxes compared to much of the rest of the country (like NYC), and suffer from high property taxes.

NY and NJ residents suffer some of the highest tax burdens in the country: The Tax Foundation - New Jersey Edges out New York for Nation's Highest State-Local Tax Burden
Again, taxes are only one aspects of costs and most Upstate NY metros are still on par with Southern metros in terms of overall cost of living, if not lower. What is key is that tax rates for businesses need to be worked out in NY and the Northeast.
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Old 01-31-2011, 12:51 PM
 
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Here's some more interesting information: Local and State Tax Burden Maps | Newgeography.com

The Tax Tale: 50-state comparison - JSOnline

Kiplinger.com

Southern States Have Highest Percentages of Non-Paying Tax Filers | taxgirl

Taxes by State
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Old 01-31-2011, 01:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
Yep. NY is the top competitor for most-taxing state.

And from your other link - http://www.newgeography.com/content/...ax-burden-maps




New York is one of a handful of states with the highest tax burdens as a percentage of personal income. Upstate NY unfortunately gets lumped in with that, having to deal with high property, sales, and income taxes.
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Old 01-31-2011, 03:36 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopchop0 View Post
Yep. NY is the top competitor for most-taxing state.

And from your other link - Local and State Tax Burden Maps | Newgeography.com




New York is one of a handful of states with the highest tax burdens as a percentage of personal income. Upstate NY unfortunately gets lumped in with that, having to deal with high property, sales, and income taxes.
NY still has higher average incomes than most and many other states have higher percentages of non-taxpayers. Taxes are just pne piece of the pie and imagine if taxes were cut in NY? We would complain about growth and perhaps sprawl.
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Old 01-31-2011, 03:57 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
NY still has higher average incomes than most and many other states have higher percentages of non-taxpayers. Taxes are just pne piece of the pie and imagine if taxes were cut in NY? We would complain about growth and perhaps sprawl.
Heaven forbid you have growth and job creation. It's better to keep upstate true to its rust belt ways, right?

I'm sure plenty of laid off workers from companies like Carrier corp, Syracuse China, Crucible, New Process Gear would love to have some "growth" in manufacturing like their neighbors in the south have.
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Old 01-31-2011, 04:19 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopchop0 View Post
Heaven forbid you have growth and job creation. It's better to keep upstate true to its rust belt ways, right?

I'm sure plenty of laid off workers from companies like Carrier corp, Syracuse China, Crucible, New Process Gear would love to have some "growth" in manufacturing like their neighbors in the south have.
If only manufacturing wasn't leaving the country, let alone NY. It's time to look into other industries, more education, build off of growing industries like engineering and use the many colleges to the state's benefit, among other things. My statement about growth is about how people will complain about something. It is ironic that someone in FL is talking about jobs and growth considering the unemployment rate and that state showing a net population loss in the last couple of years.
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Old 01-31-2011, 04:45 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
It is ironic that someone in FL is talking about jobs and growth considering the unemployment rate and that state showing a net population loss in the last couple of years.
Net population loss? That's funny coming from someone who lives in upstate NY, a place that's been losing people for decades, especially younger people.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/13/ny.../13census.html

Remember the recent censush gave FL additional seats in the House and took seats away from NY, so that now both states have an equal number of seats.

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion...Ts1rXfXboge1eN

Besides, why are you trying to focus this on FL, instead of addressing NY's problems or the issue of this thread, which is NY's high property taxes? Sounds like someone is being a little defensive to me. The fact remains that upstate NY is the epitome of the rust belt era, having lost manufacturing jobs for decades to the south and overseas because of NYS's bad business decisions and high taxes.
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Old 01-31-2011, 05:53 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopchop0 View Post
Net population loss? That's funny coming from someone who lives in upstate NY, a place that's been losing people for decades, especially younger people.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/13/ny.../13census.html

Remember the recent censush gave FL additional seats in the House and took seats away from NY, so that now both states have an equal number of seats.

New York's tax-fueled population loss--Editorial - NYPOST.com

Besides, why are you trying to focus this on FL, instead of addressing NY's problems or the issue of this thread, which is NY's high property taxes? Sounds like someone is being a little defensive to me. The fact remains that upstate NY is the epitome of the rust belt era, having lost manufacturing jobs for decades to the south and overseas because of NYS's bad business decisions and high taxes.
No one is being defensive, but even with the taxes, the cost of living os still lower than much of the country in Upstate NY. Florida gained seats based off of its pre recession growth. Things have changed the last couple of years and parts of Upstate have always had growth. So, even that varies by the county.
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Old 01-31-2011, 06:00 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
No one is being defensive, but even with the taxes, the cost of living os still lower than much of the country in Upstate NY. Florida gained seats based off of its pre recession growth. Things have changed the last couple of years and parts of Upstate have always had growth. So, even that varies by the county.
Um, the census was done in 2010, not 2005

And, the largest MSAs in upstate have all shown continued population loss, including the Buffalo, Rochester, and Syracuse MSAs from 2000-2010.

Some growth in places like Albany and Ithaca is not enough to counteract the general trend of a shrinking population upstate.

Getting back to this thread, things like high property taxes, sales taxes, and corporate taxes keep people and companies away, and make current companies in NY consider moving their operations elsewhere. High property taxes also hit people on fixed incomes like retirees, especially when assessments are done infrequently.

Just look at what happened in syracuse recently:

Syracuse shocks property owners with 10 to 50 percent assessment hikes | syracuse.com
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