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Before I would even get involved in the other points I should ask, Why should Buona Pizza be expected to pay rent for the new location when they owned out right the illegally condemed building.....Paul I think you need to slow abit and take a long hard look at what you are supporting with this project.
A: The developer made rather large financial contributions to the Doherty campaign and then suddenly they submited their proposal.
B: The city and the developer were not able to buy out all buildings so then the city came in and condemed the structures, and since they were condemed they used the redevelopment authority to take control thru eminent domain.
C: It is illegal for any municipality to use Eminent Domain to acquire land for PRIVATE DEVELOPMENT.
D: This is a national issue and they are not going to win this one.
E: The Piccolino family and their attorney have 93 documented counts of corruption and fraud filed agianst the mayor and the city and the developer.
The Feds are involved.
F: why could they have not been included from the beginning and why should they have to pay rent for the land they already own.
Listen Paul I am only going to say this once and I want you to read it carefully. I support your vision and would love to see the downtown comeback.
Here we go.....Everything you research and all of your stats say that it could work in scranton except for the one thing you continously allude to "the corruption and over spending" now your answer to me every time I bring it up is "its the same in every other city our size", so what why the hell would I care what the hell is going on anywhere else but here. The corruption and nepotism here has killed this city all the chances it had to comeback.....
$$300,000,000 million in long term debt in less than 6yrs.......How does that compare to your other cities???????What are their budgets like?? Taxes??? It all looks great on paper and in conversation, but in the real world will bills have to be paid and someone has to pay them it does not work the way you think......The 500 block is going to cost this city more $$$$ and we do not have it, the mayor just spent $1.2 million on a bridge in Nay Aug that does not go anywhere, not the treehouse thats been paid for by donations. Also the contract was awarded to a contributor without any bids.
Do you understand that a city only has soo much $$ to spend????. We had to borrow the $6.5 million this year to fill the gaps in last years budget. The city itself cannot afford your dream, do you understand that? Its not the dream that anyone is against its the bill for it and we just cannot write those kind of checks...I just wish you for once would come down off your soap box of revival and see the reality of this and the long lasting negative effects that it is going to have the city........Why would I not want to make my own city better? Think about it? Why wouldn't I? The current admin has put us in such a hole that we cannot see the top and you want us to spend spend spend spend so that a handful I mean a handful of 20 somthings that couldn't cut it in a real city want to play urbanite in our city and that includes yourself. You want to live the urban life? Move to a city! You want young progreesive style urban living then move to Hoboken NJ or somewhere like West Chester PA or Annapolis MD, Boulder CO. Its Scranton not NYC, DC, Chicago, LA, Philly you want to have your suedo urban living then go somewhere that fits the bill. Why should the residents of Scranton pay and pay and pay and pay for a vision that in reality is not what Scranton is at heart. You call it a Urban hub are you kidding me? Urban hub its 5 x 4 blocks and you consider this a hub, a hub of what? You have no idea what kind of financial stress you and your so called friends of Scranton have put on the residents, we are the ones that make the dreams happen because we are the ones that pay the bill. Paul you are like a kid with a credit card that has no clue that there is a bill that someone has to pay for all of your spending.
You want to fix Scranton stop wasting $$$$$ on projects that are not what we need and certainly not what we want. I do not want to have to pay the bill so that you and your friends can have somewhere that you can play urbanite, grow up and move to a metropolitin area and live it. Do you realize that Scranton as a whole is 10x bigger than the downtown and you want to bet the bank on the 10% instead of the 90%. Great odds.
I also do not care what you think you are going to be or PH this or masters that, its not real until you acheive it, and right now you are just a college kid with alot dreams and you want someone else to pay the bill. Not to mention the fact that you change what you want to be or your level of degree and where you want to live as often as my 8yr old changes his drawers. The reality is that we do not have the $$$$$$$$ to attempt this kind of rebuilding right now. WE CANNOT AFFORD THIS PAUL!!!!!
By the way not one part of the Hilton or the property behind it occupies any of the foot print of the former Hotel Casey.....It was located where the parking garage and Molly Branigans sit now. We tore down a historic landmark hotel of the grandest fashion for a parking garage???? I saw the inside before it was demolished and it was still grand....Its a shame, the garage cost us $7 million and its never close to capacity even when the Hilton is and we lost another $3 million on the Hilton so we have a garage that is not neccessary and a hotel that is never close to full and some what unneccessary and we are out $10 million plus the Southern Union building and that brings the total up to $17 million for nothing, thats the kind of sending I am talking about !!!!!!! Oh wait we wrote a check for $300,000 to a contarct for repairs on the old Casey garage 1 day before the city condemed it and we spent another $3 million for a second parking garage across the street from the first one. That brings the total up to $20.3 million for in reality nothing.
It's attitudes like yours that only make me second-guess staying in this city after college to raise my family. I've long toyed with the notion of moving to Minneapolis/St. Paul because I see it as being a nice blend of having an open GLBT community that feeds off of a diverse population, well-paying career opportunities, and a "cool" downtown. I was going to attend the University of Minnesota, believe it or not, for college, but I decided to stay here because I was so interested in trying to help the area to make a comeback. I just saw nothing but potential around every corner to transform blight into vitality and despair into hope. I'm hearing nothing but rants like YOURS from EVERYONE in this city, and, quite honestly, I'm more stressed out now with my urban planning idea portfolio balanced atop a heavy college courseload and my job to continue to argue. You want your city to remain "as-is" like so many others have been telling me? Fine. We'll continue to be the "laughing-stock" of the nation to everyone! As for me, I'm tired of seeing people grimace when I'm traveling and tell them I'm from Scranton, as if I just shot them! This is why I've been trying so hard to polish our area's strong points in hopes that they'd help to overshadow the negatives. It's people like you (and much of the rest of the city) who try so dilligently to bring down the optimists that makes me seriously consider my decision to remain in Scranton vs. relocating to the Twin Cities.
You continually treat me like a small child with no knowledge of the "evils of the world" or something like that. I'm WELL aware of the city's political cronyism, nepotism, financial troubles, etc., but I try to instead show off our city's "bright spots" to others in hopes that my civic pride would help to radiate onto others to appreciate the finer aspects of living in NEPA. Unfortunately, continually being forced to debate with people like you, the DohertyDeceit crew, and seemingly 99.9% of the "woe is me" crowd that inhabits Scranton is seriously making me reconsider Minneapolis/St. Paul as a "greener pasture." I've said this before, and I'll say it again---the largest hurdle facing our area's rebirth is the staunch negativity expressed by its own residents, as well as the resulting pessimism and rudeness that abounds around here. At times I wonder if WNEP's recent "Good Things are Happening" advertising campaign for the area was actually spawned on account of becoming concerned by the rampant discontent and hatred many locals seemed to be expressing towards the region on its Talkback Online message board.
Call me a snob all you want for trying to see a brighter future in this city at a young age, but now I'm becoming even more unsure about my decision to stay in Scranton after all. I was recently visiting friends in State College, a town where I saw openly-gay couples walking around without provoking jeers, glares, etc. from any passers-by. Around here, my ex-boyfriend and I experienced that quite a bit. I had tried to tell myself that our proximity to NYC/Philly, low-cost-of-living, beautiful scenery, etc. far outweighed the dumb redneck locals and their inability to look past someone's superficial flaws or cultural differences to try to see "the inside" of them as people who are potentially capable of being assets to their communities, regardless of race, creed, sexual orientation, etc., but I'm now finally tiring of "fighting uphill battles" just to try to paint a nice image of our city. I've been admittedly depressed over the past few years living here, and all of my friends who have relocated to other areas to spread their wings have been much happier. Thank you for finally helping me to realize the error in my ways in thinking I could strive for some sort of "better Scranton." Why should I even bother when my own utopia awaits me in the Twin Cities?
"I don't even know of many families in my own upper-middle-class suburb who earn that much, much less in the city of Scranton proper. Downtown housing is a good idea; making it exclusively for the "rich" is a bad idea. "
Shouldn't you have said your parents 'upper middle class suburb'..??
I can't wait till you get out in the real world with your student loans.. Talk is cheap. Many of the people who live and die in Scranton and similar places are beat down by trying to make a living and not fall down on the treadmill of high taxes. Again, the ideaology of youth is a comfy perch...
"I don't even know of many families in my own upper-middle-class suburb who earn that much, much less in the city of Scranton proper. Downtown housing is a good idea; making it exclusively for the "rich" is a bad idea. "
Shouldn't you have said your parents 'upper middle class suburb'..??
I can't wait till you get out in the real world with your student loans.. Talk is cheap. Many of the people who live and die in Scranton and similar places are beat down by trying to make a living and not fall down on the treadmill of high taxes. Again, the ideaology of youth is a comfy perch...
Of all the state forums, I think the residents of PA whine the most about taxes, budgets, economics, taxes, poverty, being poor, taxes, lack of jobs, "woe is me", taxes, "I'm a victim of a corrupt government", taxes, etc. It truly does become rather monotonous, and I can't help but wonder why those of you struggling to pay your bills didn't take the initiative while you were younger to PLAN AHEAD by attending college, learning a trade at a vo-tech, starting your own business, enlisting in the military, etc. to try to make a better future for yourselves instead of getting "stuck in a rut" and blaming everyone else but yourself for being in poverty. Don't expect sympathy from me, as I already have a retirement fund set up that I regularly deposit money into so I don't burden anyone else in the FUTURE! Why are people in so many other states able to get by day-to-day economically without hardships while those in PA can do nothing but advertise their financial adversities to the rest of the world? I'm just not understanding when it became so "hip" to do this?
You two can drag my personal life into the fray all you want; it only further serves to help your cause and has made me now look into researching other areas to relocate to. I've just had it with dealing with nothing but person after person with ****-poor attitudes about the area they call home. I did love it here, but several local internet forums of negativity, extreme negative backlash given to my father by his Scranton-area colleagues when I submitted a "pro-Scranton" letter to the editor of the Scranton Times-Tribune, and my recent trip to the Liberal haven of State College have shown me that there are greener pastures out there to discover and to explore. Spend a few hours poring over Talkback 16 Online, the Times-Leader online forums, DohertyDeceit, and various other local message boards, and you'll see realize just how BITTER and SPITEFUL so many in this area are to those who either are of minority status or who have managed to accrue a higher net worth than them. So many in this area have a "the government is out to get me, and I'm a victim" type of mindset, and it's truly starting to take its toll on my once happy-go-lucky demeanor. I'm slowly-yet-surely becoming just as bitter, hateful, and angry as the many others I interact with on a daily basis, and I feel like I may need to "escape" before I likewise start talking like "the sky is falling", "woe is me", "the government is corrupt and eats small children", yada, yada, yada.
Score one more for the region's "Brain Drain," as I'll be checking into graduate schools in Minnesota. What good is it to try to be a "cheerleader" for a city full of potential when you have no pro-city allies and nothing but nay-sayers at every turn? Sick of "being beaten down with expenses", then do what the other 49 states do without bickering about it all the time---CUT BACK YOUR SPENDING, PICK UP A SECOND JOB TO INCREASE YOUR INCOME, OR MOVE! Every city has financial hardships; do you think blaming them on the government will do you any good in the long-run when we all have the power within ourselves to make a difference?
Paul you can polish and have your bright spots but do you think that by shining a rock you will get a diamond? State College is a town that was built around a school and Scranton is a town with a school in it and there are huge demographic differences betwenn here and there and if you think that this city will ever be State College you are a complete fool. I do not care if you are gay or straight or both or a chick or a old lady, some of us are not pessimistic we are REALISTIC and know what it takes financially to make the kind of changes you want us to make for you. Move to the twin cities I could careless. If that is what you want then go. You start to cry whenever someone questions your vision. "chicken Littles" "rednecks" "pessimistic" whatever but in REALITY we are looking at this from a adult realistic financial point of view not some glassy eyed alice in wonderland vision that you seem to think will happen for free....
Oh by the way "good things are happening" is a city slogan paid for by OECD for mayor Doherty as a campaign commercial illegally and the billboards as well just to cover up the pile of S#$% he has gotten us into.
Staunch Negativity is that what you call realism? I am not negative about Scranton or NEPA, I am negative about the debt., the spending, and the people like yourself that want to continously pile the debt higher in the hopes that you will not have to go far from the comforts of home in order to lead a Urban life. You are in for a seriously rude awakening in life my friend when you have to come up with the way to make ends met and your life just didn't turn out to be exactly the way you pictured it! Who knows maybe next year you will want to be a CFO at some big corp. or just a book keeper, it changes so often. Have fun in the Twin Cities. Thats what I call life.....
"Score one more for the region's "Brain Drain," as I'll be checking into graduate schools in Minnesota. What good is it to try to be a "cheerleader" for a city full of potential when you have no pro-city allies and nothing but nay-sayers at every turn? Sick of "being beaten down with expenses", then do what the other 49 states do without bickering about it all the time---CUT BACK YOUR SPENDING, PICK UP A SECOND JOB TO INCREASE YOUR INCOME, OR MOVE! Every city has financial hardships; do you think blaming them on the government will do you any good in the long-run when we all have the power within ourselves to make a difference?"
I guess you are starting to realize that you are very alone out there with your Pro-Doherty Pro spending point of view!!!!!!!! Nobody asked you to cheer for us from the sidelines buddy you did that yourself. Maybe you need to take your sheltered little butt out into the real world and see what its all about.....State College is that "A COLLEGE TOWN" its time to grow up and realize that life is not about living that College life forever....I sure as hell do not understand why you like to bring up the poor and rich comments are you jealous of the ones with $$$$$$$, whats a matter wish you had more? I did not once bring up classes or rich or poor, is that your only defense. Paul it is what it is and it will take alot longer to fix this mess than you could imagine.
The numbers do not lie when the $$ is not there its not there. I do not want more expenses and I should have to deal with them and I make great $$$$ and I still do not want them. What makes you think that people that have more money do not mind spending more? Where is that logic from? I have had success and I live well and make good money and I would say by your standards that my household would be upper middle class in income and we do not want to spend more $$$$$$$ and if I was making more than I am now I would still not want to spend more $$$$ than I need to. Move out and grow up, until then stop cheering we do not care or want to hear it anymore you unrealistic little boy.
You won't have to "hear it anymore from a little boy." I'm through with my "pro-Scranton" cheerleading and have even just posted a new thread in the Minneapolis forums as a way of trying to begin research on my relocation. I had hoped dearly that I could make Scranton work for me, but I'm just tiring of dealing with homophobia, negativity, and depression on a daily basis. From all the research I've done into the Twin Cities, I just don't see that. Sure, the weather is frigid, but I thrive in winter. Other than that (and the high cost of housing), I truly don't see many gripes about the Twin Cities from any residents. There are neighborhoods with the tree-lined streets and Victorians in Minneapolis as well, just like the Hill Section. There are opportunities for me to live in a walkable neighborhood there. Best of all, I've also done some more research, and the single gay dating pool seems to be phenomenally higher in that area. The area is VERY well-educated, literate, and supportive of the arts, and the economy there is likewise quite strong. The population is growing exponentially, and I'm now excited to be able to put myself onto the "receiving" end of advice about a new area instead of always giving it out to others. I'm happily-awaiting my first replies to my inquiry about downtown living.
I hope you are not seriously considering this just because is a few peoples negative opinions. pretty silly really... there are plenty of people who do not share the negative opinion about Scranton, those that have the negative view about the area are simply more vocal about it than those with the "wait and see" attitude. It seems to me that MOST of the population that had the "given up" attitude in the 90's are either dead or now have the wait and see attitude.
I mean, it's only a matter of time before all the people with these negative views are all dead. I'm betting weluvpa is probably at LEAST 70. Ask someone who is not over 30 what they think about Scranton TODAY, and you will get a much different answer than someone who has lived in Scranton for the last 50 years.
Okay, as I said in a post to a previous thread, I'm an outsider who has never been to NEPA. Still, I'm going to opine anyway.
WeLuvPa, while your previous posts about the overspending by the City's government were well, taken, (I was shocked by the amount of the city's debt and said so) your comments in this thread really were out of line. Not because no one should discuss the city's problems, but because THIS thread was specifically set up to be a "How Would You Improve the City" thread. If Scranton muddles through to the other side of this situation (and most cities DO muddle through - Detroit excepted) what should people do next? Instead of rehashing problems that have been discussed ad nauseum elsewhere, you should be posting positive ideas, appropriate for this thread on what you think might work in Scranton. Doing so won't take away your valid criticisms of the city's administration, but at some point what is done is done, and can't be undone. WeLuvPa, this thread is a chance for you to devote a few minutes of thought towards making Scranton into what you think it might be. Dream! Everyone needs to do it once in awhile. And then post some ideas on how you think YOUR dream might be realized.
SWB has posted his vision. I like a lot of it, dislike a bit of it, and don't understand some of it because I've never been to Scranton.
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I'm WELL aware of the city's political cronyism, nepotism, financial troubles, etc., but I try to instead show off our city's "bright spots" to others in hopes that my civic pride would help to radiate onto others to appreciate the finer aspects of living in NEPA. Unfortunately, continually being forced to debate with people like you, the DohertyDeceit crew, and seemingly 99.9% of the "woe is me" crowd that inhabits Scranton is seriously making me reconsider Minneapolis/St. Paul as a "greener pasture." I've said this before, and I'll say it again---the largest hurdle facing our area's rebirth is the staunch negativity expressed by its own residents, as well as the resulting pessimism and rudeness that abounds around here. At times I wonder if WNEP's recent "Good Things are Happening" advertising campaign for the area was actually spawned on account of becoming concerned by the rampant discontent and hatred many locals seemed to be expressing towards the region on its Talkback Online message board. 
I had tried to tell myself that our proximity to NYC/Philly, low-cost-of-living, beautiful scenery, etc. far outweighed the dumb redneck locals and their inability to look past someone's superficial flaws or cultural differences to try to see "the inside" of them as people who are potentially capable of being assets to their communities, regardless of race, creed, sexual orientation, etc., but I'm now finally tiring of "fighting uphill battles" just to try to paint a nice image of our city. I've been admittedly depressed over the past few years living here, and all of my friends who have relocated to other areas to spread their wings have been much happier. Thank you for finally helping me to realize the error in my ways in thinking I could strive for some sort of "better Scranton." Why should I even bother when my own utopia awaits me in the Twin Cities? 
He's trippin' as usual..
I had hoped dearly that I could make Scranton work for me, but I'm just tiring of dealing with homophobia, negativity, and depression on a daily basis. From all the research I've done into the Twin Cities, I just don't see that. Sure, the weather is frigid, but I thrive in winter. 
I'm happily-awaiting my first replies to my inquiry about downtown living.
