SAT Scores: Factors for differences among schools (Discussion thread) (Centreville: 2014, home)

[still_waiting]

Moderator's Note: This thread is the discussion portion of the SAT scores that were presented in this thread: FCPS 2010 SATs. Since that thread was veering off-topic with respect to the data presented, a separate thread has been created for discussion of the factors that account for various scores. In this thread, please discuss the socioeconomic, demographic, lifestyle, etc. differences among schools and student populations; and, in the score thread, please discuss only the data presented in it. Your cooperation is appreciated. Thank you.

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Just read this on wikipedia...

Some in the community have argued that TJHSST should have greater minority representation, even though it has a large portion of Asians, with the class of 2014 having a majority of Asians[7] at 57.5%. Certain minority groups, such as blacks and Hispanics, comprise a smaller percentage of the student body than is present in the populace of the participating localities. The school's largest racial groups are whites (at about 54.28%) and Asians (at about 35.93%).[8]

Looks like Whites and Asians are leading the way academically. Things are not looking to good for the African Americans and Hispanics in America. I wonder how it is going to be 30 years into the future as the academic gap continues to expand.

[CAVA1990]

Originally Posted by still_waiting

Things are not looking to good for the African Americans and Hispanics in America.

Doesn't seem like we're doing much about it either.

Thanks for cutting to the nut. People dance around it but isn't this the real issue?

[still_waiting]

Originally Posted by CAVA1990

Doesn't seem like we're doing much about it either.

Thanks for cutting to the nut. People dance around it but isn't this the real issue?

I agree, we kind of need to get past being too sensitive about relative race issues and be honest about it all. I myself wonder what is going to be the ultimate manifestation of statistics like these.

But hey let's give it up to the NoVa area schools for doing so well!!!!

[reeze]

Originally Posted by still_waiting

Just read this on wikipedia...



Looks like Whites and Asians are leading the way academically. Things are not looking to good for the African Americans and Hispanics in America. I wonder how it is going to be 30 years into the future as the academic gap continues to expand.

It is a little strange, especially since asians, blacks, and hispanics are all minority groups and blacks have had a head start in the US and the same opportunities and restrictions, but asians as a whole have a more prominent representation in academia and less in poverty.

[JD984]

Among the points that FCPS emphasized in reporting this year's results:

• FCPS Black students exceeded the state average for Black students by 40 points in Critical Reading, by 45 points in Mathematics, and by 46 points in Writing.
• FCPS Hispanic students exceeded the state average for Hispanic students by 5 points in Critical Reading, by 15 points in Mathematics, and by 9 points in Writing.
• Black students from FCPS outperformed Black students nationwide by 47 points in Critical Reading, by 46 points in Mathematics, and by 50 points in Writing.
• Hispanic students from FCPS outperformed Hispanic students nationwide by 44 points in Critical Reading and Mathematics and by 40 points in Writing.
• FCPS Black students made significant strides in all areas, increasing their Critical Reading scores by 4 points, their Mathematics scores by 3 points, and their Writing scores by 6 points.

So perhaps there is more progress being made, at least locally, than some of the results might suggest at first blush.

[reeze]

Originally Posted by CAVA1990

Doesn't seem like we're doing much about it either.

Thanks for cutting to the nut. People dance around it but isn't this the real issue?

What needs to be done about it?

America is the land of opportunity and you reap what you sow. It's all based on individual effort and motiviation. Obama said so as much.

If Hurricane Katrina taught people anything, it did teach people that you can't rely on the government to take care of you and your family. If you want to get ahead in life, the onus is on you.

[CAVA1990]

Originally Posted by reeze

What needs to be done about it?

America is the land of opportunity and you reap what you sow. It's all based on individual effort and motiviation. Obama said so as much.

If Hurricane Katrina taught people anything, it did teach people that you can't rely on the government to take care of you and your family. If you want to get ahead in life, the onus is on you.

I don't know, but what's been done so far doesn't seem to be working. Based on the root cause that everyone pretty much agrees is a bad home environment, it seems the best answer would be to get them out of there and into a different place. How about boarding schools for poor kids? Anyone have any better ideas?

[kutra11]

Originally Posted by reeze

It is a little strange, especially since asians, blacks, and hispanics are all minority groups and blacks have had a head start in the US and the same opportunities and restrictions, but asians as a whole have a more prominent representation in academia and less in poverty.

I concur. That's because Asians (whether in US, Asia or anywhere in the rest of the world) traditionally and culturally place a huge emphasis on education ... ... especially in Math and Science. It's the whole "if you don't have a decent education, then it's the end of the world for you" attitude that parents drill into the children that pushes them to be competitive and academically oriented.

I am not debating the pros and cons of this mentality, but in the past few decades, I am seeing a shift with Asian parents in the US where they are open to letting their kids pursue academics other than Math and Science. Basically, let the kids follow their interests, but get a college education while doing it! This, in my opinion, is a good thing.

Thanks,
K

[still_waiting]

Originally Posted by reeze

It is a little strange, especially since asians, blacks, and hispanics are all minority groups and blacks have had a head start in the US and the same opportunities and restrictions, but asians as a whole have a more prominent representation in academia and less in poverty.

Ok let's be honest here. First what JEB77 posted is not to be ignored...at least in NoVa the AA's are doing better than the national average which is more likely a testament of the sample population. I mean their parents are more than likely college educated and professionals which tends to rub off on their children. There are AA as well as other non-asian minorities that do attend TJ, so in no way is TJ being racially exclusive.

But also in the spirit of honesty I'd have to respectfully disagree with your statement about African-Americans having a headstart in the US. If you mean strictly by the amount of time being in the US then you are mostly correct, but understand that a significant amount of that time they were prevented from even pursuing an education and many were punished when they attempted to do so anyway. Nobody wanted educated slaves...because education was the key to enlightenment.

Psychology teaches us to never underestimate the power and effects of inbred mentality. So while many AA's have risen above their unfortunate history here in the U.S. there is a POSSIBILITY that for some the lingering effects of the past may still hold an almost unconscious (we no longer use sub-conscious) barrier on them.

Remember Jim Crow Laws were still in effect well into the 1960's which is still less than a lifetime ago for many people. But again like JEB77 stated, there is some progress being made so that's definitely a good thing.

We are being open and honest in here aren't we? Just checking.

[JD984]

I knew when I posted the 2010 scores that it would inevitably lead to some cultural generalizations and responses to those generalizations. The thing about data like this is that people (myself included) tend to see what they want to see in the data. I tend to be interested in it not because I think SAT scores are the "be all and end all" of student achievement or potential, but because they do seem to tell us some things about the region.

For example, the fact that schools like Marshall and Washington-Lee, which used to get trashed (or, alternatively, damned with very faint praise) on C-D now have consistently high scores seems to suggest both that people really do like living near employment centers (Tysons and DC) and affirmatively embrace good schools even though they have more than some magic number (what is it, 10%?) of lower-income students.

The fact that the test scores for Loudoun schools tend to be in the middle of the pack, and to vary less than those in Fairfax (not to mention Montgomery County) seems to reinforce the sense that Loudoun has increasingly become an area of choice for the "solid middle/upper-middle class" (as that term is commonly understood by regional, if not national, standards).

I also realize that TJ's extraordinarily high scores, combined with the fact that the school is now plurality (if not majority) Asian, may invite generalizations about the commitment of all Asians to education, particularly in the maths and sciences. One might also keep in mind, however, that, most Asian students in Fairfax do not attend TJ and that, next to TJ, the school in Fairfax with the highest percentage of Asians is Centreville, whose test scores are right in the "middle of the pack" (#15 out of 25 Fairfax schools). This might also provide some food for thought. There are Asian advocacy groups at universities all over the country that rail against the portrayal of Asians as a "model minority," based on their concern that such generalizations may lead to reverse discrimination or blind people to the challenges that some Asian communities face.