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I just graduated this fall with a bachelor's degree in Computer Science and am gauging what kind of salary I would garner in this area. I've received a fair share of phone calls and am trying to work on a salary range I should shoot for.
My questions are as follows:
1. What degree do you have and what was your starting salary in this area out of college?
2. Were salaries negotiable when you started out in this area?
3. I plan to buy a condo soon and was wondering, what would the average salary be for a 25-27 year old college graduated who has established himself in this area?
if you have a degree in business. finance, accounting, CS, IS or IT - you be fine in this area
you'll probably start around 55-65
you don't negotiate your first salary for your first job out of college, you take what you can get
once you have some years of experience, you know, something to stand on, then you negotiate like batman
can't answer the condo question, doesn't seem thought out or genuine, most people work for years first then buy unless mommy and daddy have cash for toilet paper
omg im going to make money??????????????????? *jumps up and down like a cheerleader*
I suggest you ask people who are working in the kinds of jobs you hope to get, because replies from non-IT people will be mostly speculation. That likely means you'll want to ask on a computer-science forum. Or perhaps there might be some IT folks here who have experience-based answers.
What particular discipline are you looking to work in? Software development? IT security? Something else?
That said, I think it's a major mistake not to try to negotiate any salary offer, except for rare instances in which it's overwhelmingly obvious to all involved that the would-be employer is being generous (e.g., they beat your current salary by 25%). I know you're just out of school, but a prospective employer doesn't know that you don't have other offers out there--or that you might soon. Not to say you should roll your eyes and ask "Is that all?"--but you could thank them for the offer and ask if that's the best salary they can do. There's a happy medium between arrogance and desperation. Certainly, no decent employer would fault you for asking for the best offer they can give you.
I will say that judging just from your post here, you have a few things in your favor: You did notmajor in business (largely the domain of illiterate fratboys). You can write a complete sentence, with caps and punctuation. And you know how to say "thank you."
That said, I think it's a major mistake not to try to negotiate any salary offer, except for rare instances in which it's overwhelmingly obvious to all involved that the would-be employer is being generous (e.g., they beat your current salary by 25%). I know you're just out of school, but a prospective employer doesn't know that you don't have other offers out there--or that you might soon. Not to say you should roll your eyes and ask "Is that all?"--but you could thank them for the offer and ask if that's the best salary they can do. There's a happy medium between arrogance and desperation. Certainly, no decent employer would fault you for asking for the best offer they can give you.
I will say that judging just from your post here, you have a few things in your favor: You did notmajor in business (largely the domain of illiterate fratboys). You can write a complete sentence, with caps and punctuation. And you know how to say "thank you."
Most larger companies aren't going to negotiate. They follow HR guidelines and it's generally take it or leave it and if you don't take it they move on to the next of many candidates with similar skills and experience they generally have in line for the job. What you don't have in your favor apparently that Carolingtonian's "illiterate fratboys" often have in spades is a social network. Most jobs are obtained through connections. You may want to start building one.
I would guess that with a college degree, particularly in computer science, a personable and qualified candidate should be in at least the 60 - 70K starting range (possibly a bit more in a high cost of living area such as NoVA).
80 - 100k is a bit high for recent grad without work experience, unless you are a rock star or in area where there is fierce competition for engineers (e. g. Silicon Valley or Seattle).
And 50k might be more in line with paid internship for a recent grad (?)
http://www.cnbc.com/id/48942083/Help...gineering_Jobs (commentator at end of video clip talking about engineering salaries already going through the roof on west coast is Mark Cuban, owner of the Dallas Mavericks)
Hope this helps, and Good Luck!
Last edited by mshan242709; 01-21-2013 at 09:48 PM..
That said, I think it's a major mistake not to try to negotiate any salary offer, except for rare instances in which it's overwhelmingly obvious to all involved that the would-be employer is being generous (e.g., they beat your current salary by 25%)
You really can't negotiate your first job straight out of college. (I mean, you can ask--but they'll say no). My husband and I both did/do a lot of recruiting and hiring work for our respective consulting firms, and HR was very clear that it's a formula:
Your major
Your GPA
The school you went to
Type those into the program, and it spits out your salary. There is no wiggle room for campus hires. If you have experience, there are discussions to be had, but otherwise it is what they offer, and that's final.
Let me bring a perspective as a former (now retired) employer (I was a senior executive in both the public and for-profit sectors).
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAVA1990
It depends on the value you can bring to an employer.
While this is true as a general statement, it does not apply well to particular individuals. In many fields (outside of sales and such), a strict material evaluation of "value" of an employee is difficult to make. With new employees, employers are always rolling the dice since they are dealing with an unknown quantity. You are not offering so much "value" as a "prospect of value," which is different.
Let's just say that, once the technical substance is there, it would be helpful for OP to have competing offers (both to establish salary parameters and to increase the sense of competition among the employers) and a projection of confidence, "can-do" and team-spirit, without of course any sense of arrogance or personality disorder of some sort. This is business, not charity. Employers are looking for someone who is smart and capable AND someone who is able to learn quickly, integrate himself rapidly into the existing culture and start performing their assigned role as soon as possible. Never forget that you are there to make money for the employer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlingtonian
That said, I think it's a major mistake not to try to negotiate any salary offer, except for rare instances in which it's overwhelmingly obvious to all involved that the would-be employer is being generous (e.g., they beat your current salary by 25%). I know you're just out of school, but a prospective employer doesn't know that you don't have other offers out there--or that you might soon. Not to say you should roll your eyes and ask "Is that all?"--but you could thank them for the offer and ask if that's the best salary they can do. There's a happy medium between arrogance and desperation. Certainly, no decent employer would fault you for asking for the best offer they can give you.
I will say that judging just from your post here, you have a few things in your favor: You did notmajor in business (largely the domain of illiterate fratboys). You can write a complete sentence, with caps and punctuation. And you know how to say "thank you."
This was a very good advice until it hit the rather condescending "illiterate fratboys" remark. Yes, the OP should absolutely negotiate even in his first job. Every price is negotiable in life and that goes for the price of your life (or a fraction thereof) as well. Likely your leverage will not be high if this is your first paying gig, but a modest degree of negotiation 1) will not hurt the employer's perception of the prospective employee, 2) may net a somewhat higher salary and 3) may establish the prospective employee as someone who is confident and is not a "pushover." But don't be someone who has to be spoon-fed; research like crazy and learn everything there is to know about the prospective job, the employer, the salary range, etc. Don't just rely on the internet. Pick up a phone and call friends, family, acquaintances and their friends, family and acquaintances. You have to show up and talk like you know what you are talking about, not throw crazy numbers and act like you are owed something.
As for the business degree-illiterate fratboys remark... while it is true that a business degree is somewhat generic (or perhaps because of it), there is a very wide range in the caliber of graduates who study business. I know a good few financial firms, for example, which readily hire business majors and in fact prefer "jocks," many of whom Carlingtonian may deem "illiterate fratboys." Some firms do value graduates who are aggressive and have good networking/socialization skills.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAVA1990
Most larger companies aren't going to negotiate. They follow HR guidelines and it's generally take it or leave it and if you don't take it they move on to the next of many candidates with similar skills and experience they generally have in line for the job. What you don't have in your favor apparently that Carolingtonian's "illiterate fratboys" often have in spades is a social network. Most jobs are obtained through connections. You may want to start building one.
Good advice on connections. And connections are not necessarily nepotistic. Believe it or not, you can actually network with employers and find other leads. There is a saying in fundraising that the main reason why people give you money is because you asked them. The same goes for jobs. If someone says no, you can always ask him whether he knows someone else who might say yes. However, in my experience, your assertion that big companies do not negotiate is not true. HR departments work with ranges, not set salaries. The ranges may, of course, be very narrow, but I say get the top of the spectrum if you can. It's incumbent upon you to extract the maximum possible while landing the job.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliTerp07
You really can't negotiate your first job straight out of college. (I mean, you can ask--but they'll say no). My husband and I both did/do a lot of recruiting and hiring work for our respective consulting firms...
I don't keep up with the management consulting industry of late, but quite a few of my university and graduate school chums went into the field (but that was before the days of the Big Three) and all negotiated their first salaries. HOWEVER, all were Ivy League graduates and all but one had master's degrees (usually a combination of engineering bachelor's and MBA or engineering and double Sc.M.-MBA combo).
Oddly enough, the only one who stayed in the field was the lone guy without a master's degree. He is now a principal (I would guess he makes a high six figure to one million plus range a year though his numbers in the last few years are probably not as good). The rest split off 1) to start their own firms, 2) to executive positions at established companies or 3) to switch careers into investment banking. One of those guys (category 1) is now a tech mogul in NorCal. He owns substantial stakes in big time companies. I wish I had kept a better touch with him.
I don't keep up with the management consulting industry of late, but quite a few of my university and graduate school chums went into the field (but that was before the days of the Big Three) and all negotiated their first salaries. HOWEVER, all were Ivy League graduates and all but one had master's degrees (usually a combination of engineering bachelor's and MBA or engineering and double Sc.M.-MBA combo).
Grad degrees are a different story. They expect MBAs to come in with varying experience and backgrounds, so there's room to negotiate. You aren't applying to entry level positions--with an MBA you're stepping into management level roles and higher. On the contrast, they know that no one coming straight from undergrad and applying to entry level positions has any relevant experience, so there's nothing to leverage to negotiate with.
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