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Old 05-12-2007, 05:26 PM
 
Location: Some got six month some got one solid. But me and my buddies all got lifetime here
4,551 posts, read 9,273,395 times
Reputation: 2121

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[quote=kiwi1;700468]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carolina_native View Post
Unfortunately it appears we cannot have a thread about this subject without someone bringing charges of racism into it.

I dont think its too much to ask of anyone to have people speak English in America, Spanish in Spain, German in Germany, Russian in Russia, etc..


To say to someone 'your in america, speak english' is extremely rude and ignorant. You have no idea of the person's situation or why they are talking their native language. They may be tourists, or exchange students. Is it only spanish speakers who get this or would french, german speakers get it as well? My husband speaks spanish with our children and I speak english. This is so our children do not lose one of their 'family' languages, and so they can talk with their grandma and cousins back in Puerto Rico who do not speak English. How would you feel if you were a tourist overseas and someone said 'your in france, speak french', or 'your in japan, speak japanese'? Always good to try to put the foot on the other shoe.
If you're a tourist that's one thing. If you're living here permanently, speak English. It doesn't get any simpler than that. I would expect myself to learn another country's language if I had decided to move overseas. So many people on this board talk about moving from some other state to NC and talk about "blending in", "do as they do in the south", anything having to do with conforming. The same should go for languages. If you're living here permanently it should be a requirement regardless of that person's situation.
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Old 05-12-2007, 05:31 PM
 
Location: Wake Forest
3,124 posts, read 11,664,387 times
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[quote=BrianH1970;707894]
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwi1 View Post

If you're a tourist that's one thing. If you're living here permanently, speak English. It doesn't get any simpler than that. I would expect myself to learn another country's language if I had decided to move overseas. So many people on this board talk about moving from some other state to NC and talk about "blending in", "do as they do in the south", anything having to do with conforming. The same should go for languages. If you're living here permanently it should be a requirement regardless of that person's situation.
And how long are you going to give them to learn? Are you going to take in mind aptitude, ability and how many hours they are working or just say, you have 5 months....if you aren't fluent, leave.

I don't know any immigrant that doesn't know some English, often they are embarrassed to speak it since they know they aren't too good with it yet. I also know some that would like to take classes, but they are working 12 hours a day....doesn't leave much time.

I also know of a old woman from Russia that has lived here for 40 years, and and she still speaks badly broken English. She was too busy raising her family and helping her husband run his business (she did the book work) when she came over as an adult. Should we boot her out as well since she didn't learn?
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Old 05-12-2007, 05:42 PM
 
Location: Some got six month some got one solid. But me and my buddies all got lifetime here
4,551 posts, read 9,273,395 times
Reputation: 2121
[quote=Desdemona123;707911]
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianH1970 View Post

And how long are you going to give them to learn? Are you going to take in mind aptitude, ability and how many hours they are working or just say, you have 5 months....if you aren't fluent, leave.

I don't know any immigrant that doesn't know some English, often they are embarrassed to speak it since they know they aren't too good with it yet. I also know some that would like to take classes, but they are working 12 hours a day....doesn't leave much time.

I also know of a old woman from Russia that has lived here for 40 years, and and she still speaks badly broken English. She was too busy raising her family and helping her husband run his business (she did the book work) when she came over as an adult. Should we boot her out as well since she didn't learn?
It's not much to ask anyone crossing into this country to live that you should have a basic grasp of the English language within a year. If you can't hack that for whatever reason, then I'm sorry. It becomes more of a problem when you don't give people the incentive to learn to speak English. How many sales jobs do you see a "bilingual required"? Why should that even be????? Because a group of people are either too lazy or refuse to learn the language? Because some family had a hard go at it in their own country, fled to here, and for whatever reason won't do it? The result is that it becomes divisive. Just look around the NY or NJ board. Look at the people who are leaving Brooklyn partially because of the Russian contingent who won't learn the language. It's wrong and if they can't learn it, back they go.

As far as the people you're referring to, I'm sorry for their situation but they should be held to the same standards that we'd like to hold everyone to. Learn the language. Put yourself in the position to do so...either learn it before coming here or make sure you have the time to learn it while you're here.

If you think that's asking too much, then there's not much more I can add to this.
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Old 05-13-2007, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Austin TX
959 posts, read 4,159,762 times
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I think it's hypocritical of most people who expect that immigrants should be speaking English fluently. I grew up mostly overseas and in my experience Americans are the least likely to learn the local language, and many live in foreign countries for far longer than one year. I've lived in the US since I hit adulthood so I can't say what I would do if living in a country that had a native language I was completely unfamiliar with. My parents never took formal classes for the languages of countries we lived in but they always learned the basics and could communicate as needed. My dad worked away for weeks at a time and it wasn't practical for him to do so. My mom (and I) took French classes all the years we were overseas. There's a language I've never needed Spanish is very useful for an American to learn. Whether you like it or not, our neighboring countries speak Spanish and English, and since we all speak English by default that leaves Spanish as the most practical language to learn for domestic businesses.
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Old 05-13-2007, 01:34 PM
 
Location: Some got six month some got one solid. But me and my buddies all got lifetime here
4,551 posts, read 9,273,395 times
Reputation: 2121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indigoblue View Post
I think it's hypocritical of most people who expect that immigrants should be speaking English fluently. I grew up mostly overseas and in my experience Americans are the least likely to learn the local language, and many live in foreign countries for far longer than one year. I've lived in the US since I hit adulthood so I can't say what I would do if living in a country that had a native language I was completely unfamiliar with. My parents never took formal classes for the languages of countries we lived in but they always learned the basics and could communicate as needed. My dad worked away for weeks at a time and it wasn't practical for him to do so. My mom (and I) took French classes all the years we were overseas. There's a language I've never needed Spanish is very useful for an American to learn. Whether you like it or not, our neighboring countries speak Spanish and English, and since we all speak English by default that leaves Spanish as the most practical language to learn for domestic businesses.
For the record I never said to speak it fluently, I said a basic grasp. That's all. However nobody in this country should be required to learn anyone else's language for either college, a potential position, anything. I could care less what our neighboring countries speak. If I'm going to live there, then I damn well better respect that country's traditions and customs and at least have a basic grasp of the language, certainly enough to get by. Living here? Learn this one. What irks me is the people who just won't learn the language for whatever reason.

And you know what happens? You get ethnic groups that segregate themselves socially from the rest of society. That's not blending in, that's "you have your own space and I have mine". And it may seem all well and good until the jobs where being bilingual are required come into play. Or until they go to ask for help in an area where people don't know Spanish (or whatever language).

Yeah, right....
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Old 05-14-2007, 12:02 PM
 
448 posts, read 1,708,046 times
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WOW! and I thought this link was regarding hispanics and their different origins. Not the usual I HATE LATINS crap. For the record, I am Cuban, and it is sad that all hispanics are arranged together under one category. The only thing that a Mexican and I have in common is that we speak the same language. It is similar to me thinking that white americans and black americans are the same and come from the same origins. I know this would upset alot of people.
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Old 05-30-2007, 06:59 AM
 
1 posts, read 2,163 times
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Smile confesion

Quote:
Originally Posted by cylenay View Post
Nothing against the Mexicans but are there any other Hispanics here in NC? Just moved here a year ago and seems like Hispanic is synonym for Mexican! They aren't the only hispanics here, are they?????
Yea Im mexican but it sort of offends me when I go to the mall or something and people just seem to call all mexicans hispanic like blaming everything on us. And I would like to hear someone to say that wer're not the only hispanics in america.
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Old 05-30-2007, 08:22 AM
 
1,398 posts, read 6,115,898 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fastfilm View Post
We have so many illegals and other residents in Los Angeles who believe no knowledge of the English language is ever going to be needed in their lives. Rather than reaching out to others for help in acquisition of an admittedly difficult language, situations we as tourists know can prompt mutual understanding, they insist upon xenophobic insularity and outright contempt of all others not from "their home country."

Insofar as the U.S. is peopled with folks from all over the globe who have coalesced into our American culture, speaking English remains utterly necessray for inclusiveness of all, "e pluribus unum." It should not be requisite to be a professional linguist to converse with one's own neighbors, which on my block would involve knowing six different languages. It should not be necessary to converse in a foreign language in a general, non-specialty store in the U.S. Regular chain stores here have personnel with no knowledge of English. They could care less, and don't hesitate to make it known to you.
I hope we're not moving from the frying pan into the fire. One of the main reasons we are leaving our home of five decades, Los Angeles, and planning on heading to your gorgeous state is that, outside of its richest enclaves, no one in Los Angeles speaks or understands English.

Life in a "worst case scenario" of foreign nationals who despise Americans here in our own country is a depressing one. Since I don't live in a rich area of L.A., I miss being able to converse with people, people from my own country or people from all parts of the world who've relocated here, born and naturalized citizens alike.

Brian H is utterly on the mark about the segregation of those who choose never to embrace the fabric of American life by insisting upon their separate, Balkanized existence once here: that's the very definition of the current status of Los Angeles. Desdemona's comment about all immigrant's trying to learn English sadly would be wholly inapplicable here. Indigo, there's another country contiguous to the U.S. that would like to speak French and do business in same with you

I would love being neighbors and friends with all the posters here, NC natives and Americans of whatever descent. We may agree or disagree, but at least we could communicate. At least, I hope that's still the case in NC...
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Old 05-30-2007, 10:36 AM
 
Location: Fort Mill, SC (Charlotte 'burb)
4,730 posts, read 17,765,382 times
Reputation: 1008
Most Europeans didn't learn any native dialect when they invaded N. America, why should we expect anyone else to do the same? As a reminder, we have no official language in this country.
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Old 05-30-2007, 11:11 AM
 
89 posts, read 255,505 times
Reputation: 27
Default Wow!!

Where to start!

Every time I read these types of post I am truly appalled. I find it amazing how much bickering and disgrace is put upon race, ethnicity, and language. I am a Hispanic-American; and of Puerto Rican decent. On our island there are many Mulatos, Europeans, and descendents of Native Americans as well. This is not history; just info. I find it so shameful how even on these forums people of Hispanic origin are at each other; and people of other origins are putting them down as well.

People need to start reading census predictions, local papers, and listening to congress, and the news. In the next 20 years Hispanics are going to consist of the vast majority in this country; Hispanics of all descents. We need to work together to educate and accept one another. In addition to educating others about who we are. Unlike African/Blacks we are a group that comes from many different areas of the world; not just one place. We spend so much time finding faults with everyone; instead of finding acceptance. No one wants to be considered Mexican; because of immigration issues. Cubans don't want to be considered Puerto Rican and the list goes on... Regardless of what Hispanic origin we are we need to UNITE and educate our cultures to adapt to the American way of living if not we will all face this prejudice for the rest of eternity!

Remember no one is from here; but everyone wants to be here.

So many people don’t know their history; or the true history behind AMERICA; people think this is their land. When in reality this land belonged to the Native Americans; who today many are suffering in great poverty; not all but the majority. Their people were robbed, enslaved, lied to, cheated, and this list can go on and on as well. Can you all imagine how they feel; this racism issue SUCKS!!! On top of this it doesn’t seem to be getting better. I hear more hatred today than ever before; so many people from minority groups hate whites, whites feel that their space is being invaded, etc… etc…

The worst part is that everyone today suffers for decisions that their ancestors before them made. This includes whites, blacks, Asians, Hispanics, etc…

As for the topic on the native language; we could all point fingers at which is correct and which is not. Last time I looked this is "AMERICA" the land of the FREE!! Which gives us all the right to practice which ever language and religion we choose; therefore you can choose to complain if you like but I doubt it will make any difference. People will learn English if they want or learn Spanish if they want to communicate with this large influx of people arriving to this country.

There is no perfection in any race or culture, not the white, black, Asian, Hispanic, etc...

The only difference is that the Hispanic culture is growing rapidly here and no one is ready for it. The whole country is trying to teach and promote Spanish education to help cope with the changes.

So people lets find more positive ways to vent our confusion, frustration, and lack of understanding. Placing blame fixes nothing; it just exacerbates a situation.

The Hispanic culture is BEAUTIFUL and has so many wonderful things to offer AMERICA; yes it has it faults but so does every other one. Like every other culture here there are many of us that are educated hard working, and great people. If you look at large urban cities you will see that many Universities and Colleges are graduating many Hispanics on all educational levels; this is the goal we need to aim for. Education changes routines, frame of thoughts, patterns, and even traditions!

REMINDER THIS IS MY OPINION; not a DEBATE!

Thanks for reading
Jessica
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