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Old 09-14-2014, 11:34 AM
 
4,337 posts, read 6,027,600 times
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There's so much good stuff here. Thank you.

I want to answer this one: "1. What can you do to get to know fiancée better, and improve the relationship?"

Answer: About a year ago, I emailed his fiancee (because in two years time she kept me at arms length, no phone calls ever. I called her once and she texted me back with the answer.) with exactly what you asked. I said I wanted to get to know her better. Her answer was, "Honestly, I have no more time to give you other than what I'm already giving you." Which was nothing. There's just no getting close to her. Their circle now consists of her family and her friends and a few of our son's single friends that she doesn't find threatening. Otherwise he's got a new life now.

Someone asked who will be invited to the wedding. They've been engaged for two years now after dating for two previous years. I don't think there'll be a wedding. The missing piece of paper doesn't make it any easier. Whether she's his wife or his forever-fiancee, she's still a huge influence over him.
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Old 09-14-2014, 11:54 AM
 
16,025 posts, read 19,571,183 times
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Keep doingnwhat you are doing with your Ex Dil. You are not doing anything wrong. Your son has become influenced by a spiteful, insecure and very immature woman....and more's the pity.

In my world, the more ppl that love a child the better. She, son's fiancee' simply is not mature enough to see that this open relationship with your ex dil..., or ideally a relationship with your son as well..is best for the children...Seriously, it isn't her business anyway. And, since your relationship with your grand babies is the most important variable here, your maintaining a relationship with them, should be done at all costs.

Your Son seriously needs to grown up, and sit some boundaries....this gal should not have that much input that it interferes with you and your sons relationship and the grandchildren!! She seems to be using the children as pawns, because your son is allowing it.

Bottom line, don't automatically trust this lady that is involved with your son....she is showing her true colors...Do not let her dictate when, where or how often you talk to your son, or see your grand babies. Do not even discuss this with her, if no one else will do it, you can at least sit boundaries....She is out of line.

Keep the lines of communication open with your son...if you get a chance, share what you've shared here...that you are attempting as loving, caring grandparents to remain involved with your grandchildren, which is a very positive thing.

Thank goodness your DIL is a grown-up!! And, speaking from personal experience, eventually your son will see the truth...til then, keep doing what you'v been doing, those babies deserve it!! If you see changes, then you can change but til then.....I'd ignore her.

Last edited by JanND; 09-14-2014 at 12:05 PM..
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Old 09-14-2014, 12:33 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
4,294 posts, read 3,062,096 times
Reputation: 4285
Quote:
Originally Posted by ipoetry View Post
There's so much good stuff here. Thank you.

I want to answer this one: "1. What can you do to get to know fiancée better, and improve the relationship?"

Answer: About a year ago, I emailed his fiancee (because in two years time she kept me at arms length, no phone calls ever. I called her once and she texted me back with the answer.) with exactly what you asked. I said I wanted to get to know her better. Her answer was, "Honestly, I have no more time to give you other than what I'm already giving you." Which was nothing. There's just no getting close to her. Their circle now consists of her family and her friends and a few of our son's single friends that she doesn't find threatening. Otherwise he's got a new life now.

Someone asked who will be invited to the wedding. They've been engaged for two years now after dating for two previous years. I don't think there'll be a wedding. The missing piece of paper doesn't make it any easier. Whether she's his wife or his forever-fiancee, she's still a huge influence over him.
Oh my lord I hope your son will open his eyes soon. Where did he find that woman mean fiance, from Thailand? Sounds like.
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Old 09-14-2014, 01:11 PM
 
Location: NYC
1,723 posts, read 3,354,603 times
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I have to agree with everyone here. Your son's fiancee' sounds terribly insecure, immature, manipulative and feel's threatened by his former relationship. Hopefully, there's a reason why she's still only the fiance and not your son's wife yet. Maybe he's not happy with her behavior either on some level and has his own doubts about marrying her.

Regardless, you've got a wonderful relationship with your former DIL and the grandkids. Keep it that way and don't let the fiancee or your son interfere with that. It's important for the grandkids to have stability in their lives and you represent that.

and I would suggest you thank your former DIL in some way for being so mature about the whole situation and how you appreciate the fact that she allows you to see your grandkids. You don't know what the future holds and god forbid, but she may someday meet a guy that's as insecure as this new fiancee. She doesn't have to let you see the g'kids at all, so you definitely want to keep her on your good side.


FWIW, I see that frightening behavior in one of my own DIL's. It's like little by little she's chipped away at all my son's relationships with all his friends and family.
Of course, I can't blame her totally. He has to grow some balls and stand up to her which I slowly see him doing finally.
So does your son. Just keep the lines of communication open with your son so that when he does come to his senses, he'll still have a relationship with you. Be polite when you see the fiancee' but ignore any drama or negativity she tries to create.

I wonder if the new fiancee' will eventually feel resentful of the time your son spends with his kids too. Doe's she have a decent relationship with his kids?
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Old 09-14-2014, 06:19 PM
 
4,728 posts, read 4,456,559 times
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Keep your relationship with your ex daughter-in-law. The other will either work itself out by your son waking up, or it will get worse. Either way you need to be there for your grandchildren. I have a family member whose gf was like your son's. She cut him off from everyone because of her jealousy and insecurity. When his mother tried to get closer to her, she was told by the gf that she wanted to be "independent." What the heck? What does being independent have to do with letting people into your life. My family member and his gf broke up, but not before she isolated him and did a number on his self-confidence. Just be there and be ready to pick up the pieces if your son needs you. He is in over his head.
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Old 09-14-2014, 07:05 PM
 
Location: Georgia
4,560 posts, read 4,064,443 times
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For your son and his fiancee' to dictate who you may and may not have a relationship with is silly. My guess is that the fiancee' is feeling very threatened by your relationship with the ex, and is seeing this as some sort of challenge to her relationshp with your son -- and possibly to future children she and your son may have. The only thing that is going to fix this is time. Maybe once she is more secure in the relationship, she will be able to relax a bit. Who knows -- she may even learn to like the ex-wife, too, especially if your son has a strong relationship with his kids.

You're just going to have to be extra-careful not to mention the ex-wife around the fiancee' for a while, lest it be considered "throwing it in her face." But if I were you, I'd be damned if I let some insecure girl stand between you and your relationship with your grandchildren. If she gets torqued over a Halloween card, then she's ridiculous. She needs to grow up.
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Old 09-15-2014, 01:15 AM
 
Location: the Permian Basin
4,193 posts, read 3,061,109 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipoetry View Post
I don't know much about his fiancée because she made herself an island from the start. No one gets close to her. My son has cut us off and he's cut off his long term friends as well. What I kept being told as he dropped friends was, "They make fiancee uncomfortable. " she seems to get uncomfortable a lot.

he's admitted that she's stubborn and insecure
That's a very nice way of putting it. She's a lot more than just insecure; perhaps narcissistic or histrionic.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ipoetry View Post
We're the disposable ones in this equation.
You need to do what is best for your grandkids (because she certainly doesn't have them as her first priority), and pray for your son. Most of all, pray that he finds another woman, and heals from the damage this one is doing to him.


And I second everything that Georgianbelle said in her post (2 posts prior to this one). She hit the nail squarely on the head.
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Old 09-15-2014, 01:21 AM
 
Location: the Permian Basin
4,193 posts, read 3,061,109 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipoetry View Post
I don't know how my son sees our relationship with his ex.
Your son's opinion is irrelevant b/c all of this is being driven by his fiance's (mis)perceptions.
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Old 09-15-2014, 01:59 AM
 
37,855 posts, read 14,749,658 times
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I agree with those who have posted that the "fiancee" likely has narcissistic traits. Read up on Narcissistic Personality Disorder and see if it sounds familiar.

Narcissists can be quite charming and it appears she has charmed your son. Not much you can do about that.

You can try having a conversation with him about being excluded from his and the grandkids' lives, but don't expect much to change. In fact, this may justify in their minds that you are "against" her. So be it.

Fortunately, you can stay involved with your grandchildren via your daughter-in-law.

Narcissists have a difficult time sustaining long-term relationships. There are different types of narcissists and sometimes a pair of two different kinds can provide the narcissistic supply each needs. But more often, their bottomless need eventually strains a relationship to the point that either the partner leaves, or the narcissist finds someone else and the cycle of shallow relationships continue.

But there's not much you can do about your son's choice of partners.

So be kind to her and pleasant. No sense giving her ammunition in the your-parents-hate-me game. Then go about living your lives.

My heart goes out to you.
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Old 09-15-2014, 06:03 AM
 
4,337 posts, read 6,027,600 times
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Thank you all so much. I've learned a lot from reading your responses. One of the kids is starting to exhibit anxiety issues while in the fiancee's presence but they blame the ex. He is perfectly normal in his mothers presence, perfectly normal in our presence, but shows anxiety during his weekends with his father and fiancee yet it's someone else's fault.
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