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I agree that the brother sounds selfish and clueless. What was his reason for not calling his mother on her birthday, or for at least not calling around to his siblings to find out "hey, what's the plan for mom's birthday"? That is what my siblings and I do when a special date is approaching. After all, her birth date has been the same for 70 years.
Seems like he expects everyone else to pick up his slack, and has for a while (was he like this as a kid?). If it was a more recent thing I'd be more apt to give the benefit of the doubt, wondering if there was something going on that he didn't want to share.
However it didn't help to exclude him pointedly from the party, although I understand that at the time you were hurt and it was the last straw. It sounds like you know that. I'd apologize for that slight, but then it is up to him to accept the apology, and possibly offer his own.
This is going to be a long very long post but it needs to be long to tell the whole story.
One of my brother and I haven't spoke to each other in a year now. The reason, well ...
We have a family with 6 siblings, 5 boys and 1 girl. I'm the 3rd and the conflict brother is the 4th oldest.
This all started for me at least Many years ago. We are a semi close family and we would all go out to dinner with our parents for most of the holidays and special occasions. Now with a big family like that including in laws and kids and what not, it's a huge party and I mean like 25-30 of us. Now when we were younger, our parents took care of the bill. But the older we got, and the bigger the family, some of us realize that our parents shouldn't be responsible for the huge bill. At first, my oldest brother started taking care of it then I realize that's not fair so I'd pitch in and split the bill. This went on for many years and we would be offered money by all the other siblings too except for the 4th brother. He would never ever offer. Now my oldest brother makes good money and I make ok. But we never excepted any money from any of the siblings cause frankly, they don't make that much and what not but they still offer here and there, we just say thank you but never take their money. Once again, they offer except brother 4. By the way, Brother 4 makes about if not more than me. My wife, my oldest brothers wife, and my oldest brother notice this too and we just never said anything. So we just concluded that he's cheap and selfish. Now I'll be the first to admit that we should have nipped it in the bud. But to talk to our brother and call him cheap and what not makes me feel very uncomfortable. I just thought that it will click for him one day and realize he needs to offer. Even my parents notice this and says he's cheap too. So basically, about 6-8 of us just say he's cheap and leave it at that. As far as all the other siblings, we never really talked to them about this cause frankly, they really never pay for the bill so they don't notice who offerers and what not. Now each sibling has wives and kid(s) of their own so we're not talking about single siblings here. Our dinner includes families so it's not that he by himself. So that's that but not the reason for the blowout between him and I.
the story continues with my wife and I have been trying to have kids for over 6 years and we were able to finally conceive. So you know how special of a time for us it was. We were on cloud nine cause we've been waiting for for so long. The baby shower comes along and it was big. We have a lot of of friends and family;-) After it was all and done, we were going through all the gifts and what not to send thank you notes and realize we didn't receive anything from brother 4. We just thought we misplaced it so I called my brother and ask him what he gift he gave us so we can look for it. He says "oh sorry, we forgot or we didn't have time". "I'll get you next time". Now before anyone says anything about the material notion of the gift, IT WAS NOT ABOUT THE GIFT. For us, it was the thought. He could have stopped by somewhere on the way to the shower and got us a card or what not knowing how special of an occasion it was for us. But he didn't. Now we had over 250 people at our baby shower and not a single person except for this brother forgot to bring a gift. Was my wife and I a little hurt, sure, but we tried to give him the benefit of the doubt that he had other important things on his mind. So whatever.
The story continues. 2 weeks later was thanksgiving at my oldest brothers house. Everyone was there. Now if it was me and I forgot my a gift for my brother on what was a very special occasion for him just 2 weeks ago, I surely wouldn't have forgotten it this time. I surely would have seen his face and realize about the gift again. But not a word was mentioned. Whatever.
Now we finally get to the blowout. 2 weeks after that, my mothers birthday. My mother voluntarily told me that everyone in the family called her and wished her a happy birthday except brother 4. Now by her voluntarily telling me that, I know she must have been very hurt. And it probably wasn't a good thing telling me cause of what happened with me and him about my baby shower. I had a bad taste already with him. By the way, I never told anyone about the gift thing at my baby shower to any members of my family so they didn't know. After she tells me that, I just said, you know what mom, if he didn't care about calling you for your birthday, they he won't care if he's excluded from your birthday dinner. We just won't invite him. My mother said ok. I called my older brother and told him the same and he said ok. So my parents knew, my older brother and his wife knew, and my wife and I knew that we weren't going to invite this brother. We didn't tell anyone else cause we were the one planning and as usual, taking care of the bill so they were not privy of us not inviting brother 4. When the dinner happened and the other members ask where brother 4 was, we just said he couldn't make it. Now was it wrong/right of me to do this. It's debatable but it was the last straw for me.
When brother 4 found out afterwards, that's when it all blew out. Now you can say I was Thrown under the bus by my parents and older brother cause I was the fall guy for this. When my brother found out he was excluded from the dinner, my parents told him that I was the one that initiated that. One thing right or wrong is that my parents and my oldest brother is very non confrontational and I guess I'm the alpha one in the family.
So he calls me up and I laid it out the line for him about everything. I even told him that our parents and oldest brother felt the same. So he called them up and they agreed with me. He was cheap and selfish. They told him that straight out. He was very hurt but basically took it all out on me cause I was the one who initiated the dinner thing. I explained to him that yes I initiated it but neither his parents or oldest brother who knew put up a fight for not inviting him. I thought he would see the big picture that it was not just me, but no. He said that I not only not include him but his wife and daughter as well for seeing their cousins, etc. he called me every name a lot of names but I didn't respond thinking it must be tough for him to find out he is viewed that way by members of his family. I told him that I'll apologize that he had to find out about it this way. But it was tough for us to talk to him about it. Well even though my oldest brother and parents tell him the same, his wrath is with me and I don't really care. He didn't show up for Christmas or any occasions for a few months after that cause I guess he's embarrassed and hurt. But he started coming again for the past 6 months.
So we haven't talked in over a year. He stills talks to my parents and oldest brother but not me. When I had my son, I let everyone know including him. When he just had his twins this past 6 months, he let everyone know except me. I had to find out though my other family members. Since he excluded me, I never went to see his new twins. So now for family occasions, we don't talk. It's awkward but whatever. My family talks to him about the situation and he has the gall to say even if I apologized to him, he's not sure. What the hell do I have to apologize to him for?
So please all, who's in the right/wrong.
I'm grateful for those whose actually read this long post and those who will give me their opinion.
I'd be feeling: Screw him. He's a narcissistic assclown that got caught and he can stay away as long as he likes. That means I don't have to pay for his cheap-ass dinner anymore.
1) our family isn't a split the bill type. We all just try to contribute. So tell me, if you were in this exact situation where you see everyone trying to contribute, how could you not offer?
2) who does that? Who goes to a special occasion and not bring anything? And when asked, oh sorry I forgot or didn't have time? Do you go to weddings empty handed? Do you go to kids birthdays empty handed? Where in society is that the norm?
3) when my 70 year mother voluntarily tells me this, I cannot ignore it. It tells me how hurt she was.
4)I'm not the only one who feels like this. I'm just the one who brought it out in the open. Would it have been better to let this go on while many on the family feels this?
1. Would you rather allowing this to aggravate you just because we are not that kind of family? Would you rather listen to each other complain rather than give him a bill for his share at a restaurant? If it is a matter of finances, then everyone should split the bill. I would rather BECOME that kind of family rather than argue over it.
2. Your brother does that. He appears to be alienated with words that hurt him. You have regrets.
3. My mother's relationship with my siblings is just that. HER relationship. I always listened to her, but understood I did not speak for her, ever.
4. You spoke for your family Can they not speak for themselves?
Taking on the role of family spokesman can be stressful. Let go of that role.
1) our family isn't a split the bill type. We all just try to contribute. So tell me, if you were in this exact situation where you see everyone trying to contribute, how could you not offer?
2) who does that? Who goes to a special occasion and not bring anything? And when asked, oh sorry I forgot or didn't have time? Do you go to weddings empty handed? Do you go to kids birthdays empty handed? Where in society is that the norm?
3) when my 70 year mother voluntarily tells me this, I cannot ignore it. It tells me how hurt she was.
4)I'm not the only one who feels like this. I'm just the one who brought it out in the open. Would it have been better to let this go on while many on the family feels this?
1. There are always people who will be thoughtless and perhaps unwittingly take advantage of the situation. There is a way to ask somebody to step up without resorting to calling names (even if it's true). That was one suggestion, which was a direct action.
2. I don't know who does that, lol. Very strange indeed.
3. Then your mother should've told him. In this case, being direct would've been better. It shouldn't have spurred you onto anything but encouraging your mother to talk to her son.
4. You brought it out in a very passive aggressive manner and now you're paying the price for that. There were other ways to deal with this, but you did choose the course of action that sting the most in a very underhanded way. You even LIED to other people during the process. 2 wrongs don't make a right.
Yes, you were wrong and you should apologize for making a bad choice. Whether your brother forgives you is on him. At least now that he knows and your family knows that he knows, hopefully he'll change his cheap behavior. If not, then you'll have to be the type of family that splits the bill in order not to be put off.
I agree that the brother sounds selfish and clueless. What was his reason for not calling his mother on her birthday, or for at least not calling around to his siblings to find out "hey, what's the plan for mom's birthday"? That is what my siblings and I do when a special date is approaching. After all, her birth date has been the same for 70 years.
Seems like he expects everyone else to pick up his slack, and has for a while (was he like this as a kid?). If it was a more recent thing I'd be more apt to give the benefit of the doubt, wondering if there was something going on that he didn't want to share.
However it didn't help to exclude him pointedly from the party, although I understand that at the time you were hurt and it was the last straw. It sounds like you know that. I'd apologize for that slight, but then it is up to him to accept the apology, and possibly offer his own.
When confronted about not calling our mother for her birthday, he said him and his whole family had been sick and they totally forgot. Then the very next day, they remembered. I asked my mom did he ever call you for a belated happy birthday. She said no. So even after they realized their mistake, they never called. Understandable that you have things going on and forgot but when you remembered, why not a call then?
1. There are always people who will be thoughtless and perhaps unwittingly take advantage of the situation. There is a way to ask somebody to step up without resorting to calling names (even if it's true). That was one suggestion, which was a direct action.
2. I don't know who does that, lol. Very strange indeed.
3. Then your mother should've told him. In this case, being direct would've been better. It shouldn't have spurred you onto anything but encouraging your mother to talk to her son.
4. You brought it out in a very passive aggressive manner and now you're paying the price for that. There were other ways to deal with this, but you did choose the course of action that sting the most in a very underhanded way. You even LIED to other people during the process. 2 wrongs don't make a right.
Yes, you were wrong and you should apologize for making a bad choice. Whether your brother forgives you is on him. At least now that he knows and your family knows that he knows, hopefully he'll change his cheap behavior. If not, then you'll have to be the type of family that splits the bill in order not to be put off.
Like I said, I apologized to him at the time that he was finding out like this. I just feel that's the only thing I should be apologizing for.
When confronted about not calling our mother for her birthday, he said him and his whole family had been sick and they totally forgot. Then the very next day, they remembered. I asked my mom did he ever call you for a belated happy birthday. She said no. So even after they realized their mistake, they never called. Understandable that you have things going on and forgot but when you remembered, why not a call then?
You have got to remove yourself as the monitor in this family....Do you monitor your other siblings?? It sounds like this brother has become the target child....Just take care of your relationship with your Mother....That is all you should be involved in.
He when confronted about the bill situation, he says he is just in the thought that parents and older siblings should take care of things like that.
I agree with that if the siblings was under 18. Not when he's 40 years old with his own family. How can any adult expect your parents and older siblings to take care of you and his family for the rest of his life? Even if that the truth, how does he feel when his own younger siblings offer towards the bill?
You do not expect anyone to chip in.
If they offer, you decline.
If they insist, you return their money.
Sounds like the brother doesn't want to play that.
Why go through the motions when his money would be returned to him anyway....
Lets go back to the beginning when we started to all chip in, why didn't he then? He had no knowledge then that we return the money? Everyone was trying to do their part but not him?
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