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I see they are leaving by the end of the month, but did you sit them down and explain that this can't happen again next year? Have you told them that this was extremely stressful and inconvenient for your entire family? Have you explained how it made you feel like they didn't care ONE BIT about your feelings, your needs, or the peaceful enjoyment of your own home? Did you explain why they should never, ever do this to anyone else because it's impolite, frustrating, expensive, and generally the biggest imposition you've ever experienced and was causing real resentment on your part? They need to hear these truths or you will find them trying to pull this crap again on you or someone else next winter. Explain to them that "good guests" should know when it's time to go, and they have FAR overstayed their welcome. Explain that it's only because you love them that you were too meek to kick them out or not let them in in the first place, but that their behavior has changed that about you. That you won't let them or anyone else abuse your kindness this way in the future.
Well said. This might work if she repeats it over and over and over.
BrassTacksGal I couldn't rep you again
You took the words right out of my mouth, regarding someone's earlier "rude, nasty" responses.
OP You will figure this out. I applaud your candor. I think just being able to vent and get objective criticism as well as support
sometimes takes the edge off an otherwise seemingly insurmountable situation. Good luck to you going forward.
No, we didn't get into that much detail when I spoke with them. It was along the lines of - now that my daughter is leaving for France, it's time for you to go to [relatives] house like you planned. The response was acting like the plan was them leaving at the end of the month all along and I knew it. I need to somewhat separate myself from my anger right now before I confront them on everything else. While I may sound measured on here, I have a temper and when I say things in a temper, it's ugly, nasty, and can cause major problems. I would rather be the calm one in the conversation because I'm sure, absolutely sure, it will not be a good conversation. Likely wimpy of me but oh well - at this point I want them out and then once they're not in my face everyday I can better deal with the future.
I can't tell them no one likes them staying months on end because my flipping sister does. When I've talked to her about their visit, her response is 'it's hard on them getting older, you need to be a better daughter.' So, this only helps my parents feel their overly long visits are acceptable. After all, I'm the 'emotional' one in the family or so I've been told.
Good news though, since they eschewed my sister's invitation to visit her house and instead invaded mine, she's suddenly decided she wants to build a new house and wants their input/help. That could keep them busy a LONG time - hopefully. Since they've gotten older, they struggle to find things to fill each day (no hobbies!!) and think 'helping' family members is the way to fill their days. They could help my sister for days and days and days and days building a house. I would go crazy but she wants them there and is constantly on a quest to prove herself the better daughter. I've long ago decided she could declare herself victor extraordinaire of that little self-imposed contest of hers anytime she wants because I'm not competing.
Did your parents have no hobbies or interests for their entire life? Many people view retirement as the time they can finally indulge in all the interests they have had to set aside when raising their children.
I'm wondering if you or your sister could help them find something meaningful to do other than hang out with their daughters?
My husband and I are the opposite, we have so many interests and a great social life that we are very busy. Our kids have complained that we're too busy! But we're having fun. Wouldn't it be nice for your parents to have interests and a social life that doesn't revolve around their children? Are they introverts who have a difficult time making friends and socializing?
Those who think that simply sitting down and calmly and rationally explaining why this visit was not a good idea will make the parents say, "Oh, you're absolutely right! We're so sorry! What were we thinking; we should never have asked to visit two weeks after you moved..." etc. must not have relatives like this.
My experience is that that trying to explain why there's a problem goes nowhere because some people are truly incapable of empathy. I'm not saying they're monsters, it's just that they lack the ability to put themselves in others' shoes and understand how they feel and why they feel that way. I'll describe how this has gone for me.
When you try to explain that what they did was hurtful to you or inconvenienced you [fill in the blank with your situation], they look at you perplexed. It's inexplicable to them why you (or anyone) would feel that way. Therefore, it can't be true, and they will explain to you why your feelings are mistaken. All they hear when you explain how your actions made them feel is, "She's accusing me of doing something wrong." The problem is, they don't really believe they did anything wrong. Because they don't feel they've done anything wrong, they don't feel guilty about their behavior the way "normal" people do.
The more you try to get through to them, the more they resist because they feel like YOU don't get it. If you don't accept their version of the truth they will turn the tables and hint or outright say that YOU are being childish/ungrateful/mean/selfish/unloving/unreasonable, whatever. Suddenly, THEY are the aggrieved party. Alternately, they may do the old passive-aggressive, "Well, we were so looking forward to spending time with you because we love you so much, but I guess you just don't feel the same way about us."
There are many flavors and permutations of this, but it all boils down to the same thing: they are missing whatever part of the brain makes people say, "Oh, I guess I shouldn't do/say X, because if I do that, the other person will feel Y." Some people don't seem to be able to grasp this basic precept. Perhaps it's a personality disorder.
I gave up on trying to reason with them decades ago and just started saying "no" in the face of unreasonable demands, as did my brothers. Yes, that meant that we were then considered ungrateful, unloving, etc. "after all they did for us." The alternative was letting them continue to make us crazy.
I had almost exactly the same situation with my mother, who had Narcissistic Personality Disorder and or Borderline Personality disorder, and my enabler father. If we didn't agree with mother there was always something wrong with us, never her. She was ALWAYS the victim. Yes, it is crazy making behavior.
Good news though, since they eschewed my sister's invitation to visit her house and instead invaded mine, she's suddenly decided she wants to build a new house and wants their input/help. That could keep them busy a LONG time - hopefully. Since they've gotten older, they struggle to find things to fill each day (no hobbies!!) and think 'helping' family members is the way to fill their days. They could help my sister for days and days and days and days building a house. I would go crazy but she wants them there and is constantly on a quest to prove herself the better daughter. I've long ago decided she could declare herself victor extraordinaire of that little self-imposed contest of hers anytime she wants because I'm not competing.
In the It-Could-Be-Worse category, about a year or so ago we had a woman in this forum whose in-laws (I think it was) came for long visits even though they weren't wanted or invited. While there, they busied themselves "working" around the property. On departure day, the in-laws handed the couple an itemized bill for their services!
And this wasn't a one-off, either. Apparently they did it all the time to their adult children.
I have a sibling who is basically homeless, who has made a career out of visiting people and just staying on or volunteering to help ill relatives while living with them rent free. For months or years.
She has a degree in biology and has worked in professional capacities for years. She's homeless because she doesn't want the responsibilities of homeownership or paying regular rent.
She came to our house for a long weekend and 2 weeks later was still there. Heavy hints, stopped cooking or buying food, etc. Nothing. We finally faked an emergency business trip. We left and while she kept insisitng she could house sit for us, we kept insisting that wasnt nessecary. She finally left.
Since then we've always had a drop dead date. "We'd love to see you this weekend and we're having the houses fumigated on Monday, so we'll all have to leave."
Yes, I could tell her off, but family relations work better with a little grease on the wheels. Plus it makes me laugh with all the stupid sh*t I've told her.
Not to quibble but what about this situation suggested that to you? The parents arrived when they felt like it, now they're leaving on their own schedule, not because they were asked to go. They couldn't have gotten their way any more effectively if they'd brought a steamroller with them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by southbel
Yes true but I was the one who caved to them after my mother's repeated requests to come down. I should have stood firm and yet I did not. Shame on me. Lesson learned. Given what they have done this visit, there is no amount of cajoling which would allow me to make this same mistake twice.
Recall, while I did not want them to come and said as much, my mother's repeated phone calls trying to secure an invitation and in which I caved gave them the go ahead to come on down. I think this point was lost in the multiple pages, etc.
But, a normal adult would not badger another adult with repeated, repeated requests after the other adult first says "No, we just moved in two weeks ago, you can not visit."
And, as fluffythewondercat pointed out they certainly did leave (if they do leave) "on their schedule". Why didn't you just say "If you any receive mail after you leave I will just put it in a big envelope and drop it off at your hotel or mail it to you in your new city" ?
I can not believe that a ridiculous excuse like "we filed a mail transfer to this address until January 31" made it "acceptable" for them to impose on you two more weeks after your daughter/their granddaughter left. What if they go to the PO and change it February 28 or March 31? With that still be a valid reason for them to stay?
Frankly, I suspect that the steamroller is still parked in your guest house, which your parents will not let you step inside unless they are present (and also, have mentioned filling in with furniture from their house up north).
Those who think that simply sitting down and calmly and rationally explaining why this visit was not a good idea will make the parents say, "Oh, you're absolutely right! We're so sorry! What were we thinking; we should never have asked to visit two weeks after you moved..." etc. must not have relatives like this.
My experience is that that trying to explain why there's a problem goes nowhere because some people are truly incapable of empathy. I'm not saying they're monsters, it's just that they lack the ability to put themselves in others' shoes and understand how they feel and why they feel that way. I'll describe how this has gone for me.
When you try to explain that what they did was hurtful to you or inconvenienced you [fill in the blank with your situation], they look at you perplexed. It's inexplicable to them why you (or anyone) would feel that way. Therefore, it can't be true, and they will explain to you why your feelings are mistaken. All they hear when you explain how your actions made them feel is, "She's accusing me of doing something wrong." The problem is, they don't really believe they did anything wrong. Because they don't feel they've done anything wrong, they don't feel guilty about their behavior the way "normal" people do.
The more you try to get through to them, the more they resist because they feel like YOU don't get it. If you don't accept their version of the truth they will turn the tables and hint or outright say that YOU are being childish/ungrateful/mean/selfish/unloving/unreasonable, whatever. Suddenly, THEY are the aggrieved party. Alternately, they may do the old passive-aggressive, "Well, we were so looking forward to spending time with you because we love you so much, but I guess you just don't feel the same way about us."
There are many flavors and permutations of this, but it all boils down to the same thing: they are missing whatever part of the brain makes people say, "Oh, I guess I shouldn't do/say X, because if I do that, the other person will feel Y." Some people don't seem to be able to grasp this basic precept. Perhaps it's a personality disorder.
I gave up on trying to reason with them decades ago and just started saying "no" in the face of unreasonable demands, as did my brothers. Yes, that meant that we were then considered ungrateful, unloving, etc. "after all they did for us." The alternative was letting them continue to make us crazy.
You have described them well in this post. Like I said earlier, they are what I would consider self-centered. They do not and no matter how many times I tell them, believe what they are doing is wrong. They genuinely believe I should be happy they are there and for me to say that I am not doesn't mean, in their minds, I am right. No, it means that I am in the wrong because I do not understand and/or I'm being 'emotional'. That's the usual moniker at least.
I've never really thought of them as lacking empathy but upon reflection, I think I could see that. So many people think empathy and sympathy are the same and they most certainly are not. While my parents can and do show sympathy, I can recall no time when I've seen them have any empathy whatsoever.
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