Sorry, found Ohio not so appealing... (Cleveland, Cincinnati: living, shop, moving to)

[paintballer1708]

Camelback Mountain is awesome, Oneway. It is awesome how it just raises up right in the middle of the city. I got to hike that a few years back and it had amazing views across Phoenix. The trails were very nice too, lol i remember some of the people that were with us who werent in the best of shape, well lets say they had a little trouble getting to our destination. Camelback Mountain is one of my favorite urban retreats in the nation, along with Mount Charelston in Las Vegas, Cuyahoga Nat'l Park in Cleveland, and Grant Park in Chicago. If you visit Phoenix, i say you need a visit to Camelback Mountain.

[OneWayOut]

Originally Posted by paintballer1708

Camelback Mountain is awesome, Oneway. It is awesome how it just raises up right in the middle of the city. I got to hike that a few years back and it had amazing views across Phoenix. The trails were very nice too, lol i remember some of the people that were with us who werent in the best of shape, well lets say they had a little trouble getting to our destination. Camelback Mountain is one of my favorite urban retreats in the nation, along with Mount Charelston in Las Vegas, Cuyahoga Nat'l Park in Cleveland, and Grant Park in Chicago. If you visit Phoenix, i say you need a visit to Camelback Mountain.

Yes, it is great. They say it is the best view in town. I can't wait to try South Mountain park, Sqaw peak, and "A" mountain-- there is one more, but I cant think of it. Here is one of the pics I took while I was on Camelback:


We couldnt make it up all the way either, lol. 112 Degrees that day was not helping much... Will have to get in shape alittle more to make it all the way up. I felt stupid because there were Phoenicians jogging up the trail that day, like it was nothing. Of course we had no idea that there were 2 different trails, and we were on the most difficult one.... I have to say, Camelback mountain park (or Echo Canyon park) is in a very nice, upscale neighborhood. There is an actual castle that someone built on the Camelback road side of the mountain that was featured on the Travel channel's show "Great American Castles".

Cuyahoga Park in Cleveland is great too. I have not been to any of the others you mention. I went hiking there this summer with a few friends and it was a great experience. I plan to visit Wayne National Forest and the Hocking Hills area too. I promised my friends here we would all travel there when I come back to Ohio to visit.

[dweller]

I don't think you can generalize Ohio by just looking at Toledo. I was there once and it really sucks. There is so much sprawl going on yet Toledo itself is such a hole. Full of gangsters and racists. And the good ole boy attitude you talked about got on my nerves big time. People want to act as scummy as possible. White trash everywhere you go and people that don't care about how they present themselves to others.
As for other parts of OHio, Columbus itself is not for me. Their downtown is weird as it seems to be sprawled out mess of retail establishments and hotels that look more suburban and dont' belong in a downtown. Downtown columbus also smells bad and is dead at night time. The obsession with Ohio State and professional sports is also annoying.
Cleveland I have found to be most suitable. There isn't a total obsession with professional sports, the downtown is more of what downtown should be, and there seems to be a good diversity of people beyond just college kids and includes a decent young professional 25-35 crowd. You just have to avoid most of cleveland and restrict yourself to downtown, Case Western, or the suburbs if thats what suits you.
What ohio needs is to stop the sprawl and start concentrating development within city boundaries. Montreal, whre I live, which is clearly the number one city in north america, has a population density four times higher than any city in PA or Ohio and the highway system surroundign the city is crap, so there is not much sprawl here. It makes for a very liveable, walkable, and exciting city with many options for dining and nightlife (namely 5000 of them, 2nd to only NYC). Plus the women are amazingly beautiful and friendly due to not only French immigration from the past but immigration coming from South American and the middle east and india and coming here to mix with other cultures. enough of babbling...

[OneWayOut]

Originally Posted by dweller

I don't think you can generalize Ohio by just looking at Toledo. I was there once and it really sucks. There is so much sprawl going on yet Toledo itself is such a hole. Full of gangsters and racists. And the good ole boy attitude you talked about got on my nerves big time. People want to act as scummy as possible. White trash everywhere you go and people that don't care about how they present themselves to others.
As for other parts of OHio, Columbus itself is not for me. Their downtown is weird as it seems to be sprawled out mess of retail establishments and hotels that look more suburban and dont' belong in a downtown. Downtown columbus also smells bad and is dead at night time. The obsession with Ohio State and professional sports is also annoying.
Cleveland I have found to be most suitable. There isn't a total obsession with professional sports, the downtown is more of what downtown should be, and there seems to be a good diversity of people beyond just college kids and includes a decent young professional 25-35 crowd. You just have to avoid most of cleveland and restrict yourself to downtown, Case Western, or the suburbs if thats what suits you.
What ohio needs is to stop the sprawl and start concentrating development within city boundaries. Montreal, whre I live, which is clearly the number one city in north america, has a population density four times higher than any city in PA or Ohio and the highway system surroundign the city is crap, so there is not much sprawl here. It makes for a very liveable, walkable, and exciting city with many options for dining and nightlife (namely 5000 of them, 2nd to only NYC). Plus the women are amazingly beautiful and friendly due to not only French immigration from the past but immigration coming from South American and the middle east and india and coming here to mix with other cultures. enough of babbling...

I try not to generalize the entire state, as there are parts of it I like, and parts I have not been to.

Sprawl is everywhere, not just specific to Toledo-- but there is good and bad sprawl-- Toledo has both, but most of it is bad.

Everything else you say is spot-on, I am in total agreement with you.

[paintballer1708]

dweller, i have to agree with you on some and others i have to stat some facts lol. Columbus has a very nice downtown that is not dead at all, it is really booming. Cleveland is a great city like you mentioned as you seemed to like it there. Ohio does have a lot of sprawl. This whole nation is experiencing this problem. Cities across this nation are starting to invest in the cities themselves to slow down sprawl. You should go out to LA and other western cities and down south. The sprawl down there is just horrible. One city to watch out for is Charlotte, NC.

[dweller]

What do you mean one city to watch out for is Charlotte? Good or bad?

[paintballer1708]

dweller, its bad as far as sprawl wise. From the north, south and west. Charlotte to Gastonia is the worst, as well as Charlotte to the northern suburbs.

[OneWayOut]

The bad thing about the sprawl here in Toledo is they are ripping up nice virgin woods and farmland, paving roads thru it, then attempting to put up 300-400 "cookie-cutter" homes. They have started so many developments, and they either sit empty with no homes for months on end, or they build homes and hardly anyone moves in.

You could not give me a house an one of those places. I would not spend $250K + on a home that is the same as the other 299 houses in the neighborhood.

It is also amazing that they are finding people to buy these homes in the $350K plus areas.

There are certainly more struggling and empty developments here than full ones. I guess they are banking on the trend of everyone moving from Toledo into the suburbs. The slow sales and empty lots reflect the job and economy situation here.

Definitely one of the things I find "not so appealing".

[where_to_move]

sounds like you need to go back to Maryland. Why not go back? I am not the biggest fan of Ohio, but some of your ranting seems too exaggerated, or like you just want to cause controversy...

[OneWayOut]

Originally Posted by where_to_move

sounds like you need to go back to Maryland. Why not go back? I am not the biggest fan of Ohio, but some of your ranting seems too exaggerated, or like you just want to cause controversy...

Yeah, my ranting was over the top a little, but the core subjects of it are correct in my view. Save the exaggerations, my ranting was not intended just to cause controversy. It states my exact opinions and facts about my experience living in Toledo, Ohio (mostly Toledo, and somewhat Ohio).

I could go back to MD, its a great place, I miss it everyday, and I have seriously considered it, believe me. This has kept me up nights. Ever had that feeling that you have no direction? I do have good employment here, but thats not everything. I need to be somewhere that suits me, and I can eventually raise a family in-- and Ohio is not it.

However, I am relatively young and single, and their is an entire country out there, and so why not explore, and find the best place there is, for me? I mean, there is so much, why short-change myself when I know there is something better?