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That's probably fair, although I don't know anything about the Charlotte School of Law. Is it a satellite campus of a university like Campbell?
Both cities have several seminaries, community colleges, tech schools and others like Creative Arts, for profit colleges like Strayer & DeVry, ITT, etc., and other smaller schools of similar ilk.
Here is some info I found on Colliers International. Ballantyne is actually the Highway 51 area. I will select certain areas. I am unfamilar with the Raleigh market so I'm not sure of the submarkets. If someone familar with Raleigh would not mind breaking that down that would be awesome.
The Charlotte School of Law is its own law school and not a satellite campus. There is also Art Institute of Charlotte and Johnson and Wales Campus here. Wake Forest has a business school here as well as Northeastern or Northwestern University.
Another figure to look over are the recent Department of Homeland Security stats for immigration. Keep in mind that these stats are for legal residents. I have attached the link as well. The figures I am listing are for the CSA definition as of 2010. So Charlotte will include Charlotte MSA and the micros of Albermarle, Chester, Lancaster, Lincolnton, Salisbury, Statesville-Mooresville, and Shelby. The Triangle will include Raleigh and Durham MSAs, and the micros of Dunn, Henderson, and Sanford. I was unable to add Oxford to the Triangle but its findings would still negligible in the overall picture. Some stats for the smaller micros were not disclosed in the itemizations so I have estimated. Where you see an asterisk feel free to challenge my findings but once again the results are negligible. These figure are for 2012. Charlotte total: 5,954
Europe: 407*
Asia and Oceania: 2,606*
Africa: 911*
Mexico: 530
Other North America: 836
South America: 652*
Unknown: 12
Triangle total: 5,286
Europe: 470*
Asia and Oceania: 2,334*
Africa: 1,073
Mexico: 515
Other North America:538
South America: 350
Unknown: 6
The Charlotte School of Law is its own law school and not a satellite campus. There is also Art Institute of Charlotte and Johnson and Wales Campus here. Wake Forest has a business school here as well as Northeastern or Northwestern University.
That's cool. Do we need to continue the education discussion or since we're talking about the Triangle vs the Charlotte region can we concede that one to the Triangle? In addition to Campbell's Law School satellite campus in downtown Raleigh there are, of course, the law schools at UNC and Duke (both ranked as some of the best in the country) and NC Central. Duke's Fuqua School of Business and UNC's Kenan-Flagler School of Business are also among the best, and then you get into med schools, engineering, etc, etc. Davidson is great, but other than that I don't think there's much education-wise in Charlotte that can compete with UNC, Duke, and State.
I think your figures are a little off for RTP. It's 22.5 million sq ft of built space (About RTP | The Research Triangle Park) and 39,000 full-time employees + 10,000 contract employees.
I think your figures are a little off for RTP. It's 22.5 million sq ft of built space (About RTP | The Research Triangle Park) and 39,000 full-time employees + 10,000 contract employees.
My sources were last edited in 2011 (the same year as your source). They all seem to be within 10% of each other. Also, I think it depends on the defined boundaries of the submarkets. Some publications might be defining "RTP" as more than what it officially is; some could be defining it as less. Take a close look at the OP's links and see if you can understand the Triangle's submarkets:
I've looked at both links and I'm still having difficulty with the Triangle. Maybe you can clear up some of my questions:
Where on that link is CBD Raleigh (downtown Raleigh), or is it included in the "Raleigh" submarket?
Is "RTP/RDU" suggesting that the airport submarket and RTP are the same; or are they being combined?
Is the "Raleigh" submarket everything inside of I-440/I-40?
Is the "North Raleigh" submarket everything north of I-440; south of I-540?
I suspect that "Glenwood/Creedmoor" is the Crabtree Valley area, but where does Crabtree end before it becomes "North Raleigh" or "Raleigh"?
It would be great if some of the Triangle posters could clear these things up before I comment on Raleigh/Durham's office market.
As for Charlotte, the OP's link made perfect sense (GREAT links BTW adavi215)!!! Charlotte is broken down into two "urban" markets (CBD and Midtown) and 10 "suburban" markets. The urban markets combined has nearly 27 million sq/ft of office. Just to compare, urban markets in places like Richmond are in the 17 million range while Denver's urban markets are close to 35 million.
That's cool. Do we need to continue the education discussion or since we're talking about the Triangle vs the Charlotte region can we concede that one to the Triangle? In addition to Campbell's Law School satellite campus in downtown Raleigh there are, of course, the law schools at UNC and Duke (both ranked as some of the best in the country) and NC Central. Duke's Fuqua School of Business and UNC's Kenan-Flagler School of Business are also among the best, and then you get into med schools, engineering, etc, etc. Davidson is great, but other than that I don't think there's much education-wise in Charlotte that can compete with UNC, Duke, and State.
I think we could. So far the schools you're referring to are in Mecklenburg county. We haven't looked at the schools surrounding it. One thing I do want to make clear is that I agree that the higher ed at the Triangle is more vast than Charlotte's. However, just like many people sleep on the Triangle on several things, higher ed is one where many people sleep on Charlotte.
For one, UNCC is the fastest growing school in the UNC system. As far as certain degrees go, due to state politics and the nature of the UNC systems certain Ph.D. programs are not going to be offered at UNCC. Besides that you also have the following schools
USC-Lancaster (Lancaster county, SC)
Winthrop University (Rock Hill,SC)
Gardner-Webb (Boiling Springs,NC Cleveland County)
Barber-Scotia College (Concord,NC not really worth mentioning but it is there)
Livingstone College (Salisbury,NC)
Catawba College (Salisbury,NC)
Wingate University (Wingate, NC Union County)
Art Institute of Charlotte
UNC Charlotte
Queens University of Charlotte
Johnson C. Smith University
Johnson and Wales University
Pfeffier University satellite campus
Northeastern Univeristy satellite campus
Wake Forest University Business School satellite campus
Charlotte School of Law
The professional schools missing from Charlotte are Dental and a medical school. Everything else is covered.
I've looked at both links and I'm still having difficulty with the Triangle. Maybe you can clear up some of my questions:
Where on that link is CBD Raleigh (downtown Raleigh), or is it included in the "Raleigh" submarket?
Is "RTP/RDU" suggesting that the airport submarket and RTP are the same; or are they being combined?
Is the "Raleigh" submarket everything inside of I-440/I-40?
Is the "North Raleigh" submarket everything north of I-440; south of I-540?
I suspect that "Glenwood/Creedmoor" is the Crabtree Valley area, but where does Crabtree end before it becomes "North Raleigh" or "Raleigh"?
It would be great if some of the Triangle posters could clear these things up before I comment on Raleigh/Durham's office market.
As for Charlotte, the OP's link made perfect sense (GREAT links BTW adavi215)!!! Charlotte is broken down into two "urban" markets (CBD and Midtown) and 10 "suburban" markets. The urban markets combined has nearly 27 million sq/ft of office. Just to compare, urban markets in places like Richmond are in the 17 million range while Denver's urban markets are close to 35 million.
I am having a hard time understanding the stats on the Triangle market as well. I figured they would separate them out from CBD Durham and Raleigh as well as the other suburban markets. One thing to also keep in mind is that the stats do not include medical office space. Also, the Midtown market includes two different midtown markets of Southend and Randolph. I am still trying to pinpoint the exact location of Midtown Randolph and Midtown Southend as they relate to official business districts. The office space on the RTP site doesn't add up to official numbers.
Shout out to the Triangle for fling their thing. Durham ranked 6th and Raleigh ranked 10th in attracting young professionals according to their criteria. Charlotte ranked decent at 33rd. Charlotte had some improvement to go in this area but you gotta give props to the Triangle. This is a boon for NC.
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Charlotte is broken down into two "urban" markets (CBD and Midtown) and 10 "suburban" markets. The urban markets combined has nearly 27 million sq/ft of office. Just to compare, urban markets in places like Richmond are in the 17 million range while Denver's urban markets are close to 35 million.
