Poconos REALLY as bad as this???? (Scranton, Wilkes-Barre: real estate, vacation home, buying)

[mickeddie]

Hi,

We found a house in Lake Naomi that we may decide to buy. I had some concerns over a bunch of places along the walls and ceilings where there was a lot of spackle. To find out more information on what to possibly expect, I posted my questions on a home repair message board. Below is one of the replies and it got me wondering if a Pocono home is the right choice now.


"As a person who was born and raised in the Poconos, I know first-hand that the whole area has TANKED in the last 10-15 years-- too much influx of new residents, leading to AWFUL construction, increased crime, roads that cannot accomodate the volume of traffic, etc., etc. It doesn't surprise me in the least that you suspect problems with the 14-year old house and are concerned that it seems underpriced-- it's UNDERPRICED because it is almost definitely CRAP. It's a sad thing-- I love the area that I grew up in; when I was younger, I fully expected to live there for the rest of my life. But it has CHANGED, and not for the good.
RUN don't WALK, as they say....."


Can you please give me any thoughts to help ease my concern? Thanks so much.

[poconoproud]

I love the Pocono's, and I was born and raised here. I am a person who does not mind the influx of new residents, and I don't believe they lead to awful construction, bad builders do.

No, this area did not plan on it's explosive growth, but our township and county officials have been seriously addressing this issue for many years now.

How can that poster comment on that home being crap? I think you would be better served hiring an inspector to give an evaluation, if you are serious about buying. Other important issues should be inspected for, such as mold.

Yes, the Pocono's has changed - but I feel it is for the better. It is up to us who call it home to make sure it is a good place to live and visit. Anywhere you live has crime, concerns of sprawl, ect.

Maybe the home seemed underpriced because we are in a buyers market? Maybe the seller was too long on the market and needed a quick sale?

[I LOVE PA!]

mickeddie...
That reply to you reeks of negativity. Just igonre everything they said. Honestly, not one bit of it is ture. I'm a transplant of 14 years ago, I Love Pa! and will probably call this place home for the rest of my life.
Also, The Poconos is a pretty big place....

[LNTT_Vacationer]

Agree w/ above responses. Add that the condition of home would require a qualified home inspector (or experience buyer) to assess. Spackle on the wall could be as simple as removed pictures; on ceiling it may be indicative of a once (or current) leaking roof.

While one wants to see a property appreciate well, keep in mind that the primary value of a vacation home is for enjoyable vacations. LakeNaomi is (imo) a beautiful community and well run club. It is also bordered by a large game land to the north and game land/preserve to the west. South is an already established community. East is boy scout land; somewhat of a concern, although small, for future development in the immediate vicinity.

It's not surprising that someone who lived 15+ years ago in the area would see changes that he might not like. Then again, if what you wanted was similar to his heyday of say, 1960, you likely wouldn't be interested in LN.

Good luck!

[ScranBarre]

"The Poconos" covers all of Wayne, Pike, Monroe, and Carbon Counties and southern and eastern parts of Luzerne and Lackawanna Counties. This rather massive geographic area stretches to include towns such as Honesdale, Mt. Cobb, Moscow, Bear Creek, White Haven, Jim Thorpe, East Stroudsburg, Milford, Hawley, and everywhere inside that circle.

In terms of population growth, Pike County (Milford) has consistently been the leader of the state's 67 counties in terms of growth, and Monroe County (Stroudsburg) has consistently been in second place (speaking in terms of percentages, not in terms of sheer numbers).

Out of this entire coverage area, I'd say the only place that's truly gone downhill in recent years is the immediate Stroudsburg area, which has gone from sleepy mountain town to rat-race bedroom community in just 10-15 years or so. Population growth has been managed the worst in that part of Monroe County, which has lead to traffic congestion on I-80, Route 611, Route 209, and other local roadways. New big-box stores are popping up left and right just to the northwest of Stroudsburg, such as Lowe's Home Improvement, Best Buy, Borders, Longhorn Steakhouse, etc., yet roadways have not been widened. The result? Traffic congestion can be wicked at times. Some schools in Monroe County have also had a history of overcrowding, more specifically the Pocono Mountain School District, which is now larger in terms of enrollment than the Scranton City School District (and you're comparing this mountainous area to a city of 72,000 just to show you how massive that school district's population now is in the Tobyhanna/Coolbaugh/Tannersville/Mt. Pocono area).

With that being said there are still nice parts of Monroe County to call home, including the Pleasant Valley area (Brodheadsville/Gilbert), and the rural northern reaches of the county, in areas like Canadensis and Cresco. Overall though if you were looking for an area that will remain largely unspoiled for years to come, I'd have to steer you towards the western half of Pike County or just about all of Wayne County north of Gouldsboro. (I foresee the easternmost parts of Pike County and Gouldsboro itself succumbing to sprawl in the coming years). Towns you might want to check out would be Honesdale, Damascus, Hawley, Shohola, Greeley, Greentown, Sterling, Hamlin, or Lake Ariel. In terms of Monroe County, I think even the more rural areas like Pleasant Valley for example, will be much more congested in the coming years as population growth there continues.

[karen_s]

Much of that reply was unfortunately true in my opinion, although it was very harsh and in poor taste. There are huge construction issues in the Poconos (my dad works in building supply and that's how I know) and you should definitely get a thorough home inspection. Lake Naomi is known to be a nice community and I wouldn't have as many worries there as elsewhere though. I think it is relatively crime-free as well, you don't hear about trouble there in the news media at least.

As far as the roads and infrastructure goes - it is a nightmare that has no quick solution. The traffic situation is the most frequent "gripe" I hear from Poconos residents, new and old alike. Any time a remedy is proposed, such as the Marshall's Creek bypass, it is rife with problems such as protected wildlife and lack of funding in the region holding up the project. The emergency services are severely taxed with all the new growth. The area can be an "easy hit" for crime, as many of the rural municipalities do not even have their own police departments and the state police cannot possibly handle it all with their current staffing levels. The schools can't keep up with their increasing populations and school taxes are high and getting higher.

Only you can decide what you'd like to do. Just wanted to paint you a more realistic picture with both pros and cons so you could be informed.

[poconoproud]

Originally Posted by karen_s

Much of that reply was unfortunately true in my opinion, although it was very harsh and in poor taste. There are huge construction issues in the Poconos (my dad works in building supply and that's how I know) and you should definitely get a thorough home inspection. Lake Naomi is known to be a nice community and I wouldn't have as many worries there as elsewhere though. I think it is relatively crime-free as well, you don't hear about trouble there in the news media at least.

As far as the roads and infrastructure goes - it is a nightmare that has no quick solution. The traffic situation is the most frequent "gripe" I hear from Poconos residents, new and old alike. Any time a remedy is proposed, such as the Marshall's Creek bypass, it is rife with problems such as protected wildlife and lack of funding in the region holding up the project. The emergency services are severely taxed with all the new growth. The area can be an "easy hit" for crime, as many of the rural municipalities do not even have their own police departments and the state police cannot possibly handle it all with their current staffing levels. The schools can't keep up with their increasing populations and school taxes are high and getting higher.

Only you can decide what you'd like to do. Just wanted to paint you a more realistic picture with both pros and cons so you could be informed.

Lake Naomi is not near Marshall's Creek, which is a traffic nightmare, the traffic issues aren't as much as a concern in MT Pocono.
There are bad builders, but you are talking about buying an existing home, not building. If you do build, Homeowner's associations, inspectors (code officials), real estate agents, and building supply companies can reccommend builders to you. Especially code officials, they can tell you what builders to stay away from.

[rockky]

Originally Posted by mickeddie

Hi,

We found a house in Lake Naomi that we may decide to buy. I had some concerns over a bunch of places along the walls and ceilings where there was a lot of spackle. To find out more information on what to possibly expect, I posted my questions on a home repair message board. Below is one of the replies and it got me wondering if a Pocono home is the right choice now.


"As a person who was born and raised in the Poconos, I know first-hand that the whole area has TANKED in the last 10-15 years-- too much influx of new residents, leading to AWFUL construction, increased crime, roads that cannot accomodate the volume of traffic, etc., etc. It doesn't surprise me in the least that you suspect problems with the 14-year old house and are concerned that it seems underpriced-- it's UNDERPRICED because it is almost definitely CRAP. It's a sad thing-- I love the area that I grew up in; when I was younger, I fully expected to live there for the rest of my life. But it has CHANGED, and not for the good.
RUN don't WALK, as they say....."


Can you please give me any thoughts to help ease my concern? Thanks so much.

We recently bought a home near the Lake Naomi area. A home inspection was mandatory before the settlement. Bring specific areas of concern to the attention of the inspector.

If this is the owner's second home, they may need to liquidate as soon as possible...thus the price. It is a buyer's market for sure right now. There are a lot of homes on the market to increase the competition.

We are in a development which includes a great variety of homes. There are many styles, ages, and stages of upkeep. I personally am very happy here. We are far enough west (even a bit west of Lake Naomi) to stay out of the traffic. From Lake Naomi you can either choose to head to Wilkes-Barre or down 611 for your retail or professional needs. Yes, the traffic is congested around Stroudsburg.

I've noticed a marked difference in the population as I go east. I don't give a rat's patoot what someones genetic history or appearance may give at first glance. I will say that the behaviors I've witnessed don't endear me to some areas, but that can work in both directions. Loud, obnoxious, vile, shouting, pushy people grate on me personally. So do snooty, superficial, and condescending behaviors.

Yes, I do wish that shopping was closer...especially when the weather has been like it has for the last week this close to Christmas. But all things considered, I wouldn't want to trade the quiet and lack of ambient light for that perk. I love what it feels like living in this house. Ya just can't have it all!

[FightinPhils]

A lot of spackling could just be a case of someone doing some do-it-yourself work and didn't have much experience with spackling, resulting in not enough sanding and retouching that is necessary to have it looking nice and smooth. Spackling is not easy. It may not necessarily mean that the house itself is structurally poor, although I am of the opinion that most newer construction is "cheap" compared to older homes. Too much particle board and cheap lumber used from the 1970's on to today.

[Summering]

Originally Posted by karen_s

Much of that reply was unfortunately true in my opinion, although it was very harsh and in poor taste. There are huge construction issues in the Poconos (my dad works in building supply and that's how I know) and you should definitely get a thorough home inspection. Lake Naomi is known to be a nice community and I wouldn't have as many worries there as elsewhere though. I think it is relatively crime-free as well, you don't hear about trouble there in the news media at least.

As far as the roads and infrastructure goes - it is a nightmare that has no quick solution. The traffic situation is the most frequent "gripe" I hear from Poconos residents, new and old alike. Any time a remedy is proposed, such as the Marshall's Creek bypass, it is rife with problems such as protected wildlife and lack of funding in the region holding up the project. The emergency services are severely taxed with all the new growth. The area can be an "easy hit" for crime, as many of the rural municipalities do not even have their own police departments and the state police cannot possibly handle it all with their current staffing levels. The schools can't keep up with their increasing populations and school taxes are high and getting higher.
Only you can decide what you'd like to do. Just wanted to paint you a more realistic picture with both pros and cons so you could be informed.

I agree with Karen again..............On about everything mentioned.
Lake Naomi is known as a wonderful community. It is just beautiful in there and, a very soothing place. However, yes........some builders did do some inferior building. You can almost tell, just looking at them.( looking at the home I mean, the builder........ah, yes, look into that too) Of course, you get a good home inspector.........and if you hate what he says about the home. You can get out of buying it, easy enough.
School taxes are high, and in the papers today it says they will go up an almost 10%........( just under, right about now anyhow) PV could be at that though!!
We do need more regional police forces so that criminals will not wander here. They need to be on the streets of Stroudsburg, like they are on the streets of NYork............
We don't want the criminals here, and soon we'll be getting like the Texans to ward them off........Community Action Committees.