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This looks similar to the new public housing in DT Raleigh as well.
DT Raleigh (and the city of Raleigh as a whole) is historically behind Charlotte when it comes to public housing redevelopments. This trend started in Charlotte (with BofA's help) back in the early 1990s with the redevelopment of Earle Village homes (now First Ward Place). Non-downtown areas such as Dalton Village saw a transformation as well.
Today, Raleigh is just getting started with the recent redevelopment of Chavis Heights and Capitol Park (combined units for these two are 145). Still though, one can easily look up the newer low income developments for both Charlotte and Raleigh and compare for themselves.
^^^This list does not include the numerous affordable section 8 rentals (many are nicer redevelopments too) being leased out by private investors. Think of it like this. You often brag about Raleigh having "more money and more education" than Charlotte. Well, if this is true, wouldn't you expect Charlotte to have MANY more low income options (and nicer ones at that)? Wouldn't you also expect Charlotte to have far better mass transit as well? My point is that Charlotte (specifically Meck county) probably has way more millionaires than Wake. However, we have far more folks getting food stamps too. Average them all up, and you get an area that is "less educated/lower income". You also get an area with a higher unemployment rate. All of these facts are connected to one another if one takes the time to look at the evidence. Here in Charlotte (like most cities), we have a higher percentage of working poor (thus, lowering our income, raising our crime rate and unemployment; and increasing our # of low income nicer units).
Raleigh (on the other hand) has little need for mass transit and nicer project housing (when compared to Charlotte). This is a good thing that many Raleighites are proud of. This is what many Raleighites mean when they say that Charlotte is "ghetto" and that "Raleigh is better". It's snobbery; that's Raleigh. I don't like snob-villes. Too bad Raleigh isn't more like Durham. If it was, I'd really dig your city.
Last edited by urbancharlotte; 10-31-2011 at 08:32 PM..
I'm curious about your projected numbers. For population, I am guessing you are comparing CSAs. For economies, I am less sure. Right now, the Triangle's CSA and Austin's CSA are approximately the same size in population. I find it hard to believe that the Triangle's economic output is 20 years behind it. If it's just Raleigh's economy, then I could buy that argument.
Raleigh's current 3 county MSA alone is projected to be nearing 1.9 million by 2030. To put that in perspective, Charlotte's MSA was 1.76 million in the 2010 Census. That is, of course, if the growth in Raleigh does't outstrip projections as it typically has.
If the Census designations don't change between now and 2030 (which is unlikely) the Triangle's CSA is currently projected to be 2,569,109 by the state of NC. That would put it ~165K above the 2010 Charlotte CSA. If Lee and Granville counties are added, that number is over 2.72 million. I suspect that Granville will be added to either the Raleigh or Durham MSA given the Growth of the Triangle and because it's adjacent to both core counties . As for Lee, Sanford is feeding more and more commuters to SW Wake County and RTP. With the opening of the Western Wake Freeway soon, I expect that to accelerate. I doubt other counties will be added because the Triangle & Triad CSAs abut each other in the other direction. Alamance County could be a wildcard though if the Triangle's faster growth affects its commuting patterns.
Wake County 1,414,333
Durham County 378,024
Johnston County 271,031 (this could be significantly higher)
Harnett County 188,250
Orange County 176,559
Chatham County 92,604 (this could be higher)
Person County 48,308
My projections are severely unscientific. I took the current MSA definition of Charlotte and Raleigh and the 2010 census growth from 2000 in population and GMP and cut that rate in half.I did this to account for slowdown from the recession and possible stagnation. U then multiplied this rate by 20to get my projection.probably not the most scientific but I wanted to be extremely conservative.
Point blank...Charlotte is much larger, progressive & ahead of Raleigh. Not saying that Raleigh is not a very nice size city cause it is...I have lived in both and have to say that Charlotte is light years ahead of Raleigh...Light Rail, Airport, City Center size...etc. Raleigh is very nice...but Charlotte is 1 up on Raleigh. The Triad is very nice too!
I'm curious about your projected numbers. For population, I am guessing you are comparing CSAs. For economies, I am less sure. Right now, the Triangle's CSA and Austin's CSA are approximately the same size in population. I find it hard to believe that the Triangle's economic output is 20 years behind it. If it's just Raleigh's economy, then I could buy that argument.
Raleigh's current 3 county MSA alone is projected to be nearing 1.9 million by 2030. To put that in perspective, Charlotte's MSA was 1.76 million in the 2010 Census. That is, of course, if the growth in Raleigh does't outstrip projections as it typically has.
If the Census designations don't change between now and 2030 (which is unlikely) the Triangle's CSA is currently projected to be 2,569,109 by the state of NC. That would put it ~165K above the 2010 Charlotte CSA. If Lee and Granville counties are added, that number is over 2.72 million. I suspect that Granville will be added to either the Raleigh or Durham MSA given the Growth of the Triangle and because it's adjacent to both core counties . As for Lee, Sanford is feeding more and more commuters to SW Wake County and RTP. With the opening of the Western Wake Freeway soon, I expect that to accelerate. I doubt other counties will be added because the Triangle & Triad CSAs abut each other in the other direction. Alamance County could be a wildcard though if the Triangle's faster growth affects its commuting patterns.
Wake County 1,414,333
Durham County 378,024
Johnston County 271,031 (this could be significantly higher)
Harnett County 188,250
Orange County 176,559
Chatham County 92,604 (this could be higher)
Person County 48,308
I found the projected numbers you were using and I also looked at SC figures as well. I do find some issue with them as I see you do as well. However perhaps it's good to be conservative. I also find it interesting that the largest county in Charlotte's MSA will be Union county. So the name for Charlotte could be Charlotte-Indian Trail-Concord. At any rate, these projections put Charlotte at just over 3.3 million. Although to be honest, I would like to see some economic projections for that time.
I think Wake County will overtake Mecklenburg County in population by 2015.
I agree, but this statement is a bit of a "half-truth". I say that because some folks might read the statement above and say "Wow, the Triangle is more populated than Charlotte now". Before I go any further into the old topic of Wake's population vs Meck's population, let's take a look at where they stood as of the 2010 census.
Clearly, Wake and Meck's populations would be different if the two had the same amount of land; but how different would those populations be? Take a look at the following map of Meck county. Notice the towns that are within 5 miles of the Meck county line (many of them border Meck county).
An 835 sq/mile Mecklenburg would take in quite a few of Charlotte's neighbors (Tega Cay, Fort Mill, Belmont, Mt. Holly, Concord, Harrisburg, Stallings, Indian Trail, Weddington). Meck would also gain the Charlotte-facing halves of Gastonia, Rock Hill, Kannapolis, and Monroe.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
296,223 people were just added to Meck county
230 sq/miles of land was just added to Meck county
^Such a larger Meck county DOES NOT exist in real life. However, if it did, here is how the two (Wake vs Meck) would have compared in the 2010 census.
Wake County
900,993 population
835 sq/miles land area
1,079 people per sq/mile density
Mecklenburg County (the larger version)
1,215,851 population
754 sq/miles land area
1,613 people per sq/mile density
Keep this in mind when Wake county becomes "North Carolina's most populated county" in about 3 years. We'll be down here in Charlotte clapping and cheering for our beautiful state capital city. However, most of us (especially us forum nerds) know the truth.
I think wake county will also pass Mecklenburg soon. I find it interesting that Mecklenburg is more dense than Wake county but Raleigh is more dense than Charlotte. I found a thread in another forum which has estimates of metropolitan areas and states. Charlotte msa is at 1.8million. I'm sorry raleighites but I don't know Raleigh's.
I think wake county will also pass Mecklenburg soon. I find it interesting that Mecklenburg is more dense than Wake county but Raleigh is more dense than Charlotte. I found a thread in another forum which has estimates of metropolitan areas and states. Charlotte msa is at 1.8million. I'm sorry raleighites but I don't know Raleigh's.
Raleigh's 3 county MSA (without Durham) is sitting just south of 1.2 million. I think it was 1.197. Needless to say, most of that is Wake County alone.
I agree, but this statement is a bit of a "half-truth". I say that because some folks might read the statement above and say "Wow, the Triangle is more populated than Charlotte now". Before I go any further into the old topic of Wake's population vs Meck's population, let's take a look at where they stood as of the 2010 census.
Clearly, Wake and Meck's populations would be different if the two had the same amount of land; but how different would those populations be? Take a look at the following map of Meck county. Notice the towns that are within 5 miles of the Meck county line (many of them border Meck county).
An 835 sq/mile Mecklenburg would take in quite a few of Charlotte's neighbors (Tega Cay, Fort Mill, Belmont, Mt. Holly, Concord, Harrisburg, Stallings, Indian Trail, Weddington). Meck would also gain the Charlotte-facing halves of Gastonia, Rock Hill, Kannapolis, and Monroe.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
296,223 people were just added to Meck county
230 sq/miles of land was just added to Meck county
^Such a larger Meck county DOES NOT exist in real life. However, if it did, here is how the two (Wake vs Meck) would have compared in the 2010 census.
Wake County
900,993 population
835 sq/miles land area
1,079 people per sq/mile density
Mecklenburg County (the larger version)
1,215,851 population
754 sq/miles land area
1,613 people per sq/mile density
Keep this in mind when Wake county becomes "North Carolina's most populated county" in about 3 years. We'll be down here in Charlotte clapping and cheering for our beautiful state capital city. However, most of us (especially us forum nerds) know the truth.
If we are going to play in the world of fiction and redraw county lines to emphasize density, then Wake can chop off its northern, Eastern and Southern sections and annex Durham.
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