Mayors give city positive reviews (Scranton, Archbald: renting, new house, teaching jobs)

[NYRangers 2008]

Paul, you also have to remember that in New York there are more jobs and more better paying jobs than up here. So even though you pay higher taxes, you prob. would be making more. I would love to move back to Long Island, but I simply cannot afford it. That's why my cousins are considering a move to San Antonio, TX. Prob a better quality of life there and much cheaper. There are parts of LI that are beautiful, but its got it's fair share of bad neighborhoods too.

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by NYRangers 2008

Paul, you also have to remember that in New York there are more jobs and more better paying jobs than up here. So even though you pay higher taxes, you prob. would be making more. I would love to move back to Long Island, but I simply cannot afford it. That's why my cousins are considering a move to San Antonio, TX. Prob a better quality of life there and much cheaper. There are parts of LI that are beautiful, but its got it's fair share of bad neighborhoods too.

I'm just not understanding the "no jobs in NEPA" argument from everyone either. If there aren't any family-sustaining jobs here, then why are thousands of McMansions popping up like hemorrhoids everywhere, along with more luxury SUVs than I can keep count of? Is everyone "living on plastic?"

[NYRangers 2008]

A lot of people are living on plastic. I see all these SUV's too and wonder how can they afford to drive these gas guzzlers. It's just that there isn't enough good jobs in the area. I have a good job making well above the median income in this area, but we need more of them. A lot of people are only making between $7-11 an hour. That's just not enough to keep people here, especially with rising gas, electric, cable rates. There is some progress being made, but we need more.

[nocturnal rooster]

Originally Posted by ScrantonWilkesBarre

Is everyone "living on plastic?"

Well duh, didn't you get the memo? Lots of people are in debt. People in the forums are gonna argue that and say they aren't or have never been in debt at all, but the fact is they are either lying or will be in debt in the near future.

[weluvpa]

Lets start by saying that I have never thought New Jersey was the promised land even when my father and I owned a printing company there and I commuted 2 1/2 each way instead of living there, and I even tried that for a while but ended up just moving back here and commuted. I then thought wow we just sold the company I am going to travel and maybe move out of the country well after a year or so in the Bahamas and Israel I moved around between the Jersey shore and then just decided that this is home and here I am. You want to know what I love about this city really love, my neighborhood, I know everyone here and their kids and their friends, I like to walk across the street and have coffee with my neighbors or maybe a beer after work or whatever it does not matter. Everything else you rave about I could careless, I do not think that Nay aug is that great and I have been there and done that with the bars and the restaurants, I do not shop downtown, only Boccardo's, I really couldn't even think of a reason to go down there unless its for meetings and or city business, it closes at 5pm everyday there is nothing to do in the downtown except eat or drink and that is not enough of a draw for me or most of the people I know, maybe because we do not care about the downtown when the city admin is letting the neighborhoods go to hell in a hand basket over the downtown.

Good points where are they???/ Steamtown, Nay Aug these are not tourist attractions, they barely draw people in. Really how many people go to Steamtown that we can truley tought that as a major tourist attraction??? The only thing we have to offer in the downtown is food and beer sorry that is not going to cut it. People in Scranton love their neighborhoods and that is what is the BEST PART of this city its neighborhoods and they are slowly being pushed aside for some pipe dream of a downtown and that is the REALITY of this city. I am sorry but you'll never get the people back from the Burbs it is not going to happen, no one in their right mind would sell their house and move back in to the city and thats not negative it is just the reality of the city. The mayor was pushing this urban revival experiment and it failed. They should have concentarted on bringing business here and then the people will follow instead they spent all the money on the hope that the hip will come and the company will follow and thats not the way it works. They will never attract major companies here because they would never do that to their employees and its not financially viable for a company to exist in the city proper, they will all go to the indusrial parks in Archbald or the business parks in Dickson City or Montage Mt. but they will never be here so in turn the employess will not live here due to the wage tax, especially the wage tax. This grand plan has fallen on its face Paul and it sucks but that is the way it is. Without mayor Doherty in office the funding for any all downtown projects will not approved in the future and since they will not happen in 2 yrs they will not happen at all. You can doubt me but I am right on this. The key developers are Doherty contributors and the funding will not be there without him. TRUST ME ON THIS!

[miamiman]

Originally Posted by ScrantonWilkesBarre

I'm just not understanding the "no jobs in NEPA" argument from everyone either. If there aren't any family-sustaining jobs here, then why are thousands of McMansions popping up like hemorrhoids everywhere, along with more luxury SUVs than I can keep count of? Is everyone "living on plastic?"

Housing is still very cheap in NEPA compared to other parts of the country. I find that there is quite a disparity between the have's and have not's in NEPA. Believe me, although it may seem that "McMansions" are popping up left and right, compared to many other areas, the "suburban" growth in Wilkes-Barre/Scranton is quite minimal. To say that there are thousands of McMansions sprouting up is a gross overstatement. Travel to many other suburban areas of the country and the rate of luxury SUV's you see will be much higher. I live in Scottsdale, AZ and it's EXTREMELY common to see luxury cars, including the same style Hummer that I drive. Many people appear wealthy to the outside public, but they're living in debt. It's all for show.

[miamiman]

As Scranton's population dwindles, taxes must be raised on the remaining folks to upkeep an adequate level of services with a smaller pool of revenue to draw from. That is a fact of life. If Daniel and the others want to see their taxes reduced, then they should be taking my stance of trying to be a bit more optimistic about the city's future.

I fail to see how being optimistic about Scranton's future will lower taxes. Residents of Scranton have valid concerns about their city, and often the only time people get to express their frustrations is at city council meetings. There is really no point of city council meeting if people are just going to praise the city for the work that they're doing. Scranton is still is dire straits and by residents expressing frustration, city leaders can work to continue to life Scranton out of the abyss. Residents should not have to put on a facade to attempt to attract more residents to Scranton.

the only true way to get the city back onto its feet is to attract the middle-class back to the city from the Abingtons, where many of them fled when they city was at its absolute worst in the 1990s.

Again, how do you propose to get middle-class suburban residents back to Scranton? Not everyone fled Scranton because of the wage tax; many people prefer suburban lifestyles, as many towns such as Clarks Summit, offer better schools and are better off financially than Scranton has been and will be for a long time. Some do not like urban lifestyles. That's a fact. You cannot guide yourself under the expectation that suburban residents are mindless drones who will always take the logical route.

I may be young, but I'm in no way blind to the problems in Scranton. I know that I'll be paying a hefty wage tax and putting up with a bunch of bumblef***s on city council by moving from Pittston to Scranton in a couple of years, but, in my opinion, there are more reasons to move into Scranton than to move out of it.

You might not be blind to the problems in Scranton, but you are certainly hesitant to admit them. I still don't understand why you think that because you find more reasons to move into Scranton than to move out, that everyone should automatically feel the same way. People are at different stages of their lives, and Scranton is certainly a place that doesn't fit certain lifestyles.

However, I don't try to make them overshadow Nay Aug Park (which all of my suburban friends RAVE about, despite what you people say)

A park in which people are committing sexual acts is generally not a place people feel comfortable taking their children. I admit that it is a nice urban park, but who wants to go to Nay Aug with the possibility that they might see teenagers going at it in full daylight or people hooking up in a car. Umm, no thanks.

just wait until the "big city problems" finally move into town in the upcoming years. They've already reached the Poconos and Wilkes-Barre; it's only a matter of time before they infest Scranton, at which point you'll all REALLY have something to gripe about for a change.

Believe me, if Scranton ever got to this point, you would see the city's population decrease at an even greater rate than it is now. Scranton did have an issue with crime about ten years ago in the Hill Section, causing many longtime residents to flee. If crime abounds in Scranton like you claim it does in Wilkes-Barre and the Poconos, expect to see more lifelong residents leave to the "suburbs."

why so many of my college peers high-tail it out of the region? It isn't because of the lack of jobs, homophobia/racism, weather, etc. A lot of it stems from growing up and hearing every adult around us saying "Get out while you still can; the sky is falling. New Jersey is the wave of the future!"

It's true. There aren't many skilled jobs in the valley, and the weather can be kind of horrendous.

Scranton has many issues, primarily monetary, that many other cities in this country just do not share. The city needs to rise out of its hole and shed its stigma before it will become attractive.

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by miamiman

To say that there are thousands of McMansions sprouting up is a gross overstatement.

Not at all. 1,000 new McMansions are being proposed for Archbald in a new subdivision. Nearly 2,000 new McMansions are being proposed for the Dorrance Township section of Mountain Top. Over 1,000 new McMansions are currently under construction and/or are on the drawing board in roughly a half-dozen new subdivisions in the Back Mountain of Luzerne County. You also have continued growth in existing neighborhoods like Glenmaura, as well as brand new ones coming to North Pocono like Stonefield Estates, Windsor Hill, Beechwood Hill, etc., and Greater Pittston, such as Stauffer Pointe, Quail Hill, Horizon Estates, Blueberry Hills, etc. Take a drive in another 5-10 years through the Back Mountain, Abingtons, Mountain Top, etc., and it will be hard to delineate them from NOVA or SEPA in terms of suburban character; the Back Mountain alone already has a population of 30,000 and will eventually eclipse Wilkes-Barre, the city that it is a "bedroom community" of, especially since I've fielded many inquiries on here about that area. Between 1970-1990, the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area shed tens of thousands of residents yet grew its land usage by over 20 square miles, indicating that 100% of that sprawl was needless; at least where you live in Greater Phoenix new construction is necessary to accomodate a growing population. What's the excuse for that here? I wouldn't mind these McMansions if they were on account of people moving to the area as opposed to just spreading a dwindling population further and further away from basic services and daily conveniences, at which point we create even more sprawl to build new shopping/dining options, schools, etc. to accomodate them.

[NYRangers 2008]

Agreed Paul. That's why we need to find ways to keep people in Scranton instead of driving them out. Like Daniel said, the residents don't really care about the downtown. It's eye candy, a facade to outsiders. That won't make people come here and it certainly won't make people that are here going to stay. People living in lower Green Ridge or West Side or any neighborhood in Scranton couldn't care less if upwardly mobile people from outside the city frequent these so called hip new restaurants and clubs. This "vibe" you speak of must be felt by people who visit Scranton, because I nor any or my friends who live here feel it. The city must fix the neighborhoods first, then worry about the downtown, because they are and always will be the heart of Scranton. Once outsiders see Scranton as a good place to live instead of just visit, they will want to move here. We must fix this city from the inside out. Good neighborhoods, reasonable taxes and some good jobs will bring the people back.

[weluvpa]

Originally Posted by ScrantonWilkesBarre

I wouldn't mind these McMansions if they were on account of people moving to the area as opposed to just spreading a dwindling population further and further away from basic services and daily conveniences, at which point we create even more sprawl to build new shopping/dining options, schools, etc. to accomodate them.

Paul your kidding me, if I moved to Clarks Summit or The Abingtons exactly which basic services and dailey conveniences would I be moving away from???? The Abingtons and Clarks Summit have a well financed police dept. and a dpw as well as a financially sound gov't. The schools are better, they have eating establishments that have been there for a long time and they have a Wiez and Gerrity's markets, so what exactly would people be giving up if they moved outside the city????? Please tell me..... It would be far easier for me to drive to a restaurant in Clarks Summit then it is to drive and park for one downtown and thats right now, its easier for me from my house in Scranton to drive to the Summit to eat. Long time residents of this city want their neighborhoods to be as great as they once were. We want safe quiet and caring neighborhoods to raise our families in and the vast majority could not care about the downtown. What we do care about is the fact that the current admin is looking right past the residents that are the backbone of this city in hopes of changing the social and financial demographic make up of the dowmtown. So do you think that the yuppie residents that you would love to live in the downtown are going to commute to Montage Mt to work or to Dickson city, does that not take away from the idea of urban living, and if we continue to build these apartment complex's that you want in the downtown on the empty lots, taking up avail real estate, where do you propose that we put the companies that we will need to float this urban way of life???? We have a very little cab business, if you call you will wait a hour for one, we have a slow inept bus service and no subway so how to you propose that we have a urban downtown. Where are the urbanites going to work???????? Outside the city right, because we do not have the space to put enough business's in the downtown to support all of these new apartments and condos. Forget the empty nesters, if I was retired and I lived in NJ or NYC, this area is the absolute last place that I would want to live out my retirement, especially if I have money. What you do not realize is that was a experiment that was pushed at the state level and the mayor dropped the ball by putting all his resources into his contributors pockets and not the city, it failed miserably and the funding has dried up. The downtown is what it is and it looks better to the untrained eye but it will grow no further. This city is in for one hell of a shake up during this election and in 2009, times are changing. Read the paper, for what it is worth, the mayor was quoted he was moving key people around in different depts to PROTECT them. The director of the DPW is leaving for the private sector. The ship is going down and the rats are scrambling to higher ground, but it is going down and the mayor is jumping ship in 2009. He will not seek a third term and he has made that statement in city hall, he looking at Harrisburg for his next try.
You really want to help this city improve stop worrying about about this hip living that YOU want or your friends want and concentrate on improving the neighborhoods and the rest will follow. Great neighborhoods is a better selling point then Nay Aug or the downtown could ever hope to be.