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This is long and overly dramatic, but I figured some advice would be nice.
Emigrations' recent post got me thinking about some things. Some of you may have read my previous threads on this board about my formerly close family members whom I no longer speak to after they behaved horrifically at another relative's funeral. Some here have told me to run and never look back and others have told me I should reconcile. And my apologies if you've read the other threads and are sick to death of the subject!
Basically I don't speak to 4 relatives (two sisters and their parents) who were once very dear to me. I don't bear them any hostility, but they have always been dysfunctional and exploitative, and I view them warily. However, I'm also living 2,000 miles away now, so what damage can they really do?
The parents have both reached out to me, but I have avoided them. Their daughters were really the perpetrators, but their parents alternately goaded them into the behavior and supported it afterwards.
Recently the daughters have been going through hard times - a divorce, an education derailed, etc. I don't know if this is my old acclimation to dysfunctional behavior resurfacing or what, but I feel like I should be there for them. It's been nearly a 4-year estrangement.
Here are the indisputable facts:
1) Their behavior was reprehensible - I told a lot of people the story as neutrally as possible, and every single one was aghast, with no room for mitigating circumstances. Some of them didn't even believe me, because the behavior was so over the top.
2) Their behavior was hurtful to other relatives close to me. But those injured parties do have some limited, arms' length contact with the relatives in question. Those relationships are irrevocably damaged though.
3) I told the estranged relatives at the time that they owed the injured parties an apology, and was informed they were proud of their behavior and would do it again. That was when I walked away. They were the ones to unfriend me on FB - yeah, I know, the death blow to any relationship, lol.
Ever since I was recently chided by yet another close relative (whose opinion I respect and who is like my sibling) for not having contact with those other family members after having enjoyed their hospitality and affection for so long, I have been questioning my decision, and knowing that they are going through tough times is saddening to me. I still don't know what I want to do, but even if I did want to reconcile, I have no idea how to go about it. Plus, I'd be reconciling with the whole bunch - they're very "all or nothing."
So how would YOU do it? I'd love some thoughts on this.
I avoid toxic people at all costs. If a person, or a group people only provide me with stress and heartache, I go, and, remain no contact. As for the "Another Close Relative", if that relative wants to have a relationship with those other family members...so be it...why do you feel the need to re-enter the arena of abuse...yet again. Me...I'd pass...life is just too damn short to deal with all this crap.
I avoid toxic people at all costs. If a person, or a group people only provide me with stress and heartache, I go, and, remain no contact. As for the "Another Close Relative", if that relative wants to have a relationship with those other family members...so be it...why do you feel the need to re-enter the arena of abuse...yet again. Me...I'd pass...life is just too damn short to deal with all this crap.
That's how I feel generally, but ... they WERE very good to me when I went through some rough times myself. They really were a lifeline. Part of me feels obligated to reciprocate, and part of me just shies from the "crazy" they generate.
They always treated me well, up until the moment I challenged them over their behavior. But they always interacted with the rest of the world in a dysfunctional way.
I know that feeling when you're taking about those kind of behaviors and some people have a hard time believing it because it's so over the top. But those are the kinds of behaviors that play in those kind of families. I don't really like that you've been chided by a family member about this, given with my husband's family-- they're real big on gaslighting and ignoring the true nature of certain members... they don't really care if you get sucked in back to that toxic cycle because it's "family".
With that said, I wouldn't welcome them back in my life, even being so far away. I think you should send a card, detailing that you've heard about their situation and you're sending good thoughts their way. But to be there... Do you have the energy for that? Would it be worth the possibility of being sucked back into trouble? You need to seriously ask yourself these questions.
Are you sure they'd even welcome your return? If they are open to it then why not try? I know from personal experience that funerals tend to bring the worst out in some people. A few members of my immediate family have behaved totally inappropriately at funerals that we've attended. I didn't cut them off but it was an eye opener.
What would life be like for you, you think, with them in it? Better? If maybe and you want a connection just make a little flinch move. Maybe just send one of those "cope" Hallmark cards to each of the sisters (your cousins?) and leave it at that. Maybe kind of keep a sturdy screen door instead of a closed door between you.
Apparently, they do not "enjoy your affection" enough to keep you in their circle, unless you agree with their behavior. If they truly cared about you they would try to make amends.
If I were you I would have limited my contact with them (easy, since you are far away), but maybe I would have kept my opinion to myself, since it sounds as if you were just an observer, and not directly involved.
It would help if you old us exactly what their crime was...
JrzDefector....cool name by the way...I haven't read any of your previous posts, so I'm not sure what these people did that was so bad so excuse me if I sound like I am going easy on them.
What I think I am reading is that while they did something bad, it's been a few years so there's space between the incident, and you have heard that they are going through some pretty tough times.
That fact that you care about them, says that you are a compassionate person and they do mean something to you, in some way.
Here's the deal. Life is short. People are going to be jerks because they don't know how to express themselves properly. Maybe they never learned, or they can't learn, or they just truely don't know what they are really doing.
If these people people mean something to you, I don't see the harm in "cautiously" contacting them, maybe send a card saying you hope things get better for them, but if they start to drag you down again, just set limits on the contact.
If they start bothering you, just say "sorry, I really can't get into this type of situation as I feel it's bad for me, but I truely wish you well in your life".
This way, you are helping them, another human being, who is misguided, but you let them know that won't get back into a bad cycle again. Who knows, maybe this will make them think and change? I doubt it but it's worth a shot.
BTW, this is coming from my experience by cutting people off on a whim, because someone told me they were "toxic" and I should, and now I realize that I was too hard on them and didn't take enough responsibility for my own behavior. Sometimes people won't come back, even if you try to repair the relationship. But the fact that I have tried with some people does bring me some comfort.
Truely toxic people, who drag you down a bad path on purpose, should be cut out of your life. People behaviing badly due to poor judgement, that can be another story. Only you can decide which it is, and if you can handle the involvement again.
But I've learned that forgiveness and compassion is really what most people need, and you never feel badly if do act compassionately towards another human being.
Apparently, they do not "enjoy your affection" enough to keep you in their circle, unless you agree with their behavior. If they truly cared about you they would try to make amends.
If I were you I would have limited my contact with them (easy, since you are far away), but maybe I would have kept my opinion to myself, since it sounds as if you were just an observer, and not directly involved.
It would help if you old us exactly what their crime was...
Yeah, I thought about your first point quite a bit. I'd never confronted them over anything before, and they'd frequently asked my advice on things, so apparently they found my opinion worth something. In this case, there was no way I could have kept silent, even though I was out of the room at the time of the confrontation.
I don't want to get too specific about the "crime." They did something vulgar (to show the deceased's "fun" side) at the funeral that offended a lot of people and would have horrified the deceased, and when confronted, they became loud and abusive towards those closest to the deceased, with some bystanders speculating there would be physical violence. Many of the deceased's elderly friends and relatives were shocked, offended and distressed by what they saw, and other relatives were left to soothe those ruffled feathers when they were themselves in mourning and utterly exhausted. It was all "fixable" - as in, a sincere apology would have gone a long way to smoothing things over. But they insisted they were proud of what they did and said other relatives were lying about how upset other mourners had been.
Or is all of that just horribly cryptic?
Like I said, what bothers me and makes me reconsider the estrangement is that we were once very close, and they were very important to me during some of the worst times in my life. I guess I knew what they were capable of, but I just believed (hoped?) it wouldn't ever affect me. But I feel weird not being able to reciprocate their previous support for me.
I should probably add that that side of the family is all but congenitally incapable of apologizing for anything.
This is long and overly dramatic, but I figured some advice would be nice.
Emigrations' recent post got me thinking about some things. Some of you may have read my previous threads on this board about my formerly close family members whom I no longer speak to after they behaved horrifically at another relative's funeral. Some here have told me to run and never look back and others have told me I should reconcile. And my apologies if you've read the other threads and are sick to death of the subject!
Basically I don't speak to 4 relatives (two sisters and their parents) who were once very dear to me. I don't bear them any hostility, but they have always been dysfunctional and exploitative, and I view them warily. However, I'm also living 2,000 miles away now, so what damage can they really do?
The parents have both reached out to me, but I have avoided them. Their daughters were really the perpetrators, but their parents alternately goaded them into the behavior and supported it afterwards.
Recently the daughters have been going through hard times - a divorce, an education derailed, etc. I don't know if this is my old acclimation to dysfunctional behavior resurfacing or what, but I feel like I should be there for them. It's been nearly a 4-year estrangement.
Here are the indisputable facts:
1) Their behavior was reprehensible - I told a lot of people the story as neutrally as possible, and every single one was aghast, with no room for mitigating circumstances. Some of them didn't even believe me, because the behavior was so over the top.
2) Their behavior was hurtful to other relatives close to me. But those injured parties do have some limited, arms' length contact with the relatives in question. Those relationships are irrevocably damaged though.
3) I told the estranged relatives at the time that they owed the injured parties an apology, and was informed they were proud of their behavior and would do it again. That was when I walked away. They were the ones to unfriend me on FB - yeah, I know, the death blow to any relationship, lol.
Ever since I was recently chided by yet another close relative (whose opinion I respect and who is like my sibling) for not having contact with those other family members after having enjoyed their hospitality and affection for so long, I have been questioning my decision, and knowing that they are going through tough times is saddening to me. I still don't know what I want to do, but even if I did want to reconcile, I have no idea how to go about it. Plus, I'd be reconciling with the whole bunch - they're very "all or nothing."
So how would YOU do it? I'd love some thoughts on this.
If they have acknowledged their wrong doing, I'd say it's worth finding out if they have learned from it. But when you say they're very "all or nothing", it raises red flags. This would suggest that they have ALL owned their stuff, or they haven't. If only one or two have and have truly made progress, they wouldn't align with those who haven't.
I have a sister who is pathological; no empathy, no remorse, very manipulative, extremely toxic. I will have nothing to do with her. I have heard it all. "She's your sister." "She's family." "Be the bigger person." I am also her sister, and her family. I'm already the bigger person. I don't need to step in front of that bus again to prove it. When we place value for family onto someone who has little or (as is the case with my sister) none, we willingly risk our well being and quality of life. I won't do that for anyone, blood or not.
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