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Old 09-05-2010, 09:02 PM
 
Location: Arlington
12 posts, read 45,296 times
Reputation: 13

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Hi everyone,

I'm sure most of you have heard the news that an Allstate survey yet again ranked DC-area drivers as the least safe in the U.S. One of many links: http://dcist.com/2010/09/once_again_dc_boasts_the_countrys_w.php

I've lived here for a year, and from what I've seen, I have to agree from an anecdotal perspective. I'm shocked about the following aspects of DC-area drivers:

1. Slowness: I see people perennially driving below the speed limit, whether it's on freeways or local roads. For example, I regularly observe motorists on Rt. 66 in Arlington driving at about 40 mph (non-traffic situations). Why? Don't people have places they need to get to? Isn’t it unsafe to drive so slowly on a freeway?

2. Driving (not passing) in the left lane: Isn't this supposed to be a passing lane? Why do people drive 55 mph in this lane on the Beltway, Rt. 66, and the George Washington Parkway (to name just a few I've noticed)? If I tailgate these slow drivers, they honk and glare at me for being the rude driver, not recognizing that they are indeed the offenders for impeding traffic by failing to move to the right lanes!

3. General non-aggressiveness: When traffic lights turn yellow, everyone stops. Why? Don't they want to make lights? Where I'm from (Boston), yellow means hurry up and go, or else you're stuck waiting at a red for a while. You will be rear-ended if you don’t make these lights. I know that DC has signal photo enforcement, so I'm talking about the intersections that don't have cameras.

4. Lack of acceleration - whether it's at just-turned-green lights or merging onto freeways, people here seem to be really leisurely, as if they have all the time in the world to get up to speed. Why is this? Don't they want to move their cars? I think it's funny, because I've noticed some pretty serious machinery in these parts (AMG Benzes, M3s, S4s, etc), and they mostly drive like grandma...

I've mentioned this to my friends from here, and here are some of the explanations we came up with. Wondering what others think:

1. Roads are heavily patrolled (and camera-ed), so people are afraid to go fast.
2. A lot of people work for the government so they don't really worry about hurrying up - no incentive to get to work early.
3. General sense of acting legalistic: a lot of people are lawyers or in policy-related fields and as a result are more inclined to follow driving laws to the letter as compared with other cities, where people may bend laws more often.
4. Southern values - a lot of people are from VA and points south, where it's more common to drive slowly and unaggressively. The mentality is, "why rush?"
5. Nobody's from here, so nobody knows where they are going, so they drive slowly to avoid getting lost.

I've lived in Boston, NYC, Detroit, and LA, where drivers are fast and aggressive (especially the Detroiters – look out!) I find the DC-area to be quite the opposite. Anyone else have this experience? Anyone disagree?

I guess what I'm trying to say overall is that we, as DC-area drivers, are actually too unaggressive, slow, and lack proper lane discipline. If we addressed these issues (as well as raising freeway speed limits), we may (paradoxically) become safer drivers!
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Old 09-06-2010, 12:33 AM
TPL
 
Location: Washington, D.C.
136 posts, read 317,641 times
Reputation: 76
You haven't lived here for very long, that's for sure. Folks around here drive like nutjobs, and the only place I've almost been intentionally run off the road is in NoVa (I've driven all up and down the Eastern seaboard, and cross country as well).

I take it that you're being facetious, though lol.
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Old 09-06-2010, 05:36 AM
 
12,905 posts, read 15,660,053 times
Reputation: 9394
I'm just going to touch on some of your observations/generalizations with my own:



Quote:
1. Slowness: I see people perennially driving below the speed limit, whether it's on freeways or local roads. For example, I regularly observe motorists on Rt. 66 in Arlington driving at about 40 mph (non-traffic situations). Why? Don't people have places they need to get to? Isn’t it unsafe to drive so slowly on a freeway?
While I do see this, I don't see this to be done with any regularity. Maybe here or there and mostly if I'm driving someplace like Tysons or around/near Potomac Mills Mall due to people not knowing where they are going.

Quote:
2. Driving (not passing) in the left lane: Isn't this supposed to be a passing lane? Why do people drive 55 mph in this lane on the Beltway, Rt. 66, and the George Washington Parkway (to name just a few I've noticed)? If I tailgate these slow drivers, they honk and glare at me for being the rude driver, not recognizing that they are indeed the offenders for impeding traffic by failing to move to the right lanes!


Well, the speed limit is, for the most part, 55 mph. They can legally be in the left lane as long as they are driving the speed limit. Again, I see it happen, maybe once a week on my way into work, not daily. If you are tailgaiting them then you are being rude and breaking the law. I've tried to stop myself from doing this and move around as quickly as I can. They are not worth an accident or ticket.

Quote:
3. General non-aggressiveness: When traffic lights turn yellow, everyone stops. Why? Don't they want to make lights? Where I'm from (Boston), yellow means hurry up and go, or else you're stuck waiting at a red for a while. You will be rear-ended if you don’t make these lights. I know that DC has signal photo enforcement, so I'm talking about the intersections that don't have cameras.


I am a "yellow means hurry up and go" person too. I think most people who were born/raised here are (I know in my circle we are). I find the people who have moved here from small towns/laid back areas are not...YET! You see a very transient population in this area because of the great job market and military. Maybe Boston doesn't get people from all over as much as DC does so there are very little differences in driving style.

Quote:
4. Lack of acceleration - whether it's at just-turned-green lights or merging onto freeways, people here seem to be really leisurely, as if they have all the time in the world to get up to speed. Why is this? Don't they want to move their cars? I think it's funny, because I've noticed some pretty serious machinery in these parts (AMG Benzes, M3s, S4s, etc), and they mostly drive like grandma...



This one I have to agree WHOLEHEARTEDLY with!!! At most any intersection, when the light turns green I take my 2 seconds to check if it's safe and I'm off. Almost every time, I am literally 4-5 car lengths in front of everyone else. It's maddening to me when I'm behind them.


Quote:
1. Roads are heavily patrolled (and camera-ed), so people are afraid to go fast.


Maybe.

Quote:
2. A lot of people work for the government so they don't really worry about hurrying up - no incentive to get to work early.


As a government worker for the past 2.5 years (a contractor for 18 prior to that), I am going to choose to take great personal offense to this. At my contractor job, I could come in over 30 minutes late. If I am more than15 minutes late at my government job (and no huge accident has been reported), I'm expected to add that on to the end of my day or take personal leave. The government "slacker" generalization is really wearing thin.
Quote:
3. General sense of acting legalistic: a lot of people are lawyers or in policy-related fields and as a result are more inclined to follow driving laws to the letter as compared with other cities, where people may bend laws more often.


I'm not feeling it...
Quote:
4. Southern values - a lot of people are from VA and points south, where it's more common to drive slowly and unaggressively. The mentality is, "why rush?"


Yes, people from smaller towns or less crowded areas definitely have a different mentality about driving as they haven't cut their driving teeth in this mess.

Quote:
5. Nobody's from here, so nobody knows where they are going, so they drive slowly to avoid getting lost.


Yes, at times I think this is the case.

Someone posted the other day that this area, while second to LA for traffic, has the highest rate of accidents. I guess someone needs to study what type of accidents they are, why they think they happen, etc.
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Old 09-06-2010, 06:28 AM
 
Location: Central Maine
4,697 posts, read 6,448,256 times
Reputation: 5047
This reminds me of the threads we see from time to time about how people in this area can't drive in snow. And threads like that ignore the facts that (1) the crap we often get here is more ice than snow, and (2) many, many of the drivers here learned to drive somewhere else.

That the DC metropolitan area drivers are once again rated the worst in the country isn't terribly surprising. We have the worst traffic this side of L.A., with weather that is often much worse to drive in than that of L.A. Add to the mix plenty of people with bad driving habits they bring here from elsewhere (and I'm thinking especially of thou-shalt-not-yield Boston), plenty of people here visiting and making the crucial mistake of driving rather than taking Metro, and plenty of "me first" drivers ... well, again the ranking is not surprising.

On the other hand .... I was a rider/driver in a carpool (and rider in a vanpool) for 28 years, pounding our way up and down I-95 from Woodbridge to Capitol Hill and back every day. Over that period of time there was a lot of turnover, and therefore a lot of different drivers, each with their own skill set and way of driving. We had no accidents and no tickets that entire time.
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Old 09-06-2010, 06:30 AM
 
Location: Maine
2,498 posts, read 3,405,402 times
Reputation: 3853
The article about DC drivers being the worst indicated that they are the most likely to get in an accident. How would raising the speed limits on roads in the region reduce the probability of getting hit?

I agree with your assessment about not understanding being in the proper lanes. Unfortunately, the poorly planned roads around here require getting into the left lane early on if one needs to make a left turn from a road like Fairfax County Parkway.

My first complaint is that many drivers do not know how to drive their cars. They drive like distracted little kids in the bumper car rides at the county fair. All too often drivers swing fairly wide to the left to make a right hand turn (or vice versa), and it is dangerous to drivers in the adjacent lane. Is their vehicle really terrible at taking turns, or do they not know how to handle their cars?

The second (and perhaps more serious) complaint is a general lack of safety/good manners. My daughter and I were loading our car at the grocery store, and a well-dressed woman in an expensive convertible cut through the empty spot next to our car where my daughter was standing with the door open. I told my daughter to hop in and shut the door quickly so she would not get pinned between the door and the frame if the woman hit us. The woman driver nearly sideswiped our car as she pulled the wrong way through the empty spot. It was so frightening, yet the woman simply found her desired parking spot, got out, and went into the store, as though she had not done anything rude or dangerous. Attitudes like this are the reason DC drivers make the "worst drivers" list. Rules and etiquette don't concern them, apparently.
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Old 09-06-2010, 06:39 AM
 
12,905 posts, read 15,660,053 times
Reputation: 9394
My biggest gripe with poor drivers is when you are in a left turn lane that is by signal (arrow) only (you can't yield to oncoming traffic with a solid green). So you ONLY have the chance to turn when you have the arrow. I would venture to say that all of those left-turn-on-arrow lanes are done by sensor. There is always ONE driver who cannot maintain his distance with the car in front of him. This triggers a yellow light on which HE gets through but no one else does.

I can say that this happens to me almost every time I am at one of these left turn lanes. Yesterday, it took me three light cycles to make a left from Dale Blvd. to go to Wegman's. Each time, there was that one driver that just screwed it up. Sometimes only three cars got through. Sometimes more depending on where the idiot was in the line up. Besides having it happen to me at Wegmans yesterday, it happened at two other lights in Woodbridge (I was running a ton of errands yesterday). I was in quite the rage when I got home.
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Old 09-06-2010, 07:21 AM
 
Location: Brambleton, VA
2,136 posts, read 5,311,488 times
Reputation: 1303
I think there are several factors that contribute to the driving problems in this region.

First, there are three distinct jurisdictions (DC, VA, MD), each with their own differing traffic laws. For example, in Maryland you do NOT have to use your turn signal for a lane change. In Virginia, it is legal to flash your lights at someone going slow in the passing lane if you are trying to pass. You get used to your laws and other people get used to theirs.

Related to this is that these different jurisdictions have different styles and standards for their roads and signage. Further complicating this is that many of the roads in and around the District are under various agency control - Park Service, DDOT, etc. Virginia's signage is terrible. The Maryland suburbs have some weird things that always surprise me (like flashing turn arrows). DC's traffic lights on the side of the road are hard to see. So if you're not driving somewhere that you're really familiar with, you may either slow down to figure it out, or speed up and figure it'll work itself out. Either way, you're probably annoying the locals.

Finally, this a region of transients. A lot of people move here from a lot of different places. The style of driving on the Garden State Parkway is different than the style of driving on I-75 South - and now those people are neighbors here in Virginia. I see a lot of confusion about four-way-stops, left turns, and right-of-way in general. How many of you recent transplants picked up a copy of the Virginia driving manual? Right.

Now, throw in drivers who are recent immigrants to this country. I lived in Cameroon for a while, drove for two weeks in Ireland, and have feared for my life in a Buenos Aires taxi, so I have some idea about the different ways that people drive elsewhere. Lane lines may be a suggestion; traffic signals may not be plugged in; roads may not be paved. Those people come here, and it may take them a while to adjust. Especially those with diplomatic immunity.

My general rule of thumb here is to be a super-defensive driver. I can drive carefully and legally and do everything I'm supposed to do, but I can't control the moron on his cellphone weaving into my lane. It means having to be 100% aware of what's going on around you. But that's how you should be driving anyway.
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Old 09-06-2010, 07:31 AM
 
Location: Marshall-Shadeland, Pittsburgh, PA
32,616 posts, read 77,614,858 times
Reputation: 19102
You're preaching to the choir, OP. I've found the drivers here, overall, to be horrendous. My biggest complaints?

1.) Lack of turn signal (blinker) usage. If only there were a law requiring motorists to signal before turning or when merging.

2.) The mantra of "slower traffic keep right" doesn't apply to NoVA, as evidence by a past thread on this sub-forum where I was reamed out by people telling me they'd drive at whatever speed they felt like in the left-hand lane. That sort of mentality is exactly why aggressive driving becomes such an issue here.

3.) Totally agree about the lack of acceleration. I can be stopped at a red light behind someone, and 5-10 seconds will pass after the light turns green for that person to take their foot off the brake and advance. I don't understand it.

4.) People who don't yield to traffic when merging onto a roadway from an onramp. One day I was unable to get into the left-hand lane to let someone trying to get onto the roadway from an onramp in, so their answer was to "force" their way in, narrowly avoiding my fender. I blared the horn and flipped a hearty gesture we Pennsylvanians know all too well, and this person returned the deed.

5.) Bad parking. Just because you're affluent and drive a luxury vehicle doesn't mean you can park ACROSS parking spaces to prevent anyone else from parking near you. I'm almost tempted when I see people doing this to whistle innocently as a "gust of wind" takes my shopping cart into the direction of that vehicle.

6.) People who ZOOM across parking lot aisles. I was nearly hit severely by someone doing about 35-40 across the aisles, and needless to say I wasn't pleased.

7.) Tailgating me when I'm already in a line of traffic. Tailgate me if I'm lolly-gagging in the left-hand lane. Fine. I'd deserve it. Why tailgate me if there's nowhere else for me to go because of the horribly-planned infrastructure here?

Yeah. My horn gets a TON of use here.

P.S. "People aren't from around here..." is NOT an excuse. In my native Scranton we are experiencing a lot of incoming transplants from NYC/NJ, and they don't expect to use their former locales as a "crutch" to permit bad driving. What gives here?
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Old 09-06-2010, 08:39 AM
 
Location: Metro Washington DC
15,431 posts, read 25,814,526 times
Reputation: 10450
Quote:
Originally Posted by xantia10000 View Post
Hi everyone,

I'm sure most of you have heard the news that an Allstate survey yet again ranked DC-area drivers as the least safe in the U.S. One of many links: http://dcist.com/2010/09/once_again_dc_boasts_the_countrys_w.php

I've lived here for a year, and from what I've seen, I have to agree from an anecdotal perspective. I'm shocked about the following aspects of DC-area drivers:

1. Slowness: I see people perennially driving below the speed limit, whether it's on freeways or local roads. For example, I regularly observe motorists on Rt. 66 in Arlington driving at about 40 mph (non-traffic situations). Why? Don't people have places they need to get to? Isn’t it unsafe to drive so slowly on a freeway'?
I-66 west between Fairfax dr and 267 fits what you say perfectly. I have posted about it before. However, I don't see it on other freeways (except at the American Legion bridge). On other freeways in this area, slowness is not a problem.


Quote:
2. Driving (not passing) in the left lane: Isn't this supposed to be a passing lane? Why do people drive 55 mph in this lane on the Beltway, Rt. 66, and the George Washington Parkway (to name just a few I've noticed)? If I tailgate these slow drivers, they honk and glare at me for being the rude driver, not recognizing that they are indeed the offenders for impeding traffic by failing to move to the right lanes!
As you can see from some of the responses, people stubbornly believe that since they're going the speed limit that it's okay to block the passing lane. I'm thinking that it is impossible to make them see that that lane is for passing only (except in heavy traffic).


Quote:
3. General non-aggressiveness: When traffic lights turn yellow, everyone stops. Why? Don't they want to make lights? Where I'm from (Boston), yellow means hurry up and go, or else you're stuck waiting at a red for a while. You will be rear-ended if you don’t make these lights. I know that DC has signal photo enforcement, so I'm talking about the intersections that don't have cameras.
Don't you mean passive-agressiveness? By the way, judging by all the attention red light running gets, it must be a problem here. Maybe observe more carefully.

Quote:
4. Lack of acceleration - whether it's at just-turned-green lights or merging onto freeways, people here seem to be really leisurely, as if they have all the time in the world to get up to speed. Why is this? Don't they want to move their cars? I think it's funny, because I've noticed some pretty serious machinery in these parts (AMG Benzes, M3s, S4s, etc), and they mostly drive like grandma...
I've noticed this too. No idea why it's like this.

Quote:
I've mentioned this to my friends from here, and here are some of the explanations we came up with. Wondering what others think:

1. Roads are heavily patrolled (and camera-ed), so people are afraid to go fast.
The roads are NOT heavily patrolled. I don't know where you're getting that from. Oh, you must be referring to Fairfax County. Cameras are going up, but they are relatively new. These problems pre-date the cameras.


Quote:
5. Nobody's from here, so nobody knows where they are going, so they drive slowly to avoid getting lost.

I've lived in Boston, NYC, Detroit, and LA, where drivers are fast and aggressive (especially the Detroiters – look out!) I find the DC-area to be quite the opposite. Anyone else have this experience? Anyone disagree?
Possible. I am from Detroit originally, but despite the fact they drive faster, I don't, or didn't, see as much aggressiveness (or passive-aggressiveness) as I see here everyday. Fewer transplants might be the reason.



Quote:

I guess what I'm trying to say overall is that we, as DC-area drivers, are actually too unaggressive, slow, and lack proper lane discipline. If we addressed these issues (as well as raising freeway speed limits), we may (paradoxically) become safer drivers!
Partially agreed. (as explained above.)
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Old 09-06-2010, 09:04 AM
 
70 posts, read 106,392 times
Reputation: 19
Xantia, that was me in front of you. Sorry I was driving slow, still trying to learn the roads, lol
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