Now that SB 5 has been signed into law... (Conneaut, Republic: house, buy)

[taxedtodeath]

Originally Posted by buzzards27

2009 GDP negative 2.6% as opposed to 2010 GDP 2.9% with a Q4 at 3%, 2011 Q1 estimates between 2.5% and 3.5% (artifically held down by weather) AND 2011 Q2 estimate at 4%. I'm pretty sure we will continue to see positive growth in GDP.

Wow, 3% growth and 216K private sector jobs added per month....

All with MASSIVE stimulus in the form of $1.3T deficits, 3 wars, doubling of the monetary base by the FED, zero short term interest rates and mortgage interest rates ~4%. What do you think is going to happen when the party bowl is taken away?

Originally Posted by buzzards27

You seem to be ALL for SB5,

Wrong, I think SB5 is dumb law.

Originally Posted by buzzards27

you wrongly believe SB5 is about fixing the pension underfunding

No its about attempting to restore a proper balance of power to the taxpayers. Which will happen whether SB5 prevails or not, economics will dictate that.

Originally Posted by buzzards27

and enjoy laying distorted data out into the ether hoping some will draw the wrong conclusions. Sorry, I gotta doubt anything you say what you when you cherry pick data and freely use distorted charts.

And you haven't provides ANY data, just hyperbole. But we can still be friends, I admire your spirit!

[Droolrockworm]

Return the balance of power to the taxpayers? Are you under the assumption that public workers have ever had more power than the taxpayers. During times of good economic growth public workers never did better than 3% that I know of and even in times of bust the public unions have taken 0% and even losses in medical coverage etc. To assume that unions have a great deal of power over a mostly appathetic public is absurd to say the least. The real problems come not from increasing costs from public workers but from a lack of revenue from the private sector since abatements for corporate America/Ohio are the norm not the exception. Removing the tangable property tax is a large reason for the shortfalls we are seeing in public schools. Another issue is the unfunded mandates created by no child left behind and the increased needs of extreme special need children that have flooded the public schools without an increase in funding from the federal government to offset the change. At some point we have to start reinvesting in America/Ohio. We spend far too much on defense in our country and have allowed companies to become so large that they dictate laws such as SB5 and force abatements or they threaten to leave. We need to be on the right side of this issue and stop pandering to the every need of the richest 1% of the population at the expense of the working/middle classes which are forced to pick up the tab for the lost revenue or lose services. It is baffling to me that anyone that works for a living can feel sorry for billionaires and supprt more tax breaks knowing that they are the ones that will feel the pain for the lost revenues.

[buzzards27]

from 2008 Q1 to 2010 Q4 there has only been a nominal 1.73% annualized increase in "investment" by all government level in the USA, $2.81 to $3.03 trillion. The overall GDP grew by 3.8% annualized.

The real problem is the 12.6% annualized drop in private investment. I guess if that is the only metric you look at we are in trouble. But I think the big corporations are running out of excuses for withholding their participation in the economy.

Of course, if you liked the negative 0.72% GDP annualized growth we enjoyed under Bush's last three years, we could go back there.

Originally Posted by taxedtodeath

Wow, 3% growth and 216K private sector jobs added per month....

All with MASSIVE stimulus in the form of $1.3T deficits, 3 wars, doubling of the monetary base by the FED, zero short term interest rates and mortgage interest rates ~4%. What do you think is going to happen when the party bowl is taken away?



Wrong, I think SB5 is dumb law.



No its about attempting to restore a proper balance of power to the taxpayers. Which will happen whether SB5 prevails or not, economics will dictate that.



And you haven't provides ANY data, just hyperbole. But we can still be friends, I admire your spirit!

gee, i thought SB5 was all about fixing the budget gap. Now it is about restoring balance?

[taxedtodeath]

Originally Posted by buzzards27

Of course, if you liked the negative 0.72% GDP annualized growth we enjoyed under Bush's last three years, we could go back there.

You got me all wrong, I'm a Ron Paul guy, the other Texan.

[CortlandGirl79]

^From Pittsburgh...........

[taxedtodeath]

Originally Posted by CortlandGirl79

^From Pittsburgh...........

Even better!

[buzzards27]

Originally Posted by taxedtodeath

You got me all wrong, I'm a Ron Paul guy, the other Texan.

good one,

the problem i see is that every time you make changes to things you discover unintended consequences. SB5 in some form might be a great thing somewhere. But I don't think this is the time and Ohio is not the place to test these ideas.

[taxedtodeath]

Originally Posted by buzzards27

good one,

the problem i see is that every time you make changes to things you discover unintended consequences. SB5 in some form might be a great thing somewhere. But I don't think this is the time and Ohio is not the place to test these ideas.

Hey! We agree!

[Buckeye3]

I'm a public school employee who works as a speech pathologist. Just looking through my contract, some of the unintended consequences might be: loss of minimum class sizes, loss of those planning periods which I rarely have time for anyways, loss of the small amount of money allotted for new updated materials for student use, loss of the right of a separate room for therapy. The last item might sound a little melodramatic to some, but trust me I have been placed in some weird places in other jobs that definitely were not conducive to student learning. Another unintended consequence is the fact that under the new law music, art and gym don't have to be taught by teachers credentialed in those areas. Too bad for your child the budding artist or musician I guess. Actually, most of the contract has nothing to do with pay and benefits. Too bad for the kids who might want to take more than the bare minimum of classes if their district can't afford it after the budget cuts that Kasich advocating. I know, I know the new law gives the schools "flexibility" to deal with budget cuts by chopping the teachers' salaries and benefits. Don't be surprised at the turn over of staff, especially in the lower income schools then. This situation is truly a sad turn of events.

[ZnGuy]

Originally Posted by CortlandGirl79

I would like to see how much corporate america spent on the GOP vs. Dems, Zn.....

I doubt anywhere near 92%