"Yes ma'am" and "Yes sir" (catholic schools, college)

[nikkayx333]

Originally Posted by Yankeesfan

Except that to many, perhaps most, people, sir and ma'am aren't considered essential manners. Using them may indicate nothing more than a habit ingrained in the person when they were a child. I don't object to someone saying them, but I don't expect them to, and I certainly don't judge a person's manners or character based upon whether they use the words sir or ma'am. I do use them sometimes when addressing older adults, but mainly it's when I don't know their names and it's more polite than saying "Hey you ..." .

I'm not saying it means they have bad character or anything...thats not what I meant at all. Even at 18, if the kids I taught [daycare] didn't say Ms___ [not putting my last name up here for safety reasons] and yes/no ma'm, they wouldn't get a response. Id ask them 'yes what?' I'm older than them and I deserve & expect them to treat me how I believe young ladies/gentlemen should treat their elders. I AM an elder to a 4 year old. Anyways, we live in the South, so I expect Southern manners.

[nimchimpsky]

Originally Posted by ACWhite

Several posters have brought up similar points but don't seem to realize that this implies that being older is less desirable than being younger.

For a lot of people being older is less desirable. I don't personally agree, but many people do take offense when their age is overestimated.

It certainly would not be wise to assume that strangers or even people with whom one has some working relationship prefer the familiarity of first names, to being addressed as "Mr." or "Ms." Jones. Respect and status are of as much importance as "friendliness" particularly in the workplace, to many people. I think most people who have a meeting with a CEO or with President Obama wouldn't even think of addressing him/her by the first name; it's the same principle with people of other status--better to assume some distance unless it is someone you know prefers that you call him/her by a first name. People can always invite others to "please, call me Tom/Mary."

I agree. In professional settings, erring on the side of formality is wise. I work for an Iranian foundation and Farsi is a much more formal language than English. We routinely use titles in Farsi and first names in English. It seems weird but when you consider the standards for each language, it makes sense.

I suggested Mr./Ms. as a solution to the sir/ma'am debate earlier because it is a lot less "stigmatized" in the non-Southern regions of the the country. You can pretty much use Mr./Ms. safely everywhere from Texas to California to Vermont. But sir/ma'am are more likely to win over half the country and completely offend the other half.

[nimchimpsky]

Originally Posted by nikkayx333

I'm not saying it means they have bad character or anything...thats not what I meant at all. Even at 18, if the kids I taught [daycare] didn't say Ms___ [not putting my last name up here for safety reasons] and yes/no ma'm, they wouldn't get a response. Id ask them 'yes what?' I'm older than them and I deserve & expect them to treat me how I believe young ladies/gentlemen should treat their elders. I AM an elder to a 4 year old. Anyways, we live in the South, so I expect Southern manners.

Exactly. If you were to do the same thing in the North, not only would the kids have no idea that "yes, what?" meant you were waiting for a "yes, ma'am," but their parents would probably look at you like you're from Mars if they overheard the interaction, and some of them would think you were excessively authoritarian. Those are the connotations that sir/ma'am hold in the North, even though in the South they're just considered basic manners.

[Yankeesfan]

Originally Posted by nikkayx333

I'm not saying it means they have bad character or anything...thats not what I meant at all. Even at 18, if the kids I taught [daycare] didn't say Ms___ [not putting my last name up here for safety reasons] and yes/no ma'm, they wouldn't get a response. Id ask them 'yes what?' I'm older than them and I deserve & expect them to treat me how I believe young ladies/gentlemen should treat their elders. I AM an elder to a 4 year old. Anyways, we live in the South, so I expect Southern manners.

And I think not responding to them over something like that is incredibly poor manners. I would think "what a rude, persnickety snob."

[Yankeesfan]

Originally Posted by Alanboy395

I've always used sir or ma'am and I'm 22. If you don't like it tough.

Yep, that's showing your manners and politeness for sure .

[CaliTerp07]

Originally Posted by nikkayx333

I'm older than them and I deserve & expect them to treat me how I believe young ladies/gentlemen should treat their elders.

Why do you "deserve" anything for being alive a few years more than someone else?

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for children being polite, but I think everyone should be polite to everyone else regardless of age. I don't think anyone "deserves" any more respect at 80 than at 50 than at 25. A person deserves to be treated politely regardless of age/rank/social status.

[smithy77]

Re: O.P.

I use "yes sir" and "yes ma'am" almost daily. Grew up in the Midwest----guess I'm slightly old-school about manners. Funny, I was just having a conversation earlier this week about how crass we've become as a society, especially since the introduction of the internet; the shameless self-promotion and exhibitionism on facebook, the virulent attacks on people in some forums, etc.. It would be great if there were some kind of vehicle for introducing young people to basic etiquette/communication skills. Some forward thinking companies do this in a round-about way, since they value emotional maturity and care about investing in their employees, but I think it would be better to start learning these things much earlier in life.

[MaryleeII]

Originally Posted by Margery

I'll vote on the "sir" and "ma'am" side. I was raised that way and so were my children. I was also taught not to refer to an adult by their first name unless I was given permission by the adult.

I find the practice of being called by my first name in a doctor's waiting room too familiar. Yes, I am an old crank , but when a doctor calls me by my first name, I respond by calling the doctor by his or her first name.

I'm with you on that being called by my first name in a doctor's office, especially when they make a dimunitive out of it---like Johnnie instead of John, etc.

I especially HATE being called honey, sweetie, etc in a business setting, and yes, a doctor's office is a business setting, considering all the money that flows there, the least they could do is call us by our correct names.

Its always amazing to me how they actu genuinely surprised when I "give it bak" call the doctor by his first name, and the nurse as Sweetie. I just say it so matter-of-fact, yes, nice to meet you, Johnnie, I think sweetie has all the forms filled out, BTW, my name is MRS ------.

[MaryleeII]

A bit OT, but I can't stand the expressions "well bless your heart" Just WTH does that mean, anyways, and how does a person respond?

I saw a new doctor yesterday, when the "sweetie" (aka nurse) took my history, etc, she said "well bless your heart" What on earth do I say to that? its a Southern thing, I never could figure out WTH it meant, or how I was supposed to respond.....................

[Yankeesfan]

Originally Posted by smithy77

It would be great if there were some kind of vehicle for introducing young people to basic etiquette/communication skills. Some forward thinking companies do this in a round-about way, since they value emotional maturity and care about investing in their employees, but I think it would be better to start learning these things much earlier in life.

Although I'm not young, I work with a LOT of young people, plus know a lot of my adult children's friends, and I find them to be quite polite, respectful, respectable, and charming, as well as intelligent and creative, both in their professional settings and in their personal lives. People have been complaining about "young people today" probably since the first generation gave birth to the second . (Oh yeah, just look at that Cain and Abel business ... .)

But I think it has more to do with education, both at home and in schools. Students who are raised with good values and learn to take advantage of the opportunities given to them in good schools, and who graduate from college will generally be polite, respectful adults. Students whose parents hold the general concept of education in contempt, and then bring that uncaring attitude into contemptible schools and end up dropping out, will carry those negative attitudes into whatever workforce (fast food and the like) they enter, if they bother to enter the workforce at all. It really isn't a generational thing.