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40 degrees North!!!!! Never go below that line that lies just North of the Southern boundary of Pennsylvannia. This has been my general rule and many, many people I know who have moved South of moved South and came back North tell me that my "stay North of the 40th parallel" makes total sense and they wish they would have followed my 'rule'. I can't explain it, but whenever I go below that line, no matter what part of the county I'm in (East Coast, West Coast, Midwest)...something feels amiss and it is more pronounced once you cross the Mississippi River. Its the whole spectrum, culture, natural environment, politics and I enjoy the four seasons.
I've lived in 3 places: The Northeast (Philly), the Midwest, and the South. I can honestly say I prefer the 3rd. The Philadelphia area used to have cheaper housing prices and a better quality of life but I think the New York and New England pricing scheme made its way down there. Philadelphia was pretty fast paced and was never really friendly. The job competition up there is pretty bad and I wouldn't have had as good opportunities had I stayed. Then we move on to the Midwest. THE most boring place I have ever lived. I lived in the Chicago area which could have been a mini metro New York. Other than the city there was no kind of outdoors, no other cities to go to, and the weather was brutally cold even by Northeast standards. The job opportunities were a little better but than again a bit lacking. Then I moved to the South.
The South isn't perfect and sometimes I miss home but I've been able to have a ridiculously good quality of life here and I love all the Southern food and outdoor trips I'm able to take on the weekends. Are there great things about living in a place like Manhattan? Yeah, but the bar is SO high for jobs and the work culture a little bit too intense. People who scoff about living in the South should come check it out. Birmingham needs quite a bit of work to do but is generally a nice place to live. For in city living I would love to live in Atlanta particularly in Buckhead or Midtown.
Don't move south of 40 north? No I think this does young people a big injustice. The South is the new North of long ago. I know a lot of folks from the North who moved down for jobs. You go where there's opportunity and along the way you just may enjoy it. Personally I think it's a riot when I tell friends I used to know from home that I'm now living in Alabama. Alabama?!? (Gasp) There's still a lot of misinformed people out there.
The South isn't perfect and sometimes I miss home but I've been able to have a ridiculously good quality of life here and I love all the Southern food and outdoor trips I'm able to take on the weekends. Are there great things about living in a place like Manhattan? Yeah, but the bar is SO high for jobs and the work culture a little bit too intense. People who scoff about living in the South should come check it out. Birmingham needs quite a bit of work to do but is generally a nice place to live. For in city living I would love to live in Atlanta particularly in Buckhead or Midtown.
Would you mind compare and contrasting work cultures in the various places you have lived?
I have this notion (don't know if it's accurate), that the work culture in NY is more demanding, demands greater skills for lesser jobs, works you harder etc.
But I don't have any basis for that. It's just a feeling.
Wow, I am not alone.
I am a native New Yorker and I live in sleepy Raleighwood.
I live "itb" (inside the beltline), if it weren't for that I would be miserable.
I have honestly met like 2 people that were native North Carolinians and the others were all fellow Yankees. I am finishing at NC State next year and then it is back up north for me. There are way too many rednecks and way too much real tree for this northerner!
I rarely leave downtown Raleigh b/c I have no idea what could happen to me in some little town like Benson or Garner...
Well, good luck 2 u Yankees deep in the heart of the dixie!
Let me get this Right, You have met only two Natives and you are heading back north because of all the real tree wearing rednecks. Are these all your fellow Northerners you refer to here, since we natives are a myth and you have not seen any of us or is it the camo that has you confused and fooled because we blend in with the realtree to hunt racoons and possum for dinner.
Would you mind compare and contrasting work cultures in the various places you have lived?
I have this notion (don't know if it's accurate), that the work culture in NY is more demanding, demands greater skills for lesser jobs, works you harder etc.
But I don't have any basis for that. It's just a feeling.
Its human nature that in a highly desirable and competitive market, an employer can get away with working you harder, demanding greater skills for lesser jobs, and throwing you to the wolves so to speak. In New York, particularly in the legal market (where I have some experience) you have people at tier 2 or 3 schools that have to accept small firm jobs with ludicrously low wages by New York standards and even people from really good schools because it is very competitive to get a job. Many people work in New York on jobs where their parents pay their rent to get a foot in the door or positions that are non paying like production with a Television or entertainment show. People work long hours and have long commutes in the New York metro area. High paying jobs are demanding because they are high paying and because if you don't want to do the work, you are easily replaceable.
In the Midwest/Chicago area, it is a little bit easier to live and work than in New York or the Northeast. However, the legal market anywhere in my opinion sucks and there are plenty of bitter Loyola and DePaul grads who aren't getting decent Chicago firm jobs. Some people do work a lot - what else are you going to do in the bleak winter there lol. Some Midwestern people are kind of rigid, rules oriented, and formal. I've also found Midwestern people to be kind of boring as well. The Midwest is a mixed bag. The job market there is not as good as elsewhere. Avoid Michigan, Wisconsin and Northern Ohio. Other areas are again a mixed bag.
In the South, there is a greater emphasis on quality of life. Not to say that people don't have some difficult jobs there, but people are in general more friendly and like to talk about family, sports, and plans for the weekend. The legal market again sucks hence the proposition that I will probably change career directions. Many families are able to afford big box development houses and to eat at the Cheesecake Factory to their hearts content. There is also a lot of good country options here and a more traditional lifestyle if you want it too - but I won't be able to enjoy either struggling for a 50k/year job with tons of debt like many new lawyers do. Many jobs are moving South too so its a good place to look.
Its human nature that in a highly desirable and competitive market, an employer can get away with working you harder, demanding greater skills for lesser jobs, and throwing you to the wolves so to speak. In New York, particularly in the legal market (where I have some experience) you have people at tier 2 or 3 schools that have to accept small firm jobs with ludicrously low wages by New York standards and even people from really good schools because it is very competitive to get a job. Many people work in New York on jobs where their parents pay their rent to get a foot in the door or positions that are non paying like production with a Television or entertainment show. People work long hours and have long commutes in the New York metro area. High paying jobs are demanding because they are high paying and because if you don't want to do the work, you are easily replaceable.
I have worked in legal and financial services. (THEY BOTH SUCK in turns of work/life balance.) I currently work in labor now so I'm getting under paid by $20K or more. (based on the stats on Salary.com). But I do have decent work life balance, if it weren't for the non-standard hours I work (only slightly non-standard) or the long commutes.
I had/have other reasons for keeping that job. With one year to go before pension legibility, it would be stupid for me to leave now.
I have already made my plans to move out West, to Denver.
bcdiaz, you must be from NYC because I am from upstate NY and there are just as many gun racks, camo wearing people up there as there are down here. Nothing like giving the North a bad name and stereotyping people that enjoy the outdoors. I've hunted up North and I hunt down here. I have a truck, 4 wheeler and live in Fuquay. I must be a redneck also or as we would say up North, a woodchuck! Sorry you're so scared to leave ITB and see what NC really has to offer.
Take a look at Richmond VA before heading so far north. Lots of Yankees in the Capital of the Confederacy.
You got that right. Va can be the happy medium for Northerners. The state has a history of combining both cultures, especially on the East Coast, or the larger cities, and DC area.
I found in Georgia, I don't like the Deep South, Virginia may be Southern to Northerners, but to the rest of the South, Virginians are called Yankees. Which is stupid. However, being a border state and with so much military and brass, national defense preoccupation from Va Beach to Arlington Va has welcomed many from everywhere.
When in for instance parts of Va I've met NYers who say it's nice there and that's the farthest South they go. However, even Carolina Coasts, Charleston, Savannah, Wilmington are different than inland.
Ports have always even in Va been more cosmopolitan than highlands or inland. But the people even in the mountains of Va, like Charlottesville etc. have been very civilized to northern and midwestern alike.
I have always thought Virginia is much more cultured even the lower classes than most of the Deep South and also many parts of the North as well. The North is not without its class/race/us vs them issues too.
I always found Va a happier alternative, plus 4 seasons, a generally moderate climate and a good quality, economic upward mobility, advancement, a large middle class.
Richmond has big Fortune 500 company hdqtrs long time old Virginia companies so do other areas but in general Virginia is a wealthy state, people are more contented there than most places I've ever been. Inside the Beltway though it's like a foreign ME country now, however.
I moved to Charlotte, NC... for 30 days. Worst place I've ever lived. Strange people. They drive like psychopaths. They think the highway is a Nascar race. When they meet you, the first thing they ask is "where do you go to church" and they're all born again evangelicals.
It's was like being in the twilight zone.
My defensive response comes from the, yes, constant berating of this area of NY, yours included. There seems to be some sort of obsession for some , like yourself, who have moved away from the area to constantly knock it as though they are reaffirming their own reasons to leave....And I was pointing out there are as many who are very content and happy here and MOVE BACK from the "golden triangles" of the country they just aren't as compelled to post in this forum.
Yes, the taxes are high but the incomes are higher than the natl average and the housing prices are lower so there is a balancing out. As for the weather, we have had some of our warmest winters on record year after year recently and IMO, I believe there is a climatic shift going which will make for more moderate temps in this part of the country .....maybe not Palm Beach but snow levels have already dropped off and winter snow comes later and later.......White Christmas' aren't a given anymore in NY.....
But you will, as others, continue to knock this state and we who live here and thrive and enjoy it will just shake our heads and smile....sorry you missed the good parts of this state
Your'e either a real estate agent or you bought out all the rose colored glasses at the 99 cent store...I spent the last two winters there so I KNOW what's up with that -you can push that rosy blather to some newbie - Buffalo lost ALL its trees in October due to the ice storm -Rochester was no better... you call that mild? They closed the schools for SO LONG my niece got her summer vacation cut! ANd who said I moved away? I still have property there and go often! And no the incomes are not higher, and the higher taxes negate any savings on the one time purchase of the house because you get to pay them every year after year after year..And guess what? It looks like they're going up again! SO much for the property tax freeze they all talked about.
You are losing more residents than are moving in..the biggest employer IS the state, and you, the taxpayer are underwriting thru your taxes all that cheap healthcare the state employees get to enjoy while you pay for yours and theirs! Hey keep those rose colored glasses on - like Nicholson said, You can't handle the truth....
I still think you're a real estate agent - I never heard such one way biased thinking about a place in my life..and it is YOU who are doing a diservice to the readers here...I can't drive into my old neighborhood in Buffalo because the drug czars control that area now..Rochester is called the murder capital of USA..you think I wanted to see that happen to a place I called home?...I have many friends in Buffalo and we bemoan what has happened to our beloved cities in WNY. So don't single me out as being the bearer of bad news..Most of the young people that choose to stay in Buffalo eventually leave because they can't find work that's the truth..but don't believe me- go read the bufflaonews.com, or better yet talk to some of the reporters as I do regularly and let them set you straight...You get real..If folks choose to stay or move there, they should know what to expect and I wish them all the luck in the world.
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