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Old 04-25-2007, 02:05 PM
 
Location: Arizona
362 posts, read 1,243,234 times
Reputation: 225

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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovesMountains View Post
Well said. Most cities and states grow slowly over a long period of time and people adjust gradually. We have had such mega growth it's been a little like finding out you are pregnant and the next week the baby is born!!
Hi Loves! While I always enjoy your posts, I have to disagree with you here!

Most cities and states do, in fact, experience occasional periods of growth bursts, at some point in time. Most cities do not continually grow slowly and steadily forever. If they did, cities would all have similar amounts of development and similar populations, which obviously isn't true. As soon as a city/state is deemed "desirable" (for whatever reason -- strong economy, good weather, low cost of living, low taxes, real estate values, etc) by the national population, it will start to experience rapid growth. It's very basic logic, and it's a phenomenon that will continue to happen indefinitely.

The local and national economies and real estate markets, national population growth, local and national weather and natural disasters, etc, commonly dictate which cities/states will experience rapid growth at any given time. There are cities all over the country (Phoenix is one of them) that are currently experiencing the same things you are...very rapid growth in a short time, with all the physical, emotional and economic problems that come along with the quick development. In fact, Charlotte is right where Phoenix was about five years ago. Many other cities have gone through this in the past, during the 1980's, 60's, 30's and so on. Some cities (like NYC) experience multiple periods of rapid growth during their histories. Still, other cities have yet to experience any periods of very rapid growth, but will most likely experience this at some point in the near or distant future.

Just like the economy fluctuates, population fluctuates, too. We go through population booms every couple decades. Once those "boomers" are adults, they move on to other cities/states to start their own families, thus causing rapid growth in the then-desirable places that have low cost of living, coupled with a strong/growing economy, etc (like Charlotte does now). Once those places are filled to almost-capacity and are not as universally desirable anymore, the masses start moving to different, usually smaller cities, which in turn, experience a growth spurt. Its just how it is. Almost every large city has experienced a rapid growth period at some point during its development, like Charlotte is experiencing currently. The locals ALWAYS feel the same way you're feeling now. Either they're unhappy about the commercial development "ruining" the natural environment, the "immigrants" who "invade" their beloved space, the rise in real estate costs and taxes, the changes to their "way of life," etc. Charlotte is not at all unique in its current situation, and the locals in the cities that undergo rapid growth and development ALWAYS feel resentment, anger, and sadness over their changing communities and its newcomers.

All that aside, I truly understand how the local Charlotteans feel. LovesMountains, you know I've sided with the locals before. I feel your pain...I really do! I've gone through it before. I'm just trying to point out that, while I understand why you're upset over what's happening to your community, and I really do sympathize with you (I wish Charlotte could remain a nice, laid-back, southern town when I move there later this year, too), it's just something that's going to happen no matter what. The same things that made you love Charlotte so much were inevitably going to start appealing to the masses at some point. Charlotte's low real estate prices (especially in today's market) and strong economy are drawimg people away from their own overcrowded, expensive cities, and into Charlotte. It's better to embrace the inevitable changes that Charlotte is experiencing and is going to experience in the future, instead of "mourning" or being sad or whining and complaining about them. Take pride in the fact that you found that place first, and that you contributed to its overall desirability to the rest of the country's population. There really is no sense in "mourning" over its changes.

The op asked for ideas, and I've given him plenty of them. I've also suggested that it's going to happen no matter what, and its better for everyone involved if the locals just accept the changes Charlotte is going through. "Mourning," resenting, whining (I stand by my statement...there is a difference between stating that one is sad about what's happening, and just flat-out complaining about it), and/or being depressed will not help the locals feel better about the changes Charlotte is experiencing. In fact, it will probably just fuel your anger and resentment toward the changes and the newcomers, making it even more difficult for you to be accepting of them, and eventually being happy in your city again. Embracing the changes, being excited about what the future holds for your great city, smiling about the past and just accepting that it is, in fact, the past, will all help the locals to cope better than complaining and being sad.

It's silly to think that the locals in any city could keep their "perfect place" a secret from the rest of the population forever. People want to move to Charlotte for the same reasons that you love(d) it there. Many of the newcomers just don't realize that after a few years of following the masses to places like Charlotte, the city will be changed to something different than the city they originally moved to and fell in love with. It won't necessarily be changed in a bad way, but it will, in fact, be changed. Charlotte is just experiencing what almost every other major city has experienced at some point during its development.

Better to just accept it, deal with it, and move on with your life in your "new" city.
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Old 04-25-2007, 02:15 PM
 
Location: Charlotte
16 posts, read 49,426 times
Reputation: 12
I don't many like growth because everything gets congested. With that being said. The downside to living in NC is that it is so nice. That is why people are attracted here. I sell investment land all over the state and the market has never been better. This is the only place I have ever lived that no one says they cannot wait to leave.
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Old 04-25-2007, 02:34 PM
 
Location: Up above the world so high!
45,270 posts, read 88,302,020 times
Reputation: 39844
Quote:
Originally Posted by AOYAS View Post
Hi Loves! While I always enjoy your posts, I have to disagree with you here!

Most cities and states do, in fact, experience occasional periods of growth bursts, at some point in time. Most cities do not continually grow slowly and steadily forever. If they did, cities would all have similar amounts of development and similar populations, which obviously isn't true. As soon as a city/state is deemed "desirable" (for whatever reason -- strong economy, good weather, low cost of living, low taxes, real estate values, etc) by the national population, it will start to experience rapid growth. It's very basic logic, and it's a phenomenon that will continue to happen indefinitely.

The local and national economies and real estate markets, national population growth, local and national weather and natural disasters, etc, commonly dictate which cities/states will experience rapid growth at any given time. There are cities all over the country (Phoenix is one of them) that are currently experiencing the same things you are...very rapid growth in a short time, with all the physical, emotional and economic problems that come along with the quick development. In fact, Charlotte is right where Phoenix was about five years ago. Many other cities have gone through this in the past, during the 1980's, 60's, 30's and so on. Some cities (like NYC) experience multiple periods of rapid growth during their histories. Still, other cities have yet to experience any periods of very rapid growth, but will most likely experience this at some point in the near or distant future.

Just like the economy fluctuates, population fluctuates, too. We go through population booms every couple decades. Once those "boomers" are adults, they move on to other cities/states to start their own families, thus causing rapid growth in the then-desirable places that have low cost of living, coupled with a strong/growing economy, etc (like Charlotte does now). Once those places are filled to almost-capacity and are not as universally desirable anymore, the masses start moving to different, usually smaller cities, which in turn, experience a growth spurt. Its just how it is. Almost every large city has experienced a rapid growth period at some point during its development, like Charlotte is experiencing currently. The locals ALWAYS feel the same way you're feeling now. Either they're unhappy about the commercial development "ruining" the natural environment, the "immigrants" who "invade" their beloved space, the rise in real estate costs and taxes, the changes to their "way of life," etc. Charlotte is not at all unique in its current situation, and the locals in the cities that undergo rapid growth and development ALWAYS feel resentment, anger, and sadness over their changing communities and its newcomers.

All that aside, I truly understand how the local Charlotteans feel. LovesMountains, you know I've sided with the locals before. I feel your pain...I really do! I've gone through it before. I'm just trying to point out that, while I understand why you're upset over what's happening to your community, and I really do sympathize with you (I wish Charlotte could remain a nice, laid-back, southern town when I move there later this year, too), it's just something that's going to happen no matter what. The same things that made you love Charlotte so much were inevitably going to start appealing to the masses at some point. Charlotte's low real estate prices (especially in today's market) and strong economy are drawimg people away from their own overcrowded, expensive cities, and into Charlotte. It's better to embrace the inevitable changes that Charlotte is experiencing and is going to experience in the future, instead of "mourning" or being sad or whining and complaining about them. Take pride in the fact that you found that place first, and that you contributed to its overall desirability to the rest of the country's population. There really is no sense in "mourning" over its changes.

The op asked for ideas, and I've given him plenty of them. I've also suggested that it's going to happen no matter what, and its better for everyone involved if the locals just accept the changes Charlotte is going through. "Mourning," resenting, whining (I stand by my statement...there is a difference between stating that one is sad about what's happening, and just flat-out complaining about it), and/or being depressed will not help the locals feel better about the changes Charlotte is experiencing. In fact, it will probably just fuel your anger and resentment toward the changes and the newcomers, making it even more difficult for you to be accepting of them, and eventually being happy in your city again. Embracing the changes, being excited about what the future holds for your great city, smiling about the past and just accepting that it is, in fact, the past, will all help the locals to cope better than complaining and being sad.

It's silly to think that the locals in any city could keep their "perfect place" a secret from the rest of the population forever. People want to move to Charlotte for the same reasons that you love(d) it there. Many of the newcomers just don't realize that after a few years of following the masses to places like Charlotte, the city will be changed to something different than the city they originally moved to and fell in love with. It won't necessarily be changed in a bad way, but it will, in fact, be changed. Charlotte is just experiencing what almost every other major city has experienced at some point during its development.

Better to just accept it, deal with it, and move on with your life in your "new" city.

WOAH Aoyas, lol -
Did you have one too many cups of coffee this afternoon???

Whew...let me catch my breath.

Okay, all my tiny little post was meant to say was that for those of us who have lived here for a long time the explosion of growth has been difficult to adjust to sometimes. Since we grew so rapidly, almost overnight if feels like, it has been too much change too quickly for some. That's why you get 9 months of pregnancy, to mentally and physically prepare for the birth of your baby. Some of us just felt totally unprepared for all that is happening now, that's all.

I believe I have always been very welcoming of the newcomers flocking here. I wouldn't be posting on citydata every day if I didn't want to help them! I am not so shallow as to believe this should all be mine and no one else should have the right to the great quality of life I enjoy. I get dismayed however when I witness acts of disrespect toward the city and state I love by those coming from somewhere else, makes me feel taken advantage of for being so welcoming in the first place.

And knowing that long time citizens are being displaced by the grow makes me sad for them. Yes, most of us know life is about change and that change is inevitable, but that doesn't mean we can't mourn for what we used to have when what we have now is less satisfying. Most of us will eventully adjust, or just move away, but until then, try a little kindness

All that being said, you are correct in your analysis of the trends in growth of cities - good job on that
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Old 04-25-2007, 02:42 PM
 
Location: Arizona
362 posts, read 1,243,234 times
Reputation: 225
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovesMountains View Post
WOAH Aoyas, lol -
Did you have one too many cups of coffee this afternoon???

Whew...let me catch my breath.

Okay, all my tiny little post was meant to say was that for those of us who have lived here for a long time the explosion of growth has been difficult to adjust to sometimes. Since we grew so rapidly, almost overnight if feels like, it has been too much change too quickly for some. That's why you get 9 months of pregnancy, to mentally and physically prepare for the birth of your baby. Some of us just felt totally unprepared for all that is happening now, that's all.

I believe I have always been very welcoming of the newcomers flocking here. I wouldn't be posting on citydata every day if I didn't want to help them! I am not so shallow as to believe this should all be mine and no one else should have the right to the great quality of life I enjoy. I get dismayed however when I witness acts of disrespect toward the city and state I love by those coming from somewhere else, makes me feel taken advantage of for being so welcoming in the first place.

And knowing that long time citizens are being displaced by the grow makes me sad for them. Yes, most of us know life is about change and that change is inevitable, but that doesn't mean we can't mourn for what we used to have when what we have now is less satisfying. Most of us will eventully adjust, or just move away, but until then, try a little kindness
Hi Loves! LOL...yeah, I guess I wrote you a novel, huh? I'm a writer by profession, and I guess that sometimes I forget city-data generally likes it short and sweet.

Seriously, though, I know what you're saying. I feel sorry for you Charlotte locals, too. Remember my post a while back about the northeasterners and how many people feel they're changing Charlotte to mimic New Jersey/New York (which is generally not a good thing, for anyone not from NJ/NY, and especially for native Charlotteans)?

You know I feel your pain. I'm sorry you all have to go through this. I had to do it, too, over the years. Heck, I'm dealing with it right now here in Phoenix. It's very difficult and it sucks. I also know that it's much much easier to accept it and move on, than to live in the past, mourning over your "losses" and the changes happening around you. I was just trying to help y'all adjust quicker and easier.

Good luck!
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Old 04-25-2007, 02:46 PM
 
Location: Up above the world so high!
45,270 posts, read 88,302,020 times
Reputation: 39844
Quote:
Originally Posted by AOYAS View Post
Hi Loves! LOL...yeah, I guess I wrote you a novel, huh? I'm a writer by profession, and I guess that sometimes I forget city-data generally likes it short and sweet.

Seriously, though, I know what you're saying. I feel sorry for you Charlotte locals, too. Remember my post a while back about the northeasterners and how many people feel they're changing Charlotte to mimic New Jersey/New York (which is generally not a good thing, for anyone not from NJ/NY, and especially for native Charlotteans)?

You know I feel your pain. I'm sorry you all have to go through this. I had to do it, too, years back in my home city. It's very difficult and it sucks. I also know that it's much much easier to accept it and move on, than to live in the past, mourning over your "losses" and the changes happening around you. I was just trying to help y'all adjust quicker and easier.

Good luck!
LOL, you remind me of my husband - the king of "just give me the bottom line!" He too will not mourn the passing a things, but only look forward with an open attitude to what is new. Some people are just better at doing that than others. I think the older people get, the harder it sometimes is to adjust. Like I said, eventually those of us in mourning will either begin to die off, move or just adjust and learn to love the "new" North Carolina.
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Old 04-25-2007, 03:08 PM
 
197 posts, read 874,842 times
Reputation: 144
AOYAS - I am not sure what you disagree with? The fact that some of us are mourning the fact that our state is changing? We know its a fact a life, we don't need you to keep pointing out that it's happnening no matter what.
Would you tell someone whose family member had died that they shouldn't mourn and they needed to "deal with it"? Seems to me that you need to deal with the fact that people are entitled to their feelings, whether you think they are justified or not. The fact is we are all "dealing with it" by virtue of the fact that we are living with it on a daily basis. This doesn't mean we don't like the people who are moving here, and don't recognize there are some positives -- give us a little credit.

By the way, The Raleigh N&O had an article today http://www.newsobserver.com/102/story/567603.html (broken link)
that 2 million acres of forest and farmland will be lost in NC in the next 20 years. Since 1987, we have lost almost that much to development. Seems we are not the only people "mourning." There are initiatives in place to try and protect some land so that all is not lost to development. Bills in the NC House and Senate to approve $1 billion bond to buy and preserve hundreds of thousands of acres.

There are currently 23 land trusts in NC that people contribute land to or give conservation easements so that all is not lost to development. For more info: http://www.ctnc.org/ltmap.htm (broken link)
Maybe you should visit some of their websites and see why there is a huge effort in NC to protect land so all is not developed.

I guess a lot of people don't want to "embrace" this change and see every last bit of land developed. Please deal with it.
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Old 04-25-2007, 04:16 PM
 
1 posts, read 2,212 times
Reputation: 10
O.K now I feel guilty about looking to relocate from Suffolk County ( Long Island ,NY); The land of insanely high taxes, traffic nightmares and over growth. I am just tired of the long winters and high taxes, but I don't want to burden another area. I do look on the bright side; as a RN
I am usually welcome due the short suppy of my profession.
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Old 04-25-2007, 04:29 PM
 
Location: between here and there
1,030 posts, read 2,766,426 times
Reputation: 935
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCSC View Post
AOYAS - I am not sure what you disagree with? The fact that some of us are mourning the fact that our state is changing? We know its a fact a life, we don't need you to keep pointing out that it's happnening no matter what.
Would you tell someone whose family member had died that they shouldn't mourn and they needed to "deal with it"? Seems to me that you need to deal with the fact that people are entitled to their feelings, whether you think they are justified or not. The fact is we are all "dealing with it" by virtue of the fact that we are living with it on a daily basis. This doesn't mean we don't like the people who are moving here, and don't recognize there are some positives -- give us a little credit. I guess a lot of people don't want to "embrace" this change and see every last bit of land developed. Please deal with it.
I have to agree......I was a bit taken aback that NC residents/natives posting their distress at the loss of state acreage to development were told to "deal with it" and "quit whining about it".....a second slap in the face IMO.....take a step back for a moment from such analytical thinking and allow people to feel an emotional response to what's happening to their home state which IS, in most ways unstoppable: putting the genie back in the bottle is not an option anymore......

Southerners have always had a genteelness that defines them and that is undoubtedly being upended by the influx of transplants, mostly from the north, who do everything in warp speed with our (yes, I'm a northerner) "me, me, me" attitude of entitlement....it appears the north and south kept their polite distances prior to this mass exodus so the fears and concerns and sadness and if you must, "whining" (IMO, one of the most passively insulting words in the English language) on the part of NC natives is justified and should be allowed in order to facilitate the acceptance of THEIR NC being altered forever....

"Dealing with it" will be inevitable........

Lamenting it is only human........

Last edited by Fallingwater79; 04-25-2007 at 05:40 PM..
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Old 04-25-2007, 04:38 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
244 posts, read 959,104 times
Reputation: 74
TILover, I think what your feeling is very understandable. If it's any source of comfort, it's really happening everywhere. The town I grew up in (in NJ) and still live in has changed completely, all the farms are gone, tons of development, and we got an influx of New Yorkers (I'm in NJ).

I knew that I would have to go with the flow of it, because things change, times change, if there is an opportunity, everyone is entitled to better their lives, etc.

I think the word mentioned above "mourn" is a really good description for what many of us feel when our world changes all around us in ways we really wish they wouldn't (crowds, growth, pollution, traffic, etc).
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Old 04-25-2007, 04:59 PM
 
59 posts, read 188,500 times
Reputation: 33
Quote:
AOYAS - I am not sure what you disagree with? The fact that some of us are mourning the fact that our state is changing? We know its a fact a life, we don't need you to keep pointing out that it's happnening no matter what. Would you tell someone whose family member had died that they shouldn't mourn and they needed to "deal with it"? Seems to me that you need to deal with the fact that people are entitled to their feelings, whether you think they are justified or not. The fact is we are all "dealing with it" by virtue of the fact that we are living with it on a daily basis. This doesn't mean we don't like the people who are moving here, and don't recognize there are some positives -- give us a little credit.
Quote:
Very well said! I was a bit taken aback that NC longtime residents posting their distress at the loss of state acreage to development was met with "deal with it" and "quit whining about it".....a second slap in the face IMO.....take a step back from the analytical thinking and allow people to feel an emotional response to what's happening to NC which in many ways is unstoppable: putting the genie back in the bottle is not an option......
Thank you both. You just articulated what I couldn't. I am no good with message boards Seriously, though, I don't want an analytical explanation for any of this. That doesn't really make me feel better. What makes me feel better is knowing there are others that have the same concerns that I do, and knowing there are some people taking action to make sure things don't get TOO out of control (thanks for the informative link on the land trusts, NCSC). I don't mean that I want to keep this place to myself forever - that is foolish and selfish - but what I want to see is strategic planning to deal with this.

Quote:
O.K now I feel guilty about looking to relocate from Suffolk County ( Long Island ,NY); The land of insanely high taxes, traffic nightmares and over growth. I am just tired of the long winters and high taxes, but I don't want to burden another area. I do look on the bright side; as a RN
I am usually welcome due the short suppy of my profession.
Please don't feel guilty. That's not my point of this. I want to welcome any newcomers here and I want you to enjoy this state because it's wonderful and I can't blame you for wanting to get away from the tiring conditions where you live. In fact, people who want to get away from that lifestyle are a benefit here, because I'd think they'd try to preserve their quality of life here so it doesn't turn into what they're trying to get away from (hello run-on sentence, but you see my point?) And RNs are always welcome in my book :-D
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