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I grew up in rural southeast Indiana. One family was so poor they did not having running water and they would smell because they were lucky to get a bath monthly.
I am a yuppie now and I accept this but I know what it is like to be around poor people. I lived in the same building as my tenants in Humboldt Park for several years without AC (basement unit but still could get hot when it got above 90 outside).
I spent 2 years framing buildings and working on commercial hog farm before getting into banking.
I work hard, have been fortunate and am aggressive enough to demand the high salary I make now.
Not everyone is going to have the drive or skills to get ahead. Some will do better and some will do worse than me.
There was very little keeping up with the Jones because the family that was worth 100mm rode same school bus as those on govt assistance (Murphy family in this case). We knew who had the money and who did not. There was no point in driving fancy car and if anything it was looked down given all those around who had so little.
Average household income in my hometown is 48k, way below those in Munster or Hinsdale.
I seriously doubt many of those comparing Munster to Hinsdale have ever been around true poverty except maybe occasional mission trip or brief stint in Americorps etc. Even teachers in poor districts get to go home to middle class comforts.
And the name calling begins. So you don't want to live around "snobs" but I'm a bad person for wanting to live near well educated upper class folks? Hmm ok. And by the way, just because a town has money doesn't mean there isn't a strong sense of community, local businesses, kind people, etc. Some of the meanest people I have met in my lifetime were poor but that doesn't mean that all poor people are mean just as it doesn't mean all wealthy people are "snobs" as you so eloquently stated.
You think you're not a snob but wouldn't feel comfortable living in NWI or the South/Southwest burbs because of the class of people that live there?
I don't think all people living in Illinois or in fancy Illinois suburbs are snobs, nor am I so naive to think that there are no snobby people in NWI. And I'm not saying there can be no sense of community or kind people in a wealthy area, but in general people who live in areas that are comprised of pretty much only wealthy people are often not all that welcoming to the proletariat moving in. Only being nice to people who are just like you does not a kind person make.
And I'm not all for trying to attract as many upper class people to the region as possible. Though I know there are plenty of people on this forum who want to have things like Nordstrom and an Apple store and more high-end homes, I'm not one of them. I like an area that's a good fit for a wide variety of people, not just one type.
Trust me I get it and you make many valid points. My original point, and I think yours as well, is that NWI will have a hard time attracting upper class folks. I find it interesting that those living in NWI have a strong desire to attract this social class or be referred to along these lines yet refer to those living in affluent Chicagoland suburbs as "snobs" and living in a "toxic environment." So which is it?
I know you're not calling me out, but while many in NWI do desire some nicer amenities (which of course is also driven by higher income families moving here and current residents increasing their wealth), I know that we wouldn't think those Chicago suburbs are any more snobby than other suburbs of Chicago think they are.
Trust me I get it and you make many valid points. My original point, and I think yours as well, is that NWI will have a hard time attracting upper class folks. I find it interesting that those living in NWI have a strong desire to attract this social class or be referred to along these lines yet refer to those living in affluent Chicagoland suburbs as "snobs" and living in a "toxic environment." So which is it?
I think NWI will have a hard time attracting the upper class, simply because there are no Winnetkas, Hilsdales, and the like in Indiana. The people who are living in the Winnetkas of the area can simply absorb the additional increases.
What population gains NWI sees are likely to be middle to upper middle class folks who are still yoked to Chicagoland.
Not for me. NWI simply does not appeal to me just as the south/southwest suburbs do not appeal to me. Much of this has to do with proximity to employment opportunities but also the noticeable difference in social class and education of the residents. I don't intend to come off as some arrogant d*ck but I feel more comfortable raising a family in this environment rather than somewhere in the southwest suburbs or NWI. Anyone that has spent considerable time in either region will feel the difference. Has nothing to do with race either. I will admit maybe it is changing because it's been 10 years since I lived/went to school in NWI but my feeling is it hasn't changed all that much based on my return trips back to Valpo and surrounding areas.
I find this statement puzzling. Not saying you're wrong, and of course you're entitled to your opinion and views. But, I don't know of anyone familiar with the area who would say that NWI hasn't changed much in the last 10 or so years. Valpo certainly has, as have St. John, Schererville, Munster, Dyer, Crown Point, Chesterton, etc. So I find it interesting that for one you say Valpo hasn't changed much considering you visit there at least it appears with some level of frequency. I also find it hard to believe you really have spent any kind of time in the last decade in the other aforementioned towns. Is that fair? Assuming it is, it appears you're very much in the same boat as many other people from Illinois. That being, working off a perception, or misperception, of what Northwest Indiana towns are like. Driving through them on a main road or highway does not lend an accurate portrayal of the towns, in my opinion. Not trying to be offensive, but there's a constant sense of ignorance (in the nicest way possible but true to the definition of the word) that people in Illinois have with respect to NWI. They just don't know, and truly aren't familiar... although they think and say they are. Anyone from Northwest Indiana, especially if you have roots in or work in Illinois, knows exactly where I'm coming from.
I find this statement puzzling. Not saying you're wrong, and of course you're entitled to your opinion and views. But, I don't know of anyone familiar with the area who would say that NWI hasn't changed much in the last 10 or so years. Valpo certainly has, as have St. John, Schererville, Munster, Dyer, Crown Point, Chesterton, etc. So I find it interesting that for one you say Valpo hasn't changed much considering you visit there at least it appears with some level of frequency. I also find it hard to believe you really have spent any kind of time in the last decade in the other towns aforementioned towns. Is that fair? Assuming it is, it appears you're very much in the same boat as many other people from Illinois. That being, working off a perception, or misperception, of what Northwest Indiana towns are like. Driving through them on a main road or highway does not lend an accurate portrayal of the towns, in my opinion. Not trying to be offensive, but there's a constant sense of ignorance (in the nicest way possible but true to the definition of the word) that people in Illinois have with respect to NWI. They just don't know, and truly aren't familiar... although they think and say they are. Anyone from Northwest Indiana, especially if you have roots in or work in Illinois, knows exactly where I'm coming from.
I have friends that live in Highland and Chesterton. I haven't seen much change in these towns over the past decade. I visit Valpo every 1-2 years and while the downtown area has made tremendous strides I don't see much change within the outlying areas. Of course these three towns don't encompass an entire region but they do provide a pretty good perspective IMO.
I have friends that live in Highland and Chesterton. I haven't seen much change in these towns over the past decade. I visit Valpo every 1-2 years and while the downtown area has made tremendous strides I don't see much change within the outlying areas. Of course these three towns don't encompass an entire region but they do provide a pretty good perspective IMO.
Highland hasn't changed much, I'll completely agree with you on that. That's why I didn't include it in my list. It's typically not one of the towns that are brought up first when recommending "best places to live" in NWI, although it's a solid and safe blue collar town. Chesterton has certainly made strides with residential construction, their downtown has become a great little place to visit, and they've added other retail while trying to maintain the small town feel. With respect to Valpo, what changes would you expect to have seen that you'd prefer for the "outlying areas"? I don't understand.
And, is it fair to say you've spent little to no time in the last 10 years in central/south Lake County, in any of the towns of St John, Munster, Schererville, Dyer, or Crown Point?
You think you're not a snob but wouldn't feel comfortable living in NWI or the South/Southwest burbs because of the class of people that live there?
I don't think all people living in Illinois or in fancy Illinois suburbs are snobs, nor am I so naive to think that there are no snobby people in NWI. And I'm not saying there can be no sense of community or kind people in a wealthy area, but in general people who live in areas that are comprised of pretty much only wealthy people are often not all that welcoming to the proletariat moving in. Only being nice to people who are just like you does not a kind person make.
And I'm not all for trying to attract as many upper class people to the region as possible. Though I know there are plenty of people on this forum who want to have things like Nordstrom and an Apple store and more high-end homes, I'm not one of them. I like an area that's a good fit for a wide variety of people, not just one type.
It's not just social class for the sake of status. That has nothing to do with it, for me at least. Typically social class within a community corresponds to real life measureables such as crime rate, school quality, and return on investment (home appreciation). These often move in tandem. It really is that simple. An educated, upper class community has a better shot of maintaining safety, academic performance, and home value - this is very noticeable within the various neighborhoods of Chicago. Until the numbers prove otherwise, why would you blame people for being apprehensive of the "proletariat" from moving in?
Here is another real life example. When my wife and I moved into our home there were two couples that went out of their way to welcome us. These two couples also had the nicest homes and likely the greatest amount of wealth of any families living on our block. Don't be so quick to judge.
Highland hasn't changed much, I'll completely agree with you on that. That's why I didn't include it in my list. It's typically not one of the towns that are brought up first when recommending "best places to live" in NWI, although it's a solid and safe blue collar town. Chesterton has certainly made strides with residential construction, their downtown has become a great little place to visit, and they've added other retail while trying to maintain the small town feel. With respect to Valpo, what changes would you expect to have seen that you'd prefer for the "outlying areas"? I don't understand.
And, is it fair to say you've spent little to no time in the last 10 years in central/south Lake County, in any of the towns of St John, Munster, Schererville, Dyer, or Crown Point?
I have not spent time in CP but have dined in parts of Munster and St. John with said NWI friends. Regarding Valpo, I haven't seen much improvement in the residential neighborhoods. It may be an unfair comparison, but I see new custom homes being built or significantly renovated every month in Hinsdale/Western Springs/La Grange/Downers Grove.
I have not spent time in CP but have dined in parts of Munster and St. John with said NWI friends. Regarding Valpo, I haven't seen much improvement in the residential neighborhoods. It may be an unfair comparison, but I see new custom homes being built or significantly renovated every month in Hinsdale/Western Springs/La Grange/Downers Grove.
Well of course you do...because you live there. I never see new homes being built there. However I see new homes being built in CP all the time.
Must be a boom in CP and not Hinsdale since that's what I see!
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