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Old 06-07-2012, 09:04 AM
 
76 posts, read 352,373 times
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Posted by Jayess1:
"Lived here longer than you. "

Unless you're older than 39 then I will stand down. Lived here all my life.
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Old 06-07-2012, 09:15 AM
 
882 posts, read 1,777,458 times
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By about 20 years, give or take. Family's been here since the 1600s.
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Old 06-07-2012, 09:27 AM
 
19,183 posts, read 28,345,113 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
Do you always argue to the extreme & then claim otherwise?
Usually, I just try to point out and clarify where others have made false or misleading statements or claims.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
Not claiming there's any "magic wand", but indeed there are real, tangible cash benefits to incorporating in Delaware & Nevada.
And Wyoming as well, but none of these has anything to do with either Exxon Mobil's or SAIC's tax liability to Virginia or Fairfax County.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
I note that you still can't answer my Q as to why so many incorporate in those two states...
It isn't just those two, and among the advantages of incorporation in Delaware are that it is easy, quick, and cheap, and that corporate law there allows leeway to officers and early investors to exert power in ways that are prohibited under the laws of many other states. Delaware is an excellent site for a public company (or a company planning to go public) to be incorporated in and many potential big-dollar investors will be at least suspect if you aren't. Incorporation in Delaware does not provide any "Get Out of Jail Free' cards with respect to tax liability in other states.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
Actually, most of the heritage Mobil folks haven't been moved much. FWIW, one of the key reasons Exxon bought them was for their expertise in petro logistics (a major business in the 90s - remember Enron?) and have stuck w/that here since then, expanding their trading & scheduling operations. In fact, FFAX is "ground zero" for the development of GOM, a new trading/scheduling/product flow system. Once that rolls out @ the world look for the move to accelerate.
What does this have to do with anything? What does "moved much" even mean? And by the way, do you think it makes you look hip to use "@" instead of going to all the trouble of typing out the word "at"?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
Glad to see you admit that the closing will have an impact on many areas of Fairfax life. OTOH, you seem not to understand that footnotes are quite important...
Snowzilla had an impact on many areas of Fairfax life, and footnotes are trivial sidebars in comparison to the main text.

Some people here -- including you -- are in full Chicken Little mode over an estimated 2100 jobs (that isn't really 2100 jobs) without so much as dipping a toe into such context as the fact that directly across the street from the Exxon Mobil campus stands Fairfax Hospital, an institution with 50% more employees than Exxon Mobil, and that's just counting Fairfax -- not the rest of the INOVA system -- and it's just counting the actual licensed and certified medical professionals who work there. How many people out there believe that the economic life of NoVa revolves around enough of our people becoming sick or injured to keep Fairfax Hospital humming along smoothly? Zero -- that's how many.

Last edited by saganista; 06-07-2012 at 09:37 AM..
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Old 06-07-2012, 09:49 AM
 
882 posts, read 1,777,458 times
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Ok, what exactly "false" or "misleading" claim have I made? I'll wait.

I note that you still are unable to answer my Q about Delaware & Nevada, and somehow you wish to deny that nearly 4/5 of the F500 are incorporated in one of those two states, or that if they are, it's not for tangible reasons.
This leads me to belive that you are not knowledgeable, and therefore can safely be ignored on the topic.
As to "move more" - you brought up that topic, not me. If you don't know why, well, I can't help you there.
FWIW, "footnotes" are the sources for other information. Perhaps you're unfamiliar w/their use?

"Some" may indeed be in "chicken little mode" - and please feel free to address them. I, however, am addressing those who claim little to no impact - such claims are patently false. Interesting that you bring the hospital into this - my wife was UMNICU there. Fascinating business, INOVA.
(which, BTW, was incorporated in... Delaware)
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Old 06-07-2012, 10:37 AM
 
63 posts, read 145,064 times
Reputation: 57
Well this is a nice pissing match now.

I don't know anything about corporate tax law, but I can't imagine a corporation can avoid paying state taxes just because they incorporated in Delaware. So Texas doesn't get any direct taxes from all those revenue-producing wells, refineries, and chemical plants just because the parent company is incorporated in DE? I just don't see it.

I'm sure there are benefits to incorporating in DE, but don't think there's any way that "not paying taxes to other states where you actually operate" is one of them.
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Old 06-07-2012, 10:45 AM
 
5,121 posts, read 5,540,803 times
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Oh, oh... I missed the Delaware questions. I am originally from Delaware They tells us the "why" of this in school. There are two reasons why corporations incorporate in Delaware.

1) Lower taxes -- I am not sure if companies can "not" pay other state taxes if they do business in those states, but in Delaware there is no corporate income tax for corporations so long as they don't do business in Delaware. Also, shares of stock in Delaware corporations are not subject to Delaware taxes if the owner lives outside the state.

2) The court system favors corporations if they are sued (there is a separate court system for businesses).
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:10 PM
 
882 posts, read 1,777,458 times
Reputation: 592
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cluckr7 View Post
Well this is a nice pissing match now.

I don't know anything about corporate tax law, but I can't imagine a corporation can avoid paying state taxes just because they incorporated in Delaware. So Texas doesn't get any direct taxes from all those revenue-producing wells, refineries, and chemical plants just because the parent company is incorporated in DE? I just don't see it.

I'm sure there are benefits to incorporating in DE, but don't think there's any way that "not paying taxes to other states where you actually operate" is one of them.
Note that this started when another thought that Companies paid most/all of it's taxes in the HQ state, and that XOM moving wouldn't be a loss of taxes. I simply pointed out that most F500 companies are actually incorporated in Delaware & Nevada to limit (not eliminate all) taxes. JB is correct - by incorporating in either one a company is free to choose in which (other) state they can claim primary status - and pay taxes in the lower taxed state.
I simply can't believe that someone claiming to have lived here for some time can say "meh" to such a move & assert no loss. But hey, whatever.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:20 PM
 
19,183 posts, read 28,345,113 times
Reputation: 4002
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
Ok, what exactly "false" or "misleading" claim have I made?
This is from Post-40...

FWIW, most of the F500 use Del. or Nevada to avoid taxes.

Did you write that? Is it false or misleading?
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:36 PM
 
19,183 posts, read 28,345,113 times
Reputation: 4002
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
I note that you still are unable to answer my Q about Delaware & Nevada, and somehow you wish to deny that nearly 4/5 of the F500 are incorporated in one of those two states, or that if they are, it's not for tangible reasons.
I have already presented a coherent and multi-faceted list of reasons for incorporating in Delaware. Perhaps you missed it? By contrast, I have made no statement at all about a paucity of incorporations in Delaware or in any other state. This is stuff you have to make up out of thin air in order to have anything to say at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
This leads me to believe that you are not knowledgeable, and therefore can safely be ignored on the topic.
LOL! Next, you'll threaten to put me on your Ignore List. Or did you just do that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
"Some" may indeed be in "chicken little mode" - and please feel free to address them.
You have been one of the Chicken Little ring-leaders here. None of your claims has withstood scrutiny so far. Got any more?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
I, however, am addressing those who claim little to no impact - such claims are patently false.
The claim raised is that whatever the impacts, they have been grossly and materially overstated by some posters here. That's the one you can't deal with, and that is because the defendant is guilty as charged.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayess1 View Post
Interesting that you bring the hospital into this - my wife was UMNICU there. Fascinating business, INOVA. (which, BTW, was incorporated in... Delaware)
What in heaven's name would either of these choice little tidbits have to do with the price of eggs? It's just more running away.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:41 PM
 
19,183 posts, read 28,345,113 times
Reputation: 4002
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cluckr7 View Post
Well this is a nice pissing match now.
And one of us needs to run off and quickly drink several more glasses of water.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cluckr7 View Post
I don't know anything about corporate tax law, but I can't imagine a corporation can avoid paying state taxes just because they incorporated in Delaware.
Yeah, pretty much no state would be collecting any corporate taxes at all if it were that easy.
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