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So even a happily married man is in danger of throwing any rational thought out of his head and tossing his "friend" on the nearest flat surface as long as she's not ugly? I'm sorry I just don't believe that the majority of men are that kind of neanderthal. Sure, if both parties are in no other sort of relationship maybe but I guess I'd like to believe that men, in general, are better than dogs attracted to the nearest female butt.
The reason I believe this is that I have had male friends that I think are great people and I admire and perhaps even think they are good looking. I'm also in a relationship so I have no interest in doing the deed with them regardless if they would be or not. Zero. I also don't believe that women are somehow more magically evolved than men so I don't believe we have somehow higher standards. Your argument, to me, reeks of the "boys will be boys" mentality and I just don't buy that. There is no reason the male brain cannot operate on the same level mine does. It's not that hard. I'm not some sort of Mensa genius so the bar isn't impossibly high.
there are men like you out there... and you are proof of that...and I don't believe that the majority are neaderthal, but some are...you can't deny that...and some are also opportunists, just as women are....
but I gotta say, I do love the way you think, it's very refreshing....
And I do think though, that a lot of factors play into whether, say, a man (I'll get to the women in a minute) can be counted upon to control himself and behave even if he has an attractive female friend.
How old is he? How mature is he? How intellectual a person is he? How was he raised? Does he have healthy ideology and relationships with women in general? Like I do know a man who is middle aged, highly intelligent and successful, yet I know he's destroyed friendships pursuing other guys' wives and he's kind of a "dog" if you will in this regard...but I also know he has a head full of toxic crap from his addict Mother and he is desperate for validation from women and forever reaching for the nurturing he never had as a child. He's got problems. His relationships always fail...and that includes girlfriends, his recently-ex wife (who he brought over from another country, because he thought American women were the problem) and yes, almost all of his friendships including those with men. The guy is kind of insufferable, but it's not really a conscious thing, he's just got a lot of baggage he refuses, almost angrily, to examine and fix.
HE cannot be trusted to be platonic friends with a woman.
He happens to be a very old friend of my boyfriend, and I have refused to be friends with him personally, because I know he doesn't respect other people's boundaries. I'm not down to play his games. Just no.
Now looking at women who struggle to be platonic friends with guys... I know a lot of younger women who have this problem, such as my son's recently-ex girlfriend. She also has issues from a bad upbringing, also is desperate to grasp at validation and nurturance from guys that she lacked growing up. Her boundaries are horrible. She talks and acts sexual with all sorts of people, whether she wants to have sex with them or not. The girl is a tragic mess waiting to happen. I feel sorry for her, but I'm also glad my son isn't with her anymore.
As a teenage girl, I slept with an awful lot of my friends. Didn't try to have relationships with them and considered the sex to be no big deal, but my boundaries were a mess. I had to confront and work on a lot of crap over the years, but I did that work. I had no trouble being faithful to first my ex husband for 18 years, and now my boyfriend for 3 and a half... And I have many male friends. But I learned how to do boundaries. One of the main ones is to eliminate the "opportunity" part of the equation. Don't be alone with guys, especially if I know they find me attractive. Only spend time with them in the company of other people, and boom, they never have a chance. Also, if there is any sexual banter or innuendo (and let's face it, with Beavis & Butthead residing somewhere in the back of my brain, it's likely) I have to make very, very sure that I make it fully clear to some people that it is only joking and it is backed with no intent. But you know, if a guy has a problem being friends with me on the terms that need to exist, he is free to not be my friend. Ain't nobody holding a gun to his head here.
But the thing is, what I'm avoiding with my boundaries...I don't think any of my male friends would try to force me or pressure me or anything. It's just that I find it unpleasant to have to reject someone when I do like them, and want to be friends with them. I don't want to be put in that position in the first place. So I engineer the situation so it's just not an issue. I head it off.
But really yeah, I know, there are plenty of men who don't want to be friends with an "attractive" woman because they'll be thinking about sex and all that whatever. To me, those men are just saying something about themselves. Like, "I struggle to see a person as fully human when I want to bang them." That's on you, fella. But all of malekind didn't elect you to represent them, so...
Maybe the counterpart is, as a woman, I shouldn't be "friends" with men if I am in an unhappy relationship. That's about the only recipe for trouble I know of. Closest I ever got to infidelity, when my marriage trainwrecked and there was a "friend" waiting there to try and comfort me. But instead of bouncing into bed with the guy, I saw those feelings as a red alert, an alarm flashing, and ended my marriage before anything could happen. Still didn't end up dating that guy...he was a symptom though, and I felt I was smart enough to see that at the time. Just barely smart enough, but still.
can totally understand and relate.....very solid advice...and totally honest....thank you....
I have to add this, my older foster-sister for some reason is and always has been the woman who struggles to be platonic friends with men....however, she didn't have a bad childhood, but she does have an extremely insecure negative outlook on life....for some reason, she doesn't possess any confidence, and I'm not saying these things b/c I want to talk about her....it's just the way she is, isn't anything I haven't already told her, but what I struggle with, is where did this come from? My mom, says even as a baby she was miserable, always crying....stubborn, wanted to do things her way or the highway....I guess I'm the only one in the family she cannot intimidate? I don't know why that is either...
But she has so many male friends, if they're sick she cooks them food and takes it over to them....and I can see when in the company of men, she openly rallies for attention?
I used to have a lot of male friends, more so than woman, but of late, say the past 20 years have been developing a good relationships with women...
I also think, being open and honest up front is a very good way to start a relationship with anyone...don't beat around the bush trying to please everyone until you make yourself a door mat.
We're all different, so....the interesting part is learning how to make yourself happy, and when you do, nothing else seems to matter?
there are men like you out there... and you are proof of that...and I don't believe that the majority are neaderthal, but some are...you can't deny that...and some are also opportunists, just as women are....
but I gotta say, I do love the way you think, it's very refreshing....
thank you
Sorry but I am proof of believing men in general can and do have higher standards and nothing more. My husband can attest to all girl parts here.
There are exceptions to every rule of course but I just don't believe that all men are ruled by the south brain.
Sorry but I am proof of believing men in general can and do have higher standards and nothing more. My husband can attest to all girl parts here.
There are exceptions to every rule of course but I just don't believe that all men are ruled by the south brain.
um, where exactly did I say "all men?" it doesn't matter how many times someone writes, and I don't mean "all" men, or "all" women, and yet, there is always someone who takes it that way? Why? Everyone has different experiences, I've had both good and bad..as I'm certain, Most, not all but most of us have had...my gosh, I know men who are good loyal men to their wives and friends, so?
So even a happily married man is in danger of throwing any rational thought out of his head and tossing his "friend" on the nearest flat surface as long as she's not ugly? I'm sorry I just don't believe that the majority of men are that kind of neanderthal. Sure, if both parties are in no other sort of relationship maybe but I guess I'd like to believe that men, in general, are better than dogs attracted to the nearest female butt.
The reason I believe this is that I have had male friends that I think are great people and I admire and perhaps even think they are good looking. I'm also in a relationship so I have no interest in doing the deed with them regardless if they would be or not. Zero. I also don't believe that women are somehow more magically evolved than men so I don't believe we have somehow higher standards. Your argument, to me, reeks of the "boys will be boys" mentality and I just don't buy that. There is no reason the male brain cannot operate on the same level mine does. It's not that hard. I'm not some sort of Mensa genius so the bar isn't impossibly high.
I personally do not sleep around. And, I never have sex without both myself and the woman having an STD test before we do anything. I have never had a 1 night stand before either. And, I do have control of myself.
But, I do believe that most guys will have sex in their brains when they are friends with an attractive woman. That is what I am saying. And, I have talked with other guys who agree with this, and even some women agree with this. They will be checking out the woman and will have sexual thoughts.
Can they control themselves and behave? Yes. But, it is harder to be platonic friends with a woman when she is hot.
I used to believe so, simply because I didn't think men and women were all that different from each other and I could certainly do it.
I really think the main reason is simply that men don't value non-sexual relationships with women enough to devote any significant time or resources to them. And to women, a real friendship (not just acquaintances getting together as part of a group or work friends) does take some time and effort. Men reserve that for sexual relationships and their guy friends - they don't put themselves out or extend themselves just to spend time with a platonic female friend. Most would rather veg out and play video games than make a lunch date with a female he has no chance of sex with!
I can’t. I already know that about myself & have for years. It doesn’t mean I’m going to have a romantic relationship with them; just sex. I mean; at least once! Thing is, I can have sex with a friend & still be friends but this messes with guys heads, so ... I don’t know, I guess I’m flawed.
If both of you are seeking a relationship, it can be difficult if the chemistry is there. If not, then there shouldn't be a problem. I have a lot of friends who are men and there is no problem because I am not available for that and keep it at that level.
um, where exactly did I say "all men?" it doesn't matter how many times someone writes, and I don't mean "all" men, or "all" women, and yet, there is always someone who takes it that way? Why? Everyone has different experiences, I've had both good and bad..as I'm certain, Most, not all but most of us have had...my gosh, I know men who are good loyal men to their wives and friends, so?
I wasn't arguing with you. The last statement were my words not yours.
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