Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Maybe it's because I am relatively new to northern VA but it seems like the topics dealing with foreign born are particularly polarizing. I was just reading a thread that talked about problems with people not speaking English before it was subsequently shut down. My question is though why are people so upset when points like that are made? Is it wrong to express frustration about not being able to communicate with other individuals especially when there are services that are to be rendered? You may not agree with the poster's viewpoint but couldn't you at least empathize with not being able to communicate? Is that not reason to be frustrated?
By the way before anyone says it. I will point out that I think it is fair to expect people to speak English in this country only because In order to become a legal citizen you must be able to read, write and speak fluent English. Is it easy? No, but it is important. Road signs aren't written in Portuguese after all. I can see this being a big issue in northern VA with all the foreign born residents, but how do you draw a line? Is it really okay for people to be in a place of service and not be able to speak the "common" language or should you at least have an expectation that businesses that do this should not be patronized.
Can we have a civil conversation please? Thank you.
Because those who post inflammatory stuff about how its so annoying that hispanics or other nationalities aren't amalgamating quickly are devoid of historical context.
You think the irish and italians amalgamated overnight in the 19th century and early 20th century? You think people didn't call them criminals, drunks, non-american, stupid? This isn't something new, its the same xenophobic bigotry that suppresses any new migration population to our country.
Should they learn how to speak english etc? Yes of course, but its not an over night thing. Are some more set in their culture? Yes, as are many italian americans today and irish americans today.
The civil conversation can begin when people recognize that hispanics and other immigrants are in our military defending our country, our police, firemen, hospital employees. They are good citizens, who have been scapegoated because an extremely small percentage of their population doesn't play by the rules (not significantly higher than any population mind you).
Negative perceptions aside, is it wrong to be frustrated with someone you cannot communicate with? I didn't see anything from that poster on that particular thread that singled out any group of people so I don't know how relevant your point is.
Yes it is tough to learn English but does that mean you shouldn't be frustrated? For example I have no problem with someone trying to make a living who doesn't have great English but is it really a good idea to be at a drive through window?
It's almost like trying to communicate with your children when they are young. They simply do not have vocabulary to speak for themselves so would I put my kids in a position that they have to do it?
Negative perceptions aside, is it wrong to be frustrated with someone you cannot communicate with? I didn't see anything from that poster on that particular thread that singled out any group of people so I don't know how relevant your point is.
Yes it is tough to learn English but does that mean you shouldn't be frustrated? For example I have no problem with someone trying to make a living who doesn't have great English but is it really a good idea to be at a drive through window?
It's almost like trying to communicate with your children when they are young. They simply do not have vocabulary to speak for themselves so would I put my kids in a position that they have to do it?
Seems like your issue is with the employer not the employee... perhaps if they paid more than minimum wage they could get people who are able to communicate in positions where communication is a skill that is necessary.
You get what you pay for, either way I'm sure the franchise owner and corporate are making record profits and sitting on record cashflow as are so many other companies in the US who are "going through rough times wink"
Either way, I find it hypocritical that those who espouse the brilliance of the free market fail to recognize that cheap labor and service = what the market place wants if it means saving 5 cents. So either vote with your wallet like I do and go to places that treat their employees right and therefore get better personnel or continue to go to bargain basement retail/food and get what you pay for.
Negative perceptions aside, is it wrong to be frustrated with someone you cannot communicate with? I didn't see anything from that poster on that particular thread that singled out any group of people so I don't know how relevant your point is.
Yes it is tough to learn English but does that mean you shouldn't be frustrated? For example I have no problem with someone trying to make a living who doesn't have great English but is it really a good idea to be at a drive through window?
It's almost like trying to communicate with your children when they are young. They simply do not have vocabulary to speak for themselves so would I put my kids in a position that they have to do it?
No, you didn't, and you wouldn't have. I have no problem with any nationality. I did not call any certain one out. My frustration, as stated in my OP, was when people could not speak English in a place of business. My opinion stands.
I do not have a communication barrier as another poster stated. Not unless they are speaking a foreign language or with such a heavy accent that their English cannot be understood. I can understand broken and improper English, that isn't even a problem.
I have all the patience in the world. My problem is that I have has sooo many occurrences where there has been a language barrier. Mistakes are made in all kinds of places when a person does not understand English. I have seen it in my own medical chart!
Another person mentioned their being the wealthy foreigner and the working poor foreigner. I feel it is quite possible that many of those wealthy foreigners may have gotten that way because of their understanding of the English language. Without that understanding, you can only go so far in a career or workplace.
No, you didn't, and you wouldn't have. I have no problem with any nationality. I did not call any certain one out. My frustration, as stated in my OP, was when people could not speak English in a place of business. My opinion stands.
I do not have a communication barrier as another poster stated. Not unless they are speaking a foreign language or with such a heavy accent that their English cannot be understood. I can understand broken and improper English, that isn't even a problem.
I have all the patience in the world. My problem is that I have has sooo many occurrences where there has been a language barrier. Mistakes are made in all kinds of places when a person does not understand English. I have seen it in my own medical chart!
Another person mentioned their being the wealthy foreigner and the working poor foreigner. I feel it is quite possible that many of those wealthy foreigners may have gotten that way because of their understanding of the English language. Without that understanding, you can only go so far in a career or workplace.
Again, vote with your wallet and feet. If you dont like the service at a place, stop going there. Bad businesses will die out if they don't change their ways.
I used to hate dominos, then they fixed themselves, now I prefer them to Papa Johns or Pizza Hut. I used to like Home Depot, now its a nightmare, so I never go there anymore. Eventually they will learn to stop hiring 14 year olds who dont know the difference between Black & Decker and Eric Decker.
All the complaining smacks of xenophobic kvetching to me, fueled by nitpicking and anecdotes. I haven't had a single issue ever with communicating with a single person over english. If I note that someone is a little bit weaker at english, I usually adjust and don't ask the world of them, or find someone else to help me, and worst case scenario I don't go to that store if they can't help me (as is the case with the 14 year old workers at Home Depots).
Simple solution
PS if you don't understand the angry backlash you get from some of the statements you make, its likely because you never had to learn English as a second language. I did. It was tough, I got picked on as a kid for it, it made learning that much more difficult as a kid. I worked hard and eventually not only learned how to speak english but likely speak it better than yourself (and most people I know). What is frustrating is that so many people just want to snap fingers and all of a sudden everyone is amalgamated. That's not how it works, it's never been how it works.
Last edited by tysonsengineer; 12-02-2013 at 12:11 PM..
It is how it is. I didn't have to learn it as a second language because I was born here. Maybe you were as well, I don't know. I was born to parents who were also born here and spoke English.
When I went to Target a few weeks ago to run in really quick to buy card stock for some invitations that's what I thought it would be. Really quick. It was far from it and I had a lot of other things to do as well that day. I would run in to get it if they had it, and if they didn't, I knew that I saw it at the Fed Ex store a couple of days earlier.
I looked in and out of the isles and area where I felt it should be and I didn't find it. I saw an employee, so I asked her. She took me to notebook paper. She was the sweetest lady, I had no problem with her. So then I told her that no, it was paper made to make cards. Then she took me to the cards.
Still not what I needed. Then she was going to go find someone else. If she spoke and understood English she would have been able to just tell me they don't sell it there, which they don't.
I am not sure why people think it is ok to have angry backlash at me, (although I knew there would be some) when it is not my fault that people don't speak English in a country where English is the number one spoken language. It is not my fault that a person has chosen to come here and not be able to speak the language and then have to try and learn it.
Also, you have know idea how I speak English, only how I write it. I have seen it done better, I have seen it done worse. I actually do not think you write it any better than I do.
I have been in NOVA since 73 and although the influx of Hispanic speakers didn't really start until the 80's I've had very few instances where language barriers presented any issues within a restaurant or store. Not sure where you are coming from.
It is how it is. I didn't have to learn it as a second language because I was born here. Maybe you were as well, I don't know. I was born to parents who were also born here and spoke English.
When I went to Target a few weeks ago to run in really quick to buy card stock for some invitations that's what I thought it would be. Really quick. It was far from it and I had a lot of other things to do as well that day. I would run in to get it if they had it, and if they didn't, I knew that I saw it at the Fed Ex store a couple of days earlier.
I looked in and out of the isles and area where I felt it should be and I didn't find it. I saw an employee, so I asked her. She took me to notebook paper. She was the sweetest lady, I had no problem with her. So then I told her that no, it was paper made to make cards. Then she took me to the cards.
Still not what I needed. Then she was going to go find someone else. If she spoke and understood English she would have been able to just tell me they don't sell it there, which they don't.
I am not sure why people think it is ok to have angry backlash at me, (although I knew there would be some) when it is not my fault that people don't speak English in a country where English is the number one spoken language. It is not my fault that a person has chosen to come here and not be able to speak the language and then have to try and learn it.
Also, you have know idea how I speak English, only how I write it. I have seen it done better, I have seen it done worse. I actually do not think you write it any better than I do.
How I write on this forum has nothing to do with how I speak. If your spoken english were better than mine, you would be in the minority of people.
You went to Target expecting for the minimum wage (or near it) employees to be able to assist you? If it was so easy why couldn't you find it? Perhaps you have problems with the english language using your own logic.
For reference, you could go to several different paper stores instead, Paper Source being one, where the employees are very knowledgeable about paper products. They also get paid better than the average target employee, but you will likely pay 20 to 30% more for similar products, but they will speak eloquently to your hearts delight.
You get what you pay for. Go to bargain bin basement retailers/big box: you get the big box experience. Go to small businesses and mom & pops, you get customer service at a slightly higher price.
*non-issue*
Last edited by tysonsengineer; 12-02-2013 at 12:47 PM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
