Boycott the Roman Catholic Church (Scranton, Penn: school, taxes, exemption)

[ScranBarre]

I just walked in the door from work in the nick of time to see WNEP's top story, which still has me shaking my head in disgust. Apparently the Roman Catholic Church, as usual, is overstepping its boundaries in "politicizing from the pulpit." Bishop James Martino had priests throughout the Diocese of Scranton read a proclamation urging his flock to vote for Sen. John McCain because he is pro-life. More or less the letter stated that Catholics have a "moral obligation" to only vote for the candidate who is pro-life (in this case Sen. McCain isn't specifically mentioned by name, but we can all read between the lines).

In order to be considered tax-exempt religious bodies must remain impartial in terms of politics. Now that the Roman Catholic Church has begun directing its worshipers, many of whom are poorly-educated senior citizens, to vote in opposition to my favored political candidate I'm going to begin researching the legal possibility of filing a law suit to have the tax-exempt status of the Roman Catholic church revoked. If you're going to potentially alter the course of a nation's presidential election, then you should forfeit that "privilege" that was bestowed upon you for being able to operate tax-free.

I'm going to start "The Church of Paul," apply for tax-exempt status, and then preach from the pulpit the benefits of voting for Sen. Barack Obama. I'm sure that would go over VERY well!

[go phillies]

Ummmm....being pro-life is a Catholic doctrine, and the Bishop is just reminding Catholics of this. Nobody's telling anyone to vote for anyone. God forbid the Church reminds the people in the pews of the Church's doctrines....

And just because Catholic doctrine forbids a Catholic to vote pro-abortion, does not mean they would necessarily vote for McCain. I'm Catholic and pro-life (if you're not pro-life, you're not Catholic), and I can't stand McCain or Bush....but that doesn't mean I have to like or vote for Obama either...

[ScranBarre]

Some light reading for you all:

Americans United: Religion, Partisan Politics And Tax Exemption: What Federal Law Requires And Why

[thecoalman]

A church can advocates issues, and even lobby about issues. It's when they they advocate specific politicians or parties that they step over the line.

So I didn't see the news clip, were they advocating them to vote for McCain specifically or vote for the anti abortion candidate?

many of whom are poorly-educated senior citizens

If had to take a choice between my "poorly-educated senior citizen" Grandmother of 90 who has a H.S. diploma or most of the people in this forum as to who would win a debate... my money is on Grandma. These people may be old but with age comes wisdom, that's not something you learn from a book.

[ScranBarre]

I'm Protestant. I'm pro-life. I'm still voting for Sen. Obama. Why? Call me "selfish" if you wish, but I feel as if our impending recession, quagmire in Iraq, rising energy prices, global warming, etc. all take precedence over abortion. This really sickens me because as I said earlier even one of the elderly women WNEP interviewed was just like a sheep being led to slaughter with her swooning for the bishop. Thanks to him that's one more vote for Sen. McCain. I'm going to join the growing movement to revoke the tax-exempt status of the Roman Catholic church. It's one thing to say "abortion is evil." It's another thing entirely to conclude with, more or less, a coercive "keep that in mind that this is your moral obligation as you head to the polls so that you can touch the screen for the right candidate."

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by thecoalman

A church can advocates issues, and even lobby about issues. It's when they they advocate specific politicians or parties that they step over the line.

So I didn't see the news clip, were they advocating them to vote for McCain specifically or vote for the anti abortion candidate?



If had to take a choice between my "poorly-educated senior citizen" Grandmother of 90 who has a H.S. diploma or most of the people in this forum as to who would win a debate... my money is on Grandma. These people may be old but with age comes wisdom, that's not something you learn from a book.

That was a poor word choice on my behalf and I apologize, but I'm exhausted right now after a very busy and rough shift at work (What recession? I digress). I should have said "easily-impressionable senior citizens" (and they are, judging by that elderly woman whom WNEP interviewed who was in a trance over this).

These are the same people who will re-elect Rep. Paul Kanjorski after seeing those false commercials he aired in which he implied that Lou Barletta didn't support medicare, VA Hospitals, etc. simply because he twisted his words about not wanting socialized health care. These are the same people who will re-elect Mayor Chris Doherty in Scranton based upon the exclusively positive press he garners in the Times-Tribune. Senior citizens are too trusting. My generation rightfully trusts no one fully after being exposed to incessant corruption on all levels of society, which is why we now research and question everything we see and hear. Senior citizens tend to take what they are told by people with authority (including our bishop) at face-value. Being that senior citizen Roman Catholics are a HUGE segment of the U.S. voting population, telling people to vote for "the pro-life candidate" is indeed capable of costing Sen. Obama the election, as there is only ONE pro-life candidate. Now, if BOTH candidates were pro-life, and the church said "pro-life," then there's really no problem, is there?

There are many, many people besides just me outraged over this. This goes along with "picking and choosing" which laws we wish to obey. The Roman Catholic church sought tax-exemption in the United States, and it received it based upon a number of stipulations, one of which was indeed staying OUT of partisan politics. They abused that power; they should have that benefit revoked.

[MermanMike]

I didn't see the story either, but unfortunately this isn't new for the our local diocese. There is always this push to vote for the pro-life candidate. And of course we all get that the church is profile. But are they pro the Iraq war? (The answer is No by the way; the Vatican has come out repeatedly against the Iraq war, and Pope Benedict has even asked Bush to end it, although it's not reported much.)

There are a lot of reasons that I would not consider McCain the most Jesus-like candidate by far. Jesus was a young community organizer actually...not a tax collector...or rabbi...or politician...he didn't like those very much as I recall.

Although the bishop probably knew how to execute his endorsement in such a way that it was not deemed as threatening to the church's tax free status, it doesn't mean it's rght. It defies the spirit of the separation between church and state; and if you ask me, they should be paying taxes if they want to embrace their role in specifically encouraging voters to act in a certain way.

If the church were doing an effective job, they would not need to officially remind "their flock" during every election period that prolife is the way to go.

Ever wonder why kids go through school covering topics like "the renaissance" and "physics" in one year or much less, and then the topics are never mentioned again...while ideas like "abortion is wrong" and "gay marriage is wrong" and "jesus died for you" all need to be re-iterated on a weekly basis? What is it about the human that makes him able to understand the intricacies of planetary motion in about a week or two at the age of 12, but just can not seem to master mother culture's currently chosen morality in any less than an entire lifetime? "Repeat after me"..."Veerily I say unto you again and again and again"...everyone keep paying attention because there are a lot of folks out there who are trying to think for you, and that job is expressly yours. I tend not to trust anyone who tries to think for me.

[NYRangers 2008]

Originally Posted by ScranBarre

I'm Protestant. I'm pro-life. I'm still voting for Sen. Obama. Why? Call me "selfish" if you wish, but I feel as if our impending recession, quagmire in Iraq, rising energy prices, global warming, etc. all take precedence over abortion. This really sickens me because as I said earlier even one of the elderly women WNEP interviewed was just like a sheep being led to slaughter with her swooning for the bishop. Thanks to him that's one more vote for Sen. McCain. I'm going to join the growing movement to revoke the tax-exempt status of the Roman Catholic church. It's one thing to say "abortion is evil." It's another thing entirely to conclude with, more or less, a coercive "keep that in mind that this is your moral obligation as you head to the polls so that you can touch the screen for the right candidate."

I was born Catholic and now attend a Methodist church. I don't believe all of the things the Catholic Church has to say. I do believe abortion is morally wrong, but I can't tell another individual what to do with her body. She has to make that decision herself. I do think there are many more issues that we all have to deal with on a national level that will affect all of us, with abortion being the least of them. Whether one believes in abortion or not, should not solely be an issue when going to elect the next President. That should be a personal view, not a political one. That's why to this day, Roe v. Wade is a sticky subject and still a very controversial one in this country regarding abortion.

[Jungle George]

Originally Posted by MermanMike

I didn't see the story either, but unfortunately this isn't new for the our local diocese. There is always this push to vote for the pro-life candidate. And of course we all get that the church is profile. But are they pro the Iraq war? (The answer is No by the way; the Vatican has come out repeatedly against the Iraq war, and Pope Benedict has even asked Bush to end it, although it's not reported much.)

There are a lot of reasons that I would not consider McCain the most Jesus-like candidate by far. Jesus was a young community organizer actually...not a tax collector...or rabbi...or politician...he didn't like those very much as I recall.

Although the bishop probably knew how to execute his endorsement in such a way that it was not deemed as threatening to the church's tax free status, it doesn't mean it's rght. It defies the spirit of the separation between church and state; and if you ask me, they should be paying taxes if they want to embrace their role in specifically encouraging voters to act in a certain way.

If the church were doing an effective job, they would not need to officially remind "their flock" during every election period that prolife is the way to go.

Ever wonder why kids go through school covering topics like "the renaissance" and "physics" in one year or much less, and then the topics are never mentioned again...while ideas like "abortion is wrong" and "gay marriage is wrong" and "jesus died for you" all need to be re-iterated on a weekly basis? What is it about the human that makes him able to understand the intricacies of planetary motion in about a week or two at the age of 12, but just can not seem to master mother culture's currently chosen morality in any less than an entire lifetime? "Repeat after me"..."Veerily I say unto you again and again and again"...everyone keep paying attention because there are a lot of folks out there who are trying to think for you, and that job is expressly yours. I tend not to trust anyone who tries to think for me.

I was gonna write a comment, but you said what I was planning on posting (AND a heck of a lot better might I add!!)

Exceptional post MM!!!

I keep trying to give rep points to folks, but I still have to "spread it around" more...WTH??

[Polaris]

I think that is an awful thing to say to boycott the Catholic Church! I will never give up my religion for anyone. I am proud to say I am a devout Catholic. And Pro Life. Sure I definitely agree that the church should not bring in politics into the church. But I am not going to give up my faith for that. A non Catholic should not be telling me to boycott the church. I am sorry but that is wrong. I don't listen to the younger generation anyway. I love all religions and would never tell someone to boycott their religion.
Besides I do what I want. If Hillary was running I would vote for her. Pro life or not. Obama I will not vote for. Don't care for him or his wife. He is just good at throwing the B.S. Guess I am just one of the gun carrying bitter people from Pennsylvania! We should all be mad about that what he said! I will never forgive him for it. And last night the Saturday Night Live skit just brought it back to life! I love this area and I am glad we cling to our religion. We should be proud of our traditions.