Has illegal immigration hurt Ohio? (Boardman, Painesville: neighborhood, contractors, high income)

[Stephan_K]

Originally Posted by OhioNative

The bottom line is the fact that we are all going to have to get used to the demographic changes in this country - it is not going to change, regardless of what the vast majority of people want. The government has decided that it wants this to happen, both parties. On the one hand, the Democrats like the idea of a third world underclass that they can control as the ruling elite on our way to a socialist society. On the other hand, the Republicans need to provide the cheap labor to the big corporations as they try to move us towards a fascist style government/corporate ruling partnership. In the meantime, the media feed us with poll after poll stating that "the majority of people support comprehensive immigration reform with a path to citizenship" (they all use the same phrase). Either way, this country as we knew it is in the dust bin of history.

Aint that the truth !!!! I guess it doesn't matter how we get there, the fact that matters is that we are on our way there.........

[Alaskapat528]

Originally Posted by boardmanite

The reason I "can't understand that" is because I haven't seen it for myself. I don't know if you read all the posts in this thread, but I mentioned before that I volunteered a lot of time a couple years ago to help quite a few immigrants in Pennsylvania and Ohio. The majority were illegal, but we still did a lot to help them out at first. If I had seen abuses of the system, I would have been outraged. But I didn't see anything like that. All the people we came in contact with were extremely hard-working, law-abiding (well, except for being illegal ) citizens who were in no way a drain on the local or national economy. Like I said before, I know that abuses do happen, even though I've never seen it. But at least to me, it still seems like the majority aren't a drain on us. Plus, I've been to South America and seen with my own eyes entire villages and neighborhoods built by money that illegals sent back. And I've met many former illegals who went back home to continue their lives. Not that they have bettered themselves economically, their children have more opportunities and are less likely to have to resort to sneaking into a foreign country to find decent work.

One more thing I'll add: When I worked at a tax preparation company for a couple tax seasons, I saw so many people with "their hands out" as you say. Hundreds of them in fact. I was shocked by how many people knew exactly how to work the system. There are so many Americans who have being poor and getting the biggest check from the government possible down to a science. Shame on them I say. I'd much rather have my tax money go to a hard-working immigrant family that needs medical care at an emergency room than it go to an American family that has carefully calculated how to work as little as possible and still get tons of money from the government.

Actually, I'm wondering if you wouldn't be much happier living in Mexico OR perhaps you could house 20 illegals in your home.

[OhioNative]

Originally Posted by boardmanite

All the people we came in contact with were extremely hard-working, law-abiding (well, except for being illegal ) citizens who were in no way a drain on the local or national economy. Like I said before, I know that abuses do happen, even though I've never seen it. But at least to me, it still seems like the majority aren't a drain on us. Plus, I've been to South America and seen with my own eyes entire villages and neighborhoods built by money that illegals sent back. And I've met many former illegals who went back home to continue their lives. Not that they have bettered themselves economically, their children have more opportunities and are less likely to have to resort to sneaking into a foreign country to find decent work.

I think that most people can understand why immigrants sneak into the country for a better life. Personally, I have no problem with people coming here to work, as long as they follow the rules. Here's my solution - I think that there should be a system whereby individuals are matched with an employer who registers them as having a job. The worker should be required to check in with the INS (or ICE as it is now called) every 6 months to verify that they are still employed and to make sure they haven't broken the law. If they get anything more than a speeding ticket, they are out of here. While they are here, they are not to receive any public services other than emergency health care. And if they have kids while they are here, the kids are not citizens. After the end of their guest worker term (maybe 18- 24 months) they go back home or re-apply. If companies don't conform to the program, then they are heavily fined. If the workers violate the terms, then they are deported with no opportunity to come back. This type of guest worker program, to me, seems to be a common sense approach that would allow for employers to have entry level help and to allow workers to make an honest living out of the shadows. Obviously, nothing like this will ever happen.

[wehotex]

Originally Posted by boardmanite

One of the reasons I don't buy into anti-immigration rhetoric is because of history. Millions of poor immigrants came to the US, fleeing terrible situations, like the Irish Potato famine. The Irish were hated and discriminated against, and there was definitely lots of anti-immigration sentiment in the US at that time. However, I don't think anyone could look back today and say that letting millions of poor Irish (or Italians or Poles) into our country proved disastrous for us.

there was not quite the system of social welfare then as there is now. ever since the new deal & the great society, the poor in this country can apply for a myriad of programs provided by the taxpayers as can large corporations. the immigrants of yesteryear entered at a period of fast growth in our country, not an apparent decline as is visible today. you can't REALLY compare this group of immigrants with those of that time period, can you?

[Alaskapat528]

Originally Posted by SeabeeBolt

I like that idea, good one , I agree with you.

My family came to this country back in 1757 as far as can trace them, and they fought in every war since to protect it. If the immigrants come and want to stay here, then join our armed forces and fight, and learn the English language like our forefathers did. And most of all "DON'T TRY CHANGING OUR NATIONAL ANTHEM". It was written in English, you sing it in english.

I agree with you 100%. They need to stop trying to put their flag up and take down our American flag. Come here legally, learn to speak English or get the he** out.

[boardmanite]

Originally Posted by Alaskapat528

Actually, I'm wondering if you wouldn't be much happier living in Mexico OR perhaps you could house 20 illegals in your home.

To tell you the truth, I probably will move to Mexico after my year in Korea is finished! Well, maybe Costa Rica...

[boardmanite]

Originally Posted by OhioNative

I think that most people can understand why immigrants sneak into the country for a better life. Personally, I have no problem with people coming here to work, as long as they follow the rules. Here's my solution - I think that there should be a system whereby individuals are matched with an employer who registers them as having a job. The worker should be required to check in with the INS (or ICE as it is now called) every 6 months to verify that they are still employed and to make sure they haven't broken the law. If they get anything more than a speeding ticket, they are out of here. While they are here, they are not to receive any public services other than emergency health care. And if they have kids while they are here, the kids are not citizens. After the end of their guest worker term (maybe 18- 24 months) they go back home or re-apply. If companies don't conform to the program, then they are heavily fined. If the workers violate the terms, then they are deported with no opportunity to come back. This type of guest worker program, to me, seems to be a common sense approach that would allow for employers to have entry level help and to allow workers to make an honest living out of the shadows. Obviously, nothing like this will ever happen.

That would be a pretty good plan. That's exactly how it works here in Korea. I had to check in with their version of the INS when I first got here last year and they keep tabs on me, but not in a creepy way. If I get out of line in any way, they send my ass back home VERY quickly.

The problem I've seen with illegals is that because of their status, they have little recourse if they run into problems. Since many obviously come here without a formal agreement to work with a particular company, they are left at the mercy of these "gangster"-types that rule the illegal underworld. The immigrants are indebted to them for helping them cross the border and/or secure employment and housing, so they pretty much have to listen to whatever they say. I remember one Mexican girl who was hysterical because her "boss" wanted her to work as a prostitute. It was a REALLY bad situation. With some sort of guest worker program that gave immigrants temporary legal status, these gangster middle-men would be out of the picture and the immigrants would be much better off.

[Alaskapat528]

Originally Posted by boardmanite

Yes, I feel that Ohio could benefit from an influx of Hispanics, or people from anywhere for that matter. I think it would really help revitalize many of our cities. Ohio could use some fresh faces and ideas.

I've never had any bad experiences with illegal immigrants either. Actually I've had a lot of interesting ones. Since my major in college was Spanish, I got to work with quite a few "illegals" from several different countries. They were all genuinely nice, hard working people, and they appreciated the help we gave them and most of all just being friendly to them. They sure weren't getting any handouts from the government either. They would tell us their stories of crossing the border, and some of them were downright scary! I never thought of them as "criminals" or even "illegals". They're people. That's all.

Check this out and let's see what you think:

Illegal Aliens Cause Massive Costs for the U.S.
12-4-7

1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens each year. FAIR: : Immigration and Welfare
2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens. Center for Immigration Studies
3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal aliens. Center for Immigration Studies
4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school education for children here illegally and they cannot speak a word of English! http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../01/ldt.0.html
5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies. CNN.com - Transcripts
6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens. CNN.com - Transcripts
7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal aliens. CNN.com - Transcripts
8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for Welfare and Social Services by the American taxpayers. http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html
9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are caused by the illegal aliens. CNN.com - Transcripts
10. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that's two-and-a-half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular, their children are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the US. CNN.com - Transcripts
11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal aliens that crossed our Southern Border also, as many as 19,500 illegal aliens from Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine, meth, heroin and marijuana, crossed into the U. S from the Southern border. Homeland Security Report. http://tinyurl.com/t9sht
12. The National Policy Institute, "estimated that the total cost of mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period." http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.o...eportation.pdf
13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back to their countries of origin. Wooldridge - How Much Further Into This Nightmare?
14. "The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration: Nearly One Million Sex Crimes Committed by Illegal Immigrants In The United States". http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml
Total cost is a whooping... $338.3 BILLION A YEAR!!!

[1watertiger]

alaska, good info ! too bad hard working and honest LEGAL americans are not afforded the same opportunities. STOP the hand-outs and "entitlements" for all. it just allows for more lazy, able-bodied people to sit around and watch opra winfrey. (my opinion)

[Alaskapat528]

Hmmm, I'm waiting on a reply from Boardman.....I doubt that will wake him up though.