Has illegal immigration hurt Ohio? (apartments, travel, job)

[jlrosen]

that is like saying I'm fine with the poor moving to indian hill as long as they do so legally, but there is no legal avenue for them to do so

our statute of liberty says:

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me.
I lift my lamp beside the golden door."

[YoMikey617]

Go live in LA for a year and then come back and tell us how much you love poor illegal Mexicans.

Seriously... The burden that states with high levels of illegals face is not something that we want or should desire to have. The very idea "that Ohio could and should share the burden" with states like California, Texafornia, and Georgafornia is just insane. If we welcome massive numbers of illegals into Ohio we're going to have more of a bellcurve economy where the upper middle class lives well (as always) and the lower class citizens can't get lower paying jobs because illegals will do it cheaper without benefits.

States with high rates of illegals made their own bed with this issue so let their "smart" governments pay the price. Ohio's economy has suffered enough from the drain to the sunbelt and Mexico.... OHIO OWES NOTHING TO THE SUNBELT.

SHIP THEM BACK TO MEXICO.
BUILD THE FENCE. (but build it several miles inland to protect border town economies and the river valley eco system)
LET'S BE SELECTIVE ABOUT WHO WE LET IN THE COUNTRY.

If everyone in the world wants to come to America, why in the world should we let the poorest of the poor and uneducated into the US ??? Let's be like Canada and require immigrants to have degrees. I also think we should tax immigrants at a higher rate for their first 10 years. Call it an admission price??? Who cares I bet most of them would pay it.

[YoMikey617]

Originally Posted by jlrosen

that is like saying I'm fine with the poor moving to indian hill as long as they do so legally, but there is no legal avenue for them to do so

our statute of liberty says:

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me.
I lift my lamp beside the golden door."

The Statue of Liberty might say that... But if you look at who came over from Europe it wasn't the poorest of the poor. You had to have some money for the boat trip, so the poorest of the poor were mostly left behind in Europe. When they got here, there was no such thing as multilingual public education and police departments and court systems didn't hire multilingual employees to guarantee fairness and equity in our public services. OH YEAH and nobody sued the hospital for malpractice if the doctors / nurses couldn't understand the spanish speaking patient.

[boardmanite]

Hmmmm.... I don't have time to reply cause I'm off to work in 5 minutes. This weekend I will be partying and smoking crack, and Monday I will have a hangover. But on Tuesday, I will respond to the allegations against me!!!

Cheers to all. Except the illegals.

PS: Yes, I did live in that wonderful, little place called Boardman, Ohio...

[Stephan_K]

Cortlandgirl79, Interesting. I'll ramble a bit and throw some of my experience out there too. It is pretty wild indeed. I grew up around the very same environment pretty much as you but only experiencing the opposite of what you have. I'm was raised in Howland, an even more silver spoon community than Cortland . (my spoons better than yours....hehehehe) My dad was a mill rat, Republic Steel.....remember when they were called that? You are probably to young to remember that but probably do remember it being called LTV Steel....then Warren Consolidated or what ever it is today. I don't pay attention to it anymore. They change names like I change under ware and employ about 2 people today compared to the 70's.

My mother ran her own business since 76, and my parents lived very extravagantly. I was spoiled growing up that's for sure. Been on airplanes a few times a year, every year, flying all over the world. Drove fancy cars, never had to worry about anything growing up. I think I have visited just about every country and island on this half of the globe. All my friends for the most part lived very similar family lives as you. Very conservative. I was very fortunate and thankful to have experienced the "fast" life that I have before moving out on my own. At 19 I moved out and never looked back, never asked my parents for anything either. Wasn't anything to ask for as they spent everything they ever made !

I moved out, worked construction, lived with my girlfriend, was a sponge and partied my ass off with everything I made . Yep the good ol days. Eventually, somehow I managed to saved up $2K and purchased a house on Ward St in Warren when I was 24. Just across Parkman Rd from Westlawn! Do you remember Westlawn? Hehe........What a transition from Howland to the W side of Warren on the outskirts of Westlawn. Couldn't distinguish the gun shots from the fire crackers at first.....there was a lot of both! What a freaking trip those days were. Crack heads living across the street and everything. Never a dull moment in that neighborhood. Lived there for about 7 years .

Got married at 29 and had 2 kids. I then had to become real responsible. That sucked ........Again managed to save enough money working construction and I now live in Cortland, west side of the lake behind the fairgrounds........you know, the "slums" of Cortland, hehe, as some of the "Cortland" people will refer to it as. For some reason I just can't seem to get away from the slum areas . I love how some of the east side of the lake people snub their nose at us at times. My wife hates when that happens with a passion. She is originally a Warren Harding Girl and is easily offended by it for some reason. I on the other hand think it is hilarious. I grew up with all that yuppie crap in Howland but never bought into any of it. I am the black sheep of the family. I've had people tell me I belong out in Leavittsburg or down in WV or something........I love it !!! Polo shirt....wouldn't be caught dead in one. Tee shirts and sweats. That's it!

Today I am very well off and still belong in WV some would say. Started an internet business with a credit card in 2002 and it exploded into a 3 mill a year business. Along with being extremely lucky with my timing of it, I have to give some credit to this depressed area we live in for some of my success. Being as depressed as it is I was able to find skilled people willing to work for a fraction of what they would have cost me in other areas of the country and was able to purchase a large inexpensive building in downtown Cortland. Worked out very well for me and I am very thankful. If I had to continue to rely on construction income, we would have lost our home by now and it surely wouldn't be anything near what it is today.

I have been restoring my 1880 century home to original Victorian that it once was over the last few years. Gingerbread and all inside and out! It is amazing. I have a fortune in this place. Maple floors throughout, custom made 5" oak casing, 12" base blocks and 10" molded rosettes. Crown molding throughout, all 4 panel eyebrow oak doors with original brass steeple hinges and solid brass mortise door hardware. Pull chain toilets and the whole nine yards. It's truely a masterpiece for anyone who appreciates Victorian style with some modern twists......like jacuzzi tubs , 1100 sq ft cedar deck, observatory, 2 acre pond.....etc.

Shame of it is, I'll never get out of it what I have in it. NEVER, not in this area. I'm going to end up letting it go for what ever I am offered for it pretty much when I put it on the market. It should go pretty quick even in this terrible market as it is an unbelievable home on 18 acres just outside of town. Some things there will always be in demand no matter how bad the market is and I think this is one. We will see. Put this house in Timber Creek and forget it. It will sit there for sale like all the rest of them. On 18 acres away from everything, priceless. I HOPE!

Next week after I close on the sale of my business I will be retired but am way too young to do so. Other than the monster of a business I created and built in 6 years, all I know is construction. I would love to get back into it part time for something to do a couple days a week but this areas has nothing.....and I mean nothing. Talked to all my old contacts and even the big commercial contractors, (who are shutting down by the way after the new Harding High school is finished) they have no work and are not even bidding jobs. Nothing to bid! There is nothing going on in this region commercially and that is the sign of all signs. I feel bad because a lot of my friends lives "are" building and now they are basically going bankrupt. All the big money is leaving or has left the area or it is being diverted out of the area.

I am actually forced to leave the area if I wish to do anything other than rot away and watch my rather large property investment depreciate even more. I sort of feel bad about leaving the area but I have 2 young boys to think of. As great as Cortland is as a community (and it is better than most), a better economic area will be more advantageous for them 10 years from now when it will impact them the most. I am cutting my losses now while I can justify them and recoup them in a very short time in a growing economic area. And there are many of them, they are just very expensive to get into.

I feel your pain and understand the job market very well. What you describe the job market as being soon is exactly what it will be like. I FORTUNATELY have the ability to create my own or easily move to a place where these types of problems will not be so prevalent. It is sad but this is the world we live in and what our Gov has let happen to this great country. I truely do feel for those that are "trapped" in this area as many are.

Whoooow.......what a rant I went on. Cortlandgirl79, I think I got you beat in the ranting department

[Stephan_K]

Originally Posted by boardmanite

Hmmmm.... I don't have time to reply cause I'm off to work in 5 minutes. This weekend I will be partying and smoking crack, and Monday I will have a hangover. But on Tuesday, I will respond to the allegations against me!!!

Cheers to all. Except the illegals.

PS: Yes, I did live in that wonderful, little place called Boardman, Ohio...

Lay off that crack dude.......it's messin with hour head . Better off putting that money in the market right now. Good time to buy, everythings cheap! Even in a crack enduced coma this weekend you couldn't miss picking a winner .

[boardmanite]

I have a few minutes at work before I officially have to start, so I'll write a bit. First off, I shouldn't have said that I wouldn't feel sorry for someone who lost a job to an illegal. Looking back that was in poor taste. The point I wanted to make was that illegals aren't stealing jobs away from the majority of Americans. They simply can't. They don't have the necessary skills to do most of our jobs.

I was also drawing on a little of my own experience. After graduating from high school (not in Boardman, but in rural W PA), I took two years off and worked at several different odd jobs. One of the jobs was working for a tax preparation company, so I do know some things about the economy, though I don't pretend to be an expert. The rest of my jobs were very low-paying and dead end jobs (as was the job at the tax prep place), and I saw that if my life was going to go anywhere, I needed to go to college.

So I worked my way through college. Paid for it myself with loans. Worked my ass off to get good grades. Didn't party. Didn't smoke crack. I got a scholarship to study in South America, where I met many former "illegals" who had made some money and returned home to go on with their lives. When I got back, I volunteered as a translator for many illegals throughout the area. I got to meet lots of interesting people who all had a unique story to tell. I never saw any evidence of any of them abusing the system. I know that happens, but I never once saw it. What I did see was lots of others who volunteered their time as well to help them. It made us happy. Not bitter and angry like so many of the posters in this thread. So yeah, that's why I'm soft of immigration--even illegals.

Like I said, I don't know much about economics. I only took one course in it and one in business. But the way I see things (and if I'm wrong, please point it out to me), if we give amnesty to illegals, let them pay taxes AND social security, then we'll be getting back some of the money we spent on them and maybe, just maybe there will be social security left when my generation hits 65. Plus, I saw that even though the illegals didn't pay taxes, they spent their money here. That no doubt helps the economy. And just a side point: even if we did tax illegals, I don't think they'd pay much anyways. The poor don't pay much at all in taxes. Many get back way more than they pay in. It may be cheaper for us in the long run to NOT tax them, cause then we don't have to give them Earned Income Credit. (which can be almost $5,000 for a working class family)

I don't consider myself spoiled as was stated earlier. I've worked very hard to get where I am today. My parents were unsupportive of me going to college. Neither of them went. I have huge loans to pay off. I've paid for my own health care. I've been on welfare. My parents went through periods of unemployment due to plant closings. We were never rich, or upper-middle class. And I don't smoke crack. As a tutor at University, I watched students going there for free (grants) and not take their studies seriously at all. I guess those are the ones I wouldn't feel sorry for if they lost their job to an illegal...

So yeah, maybe I'll change my feelings when I'm older. Who knows. Mabye I'll "see the light". But until then, I still would love to see a Chinatown or Little Mexico in Youngstown. It would make the city more interesting.

[CortlandGirl79]

Stephan_K, I just knew you were a Howland snob!!! HAHA! Anyway, interesting story. I don't remember Republic Steel, but I've definitely heard of it, i believe it's WCI now. I do know about westlawn and i still have a great uncle that still lives over there. Yikes! As for the West side of the lake..........umm........you mean you're a Bazetta person???? People outside of Bazetta and Cortland really don't get that, but it was a big deal when i was growing up. Can you believe a girl from Lakeshore drive had the audacity of telling me, a Shepard's Hill resident, that i was poor when i was in 6th grade????? Just because my mom bought my clothes at ames and hills!!! It's funny looking back now. My parents now live in a house double the size of our stanjim home in Cortland. In fact, they are Bazetta East siders now........Timber Creek Heights! They were so scared that they were going to live by snobs, but everyone is actually very nice. You might be surprised to know that 4 homes have just sold in their development, all but one had been on the market well over a year. In fact, one of them just sold for $340,000, that's a good sign to me.

I know you say you want to move, but i think this area is such a great place to raise kids. I really don't want to move and i feel very loyal to this area because i know so much about the history. Thankfully, my parents are very interested in history and i grew up hearing stories about the rich history of the Mahoning Valley. I love learning about the way things used to be. I'm very interested in the Connecticut Western Reserve, the Packard family, the history of the mills, etc. When i was growing up my dad took us to the Bulter in Y-town, the Arms museum, and the John Stark Edwards house in Warren. I've even gone to those places as an adult and it's more interesting to me now. I also enjoyed the museum of Labor and Industry in Y-town and i really want to see the whole area turn around...........i know it probably won't, but i'm a dreamer.

BTW, your house sounds beautiful, i'm a sucker for that stuff! If you put so much money in that place why move? I mean, it's not like you live in a horrible area, your kids could benefit from growing up here, just like you did. Could you teach construction or a trade at TCTC???? I just hate to see more people move away.

Alright, i know this has gone way off topic, but i think it's always nice to read about how others grew up and maybe you can better understand their point of view.

Boardmanite, your story is quite interesting as well.

I'm still not for letting people continue to break they law. I guess that's because i feel it's wrong, and that's the way i was raised. You don't lie, you don't cheat, you tell the truth, and if you start something you should finish it. This applied to me if i went out for a team or was involved in some activity. Even if i didn't like it i had to finish, because: a) i gave someone my word and b) my parents probably had already paid for it.

[trixie1]

I didn't really read all the posts regarding illegal immigrants. However, how do you think the American Indian felt about the illegal immigrants?? People discuss so much about what has happened to America since the immigrants came, but they forget that most of us have ancestors who were immigrants at one time-illegal or not. Back in the 70s the USA was thought of as a melting pot. Now in the twenty first century, we are more worried about what jobs or healthcare immigrants are taking.
Love your neighbor.

[Stephan_K]

Quote of the century......."The American Indians found out what happens when you don't control immigration"

Looks like no one is paying attention to that aged old history lesson in this day and age either!