Dayton+Cincinnati=Good? (Columbus, Cleveland, Springfield: crime, credit, neighborhoods)

[Cincy-Rise]

Originally Posted by the_pines

I don't understand how this would be a good thing or change anything for that matter. Dayton is sixty miles away from Cincinnati. Its just about as close to Columbus as it is to Cincinnati. If things allow, Dayton and Columbus would surely start growing nearer to each other. Then what? Initially without hearing any good reasons I don't like the idea one bit. Dayton was always its own city. There might be one percent of people who drive to Cincinnati for work. Dayton has as much history as Columbus even though its much smaller. This doesn't seem realistic in anyway. Dayton is a full fledged city, and always has been. Its not suburb or town.

Is the reasoning to stimulate growth? I understand very well Ohio cities have been decaying for a long time, and Dayton is definitely one of those. I still haven't lost hope. Shrinking isn't necessarily a death sentence. The area was bound to see a lot of shrinking as newer areas and new infrastructure sprung up. I'm very peculiar about the city. Also I don't know that Daytonians and Cincinnatian's are all that similar. Dayton has always had liberal undertones, and its traditionally a very moderate city. Cincinnati needs to resolve some ethnic problems and prove to itself it can be a better city overall before thinking about another city.

And quite frankly, Cincinnati has never had the influence or power to absorb Dayton. Maybe a small town like Middletown, but theres no way Cincinnati has never had any great amount of influence on Daytonian's. Most Daytonian's avoid Cincinnati. Or periodically go there for the Fourth of July fireworks show, or Kings Island, or a sports game. That's about it. Cincinnati is very alien to some Daytonian's.

The_Pines, you are off on so many stats and figures it's comical.

I encourage you to go back and look at some of the things you said and look up the data for yourself. This is the only way you will remember it.

[Cincy-Rise]

Cle440, please don't start another pissing match. We've already covered all of this (yes, all 20-30 pages) in the "Cincinnati to pass Cleveland's MSA by 200?" thread ... whatever it was ...

This thread is about the combonation of Cincy's MSA and Dayton's.

[hillside]

Originally Posted by the_pines

I don't understand how this would be a good thing or change anything for that matter. Dayton is sixty miles away from Cincinnati. Its just about as close to Columbus as it is to Cincinnati. If things allow, Dayton and Columbus would surely start growing nearer to each other. Then what? Initially without hearing any good reasons I don't like the idea one bit. Dayton was always its own city. There might be one percent of people who drive to Cincinnati for work. Dayton has as much history as Columbus even though its much smaller. This doesn't seem realistic in anyway. Dayton is a full fledged city, and always has been. Its not suburb or town.

Is the reasoning to stimulate growth? I understand very well Ohio cities have been decaying for a long time, and Dayton is definitely one of those. I still haven't lost hope. Shrinking isn't necessarily a death sentence. The area was bound to see a lot of shrinking as newer areas and new infrastructure sprung up. I'm very peculiar about the city. Also I don't know that Daytonians and Cincinnatian's are all that similar. Dayton has always had liberal undertones, and its traditionally a very moderate city. Cincinnati needs to resolve some ethnic problems and prove to itself it can be a better city overall before thinking about another city.

And quite frankly, Cincinnati has never had the influence or power to absorb Dayton. Maybe a small town like Middletown, but theres no way Cincinnati has never had any great amount of influence on Daytonian's. Most Daytonian's avoid Cincinnati. Or periodically go there for the Fourth of July fireworks show, or Kings Island, or a sports game. That's about it. Cincinnati is very alien to some Daytonian's.

it'll be awhile before dayton hits columbus...dayton is its own self-contained city, but as far as families/migration, it is very similar. after living in columbus for a while, i have realized daytonians and cincinnatians aren't as far apart as they seem. still, your point is valid - many daytonians don't like cincinnati for a number of reasons. what the merger changes is the media market, the allure of relocation/investment in regional offices in the area, and a bigger pool for funding a regional transportation system. imo that's a big deal.

[CTownNative]

They should just make Cleveland,Cincy,and Columbus one big metro area.What do you think?

[Traveler87]

Originally Posted by Cincy-Rise

The_Pines, you are off on so many stats and figures it's comical.

I encourage you to go back and look at some of the things you said and look up the data for yourself. This is the only way you will remember it.

At least he is not bashing the cities left and right. He just doesn't know all what is happening, and there is a lot. He might be one of those who refuse to see it.

[Cincy-Rise]

Originally Posted by Traveler87

At least he is not bashing the cities left and right.

Assuming you are claiming I have ... I do not and will not bash other cities on here or anywhere else, unless it is clearly in jest.

[Cincy-Rise]

There might be one percent of people who drive to Cincinnati for work.

[BelieveInCleve]

Originally Posted by Cincy-Rise

Cle440, please don't start another pissing match. We've already covered all of this (yes, all 20-30 pages) in the "Cincinnati to pass Cleveland's MSA by 200?" thread ... whatever it was ...

This thread is about the combonation of Cincy's MSA and Dayton's.

Im not going to, Im just merely stating facts. Also, if you remember there were many other people arguing in there besides me.

Either way I stated my point on this. Dayton and Cincinnati dont seem connected to me at all. Like the other poster said, they are 60 miles apart and in those 60 miles its not like its urban area after urban area, its very low density suburbs. Cincinnati and Dayton are two entirely different cities and I really didnt notice many similarities between the two. Its not really going to help Dayton at all either. Just because its called Cincinnati/Dayton now thats just on paper, its not going to help anything in Dayton in reality. Also, there is no Cincinnati growth around Dayton. There is no way that anybody is going to drive an hour from a Dayton suburb to Cincinnati for work everyday, and vice versa to Dayton. Besides the suburbs they arent growing together at all.

[SmartGXL]

Originally Posted by Cle440

Im not going to, Im just merely stating facts. Also, if you remember there were many other people arguing in there besides me.

Either way I stated my point on this. Dayton and Cincinnati dont seem connected to me at all. Like the other poster said, they are 60 miles apart and in those 60 miles its not like its urban area after urban area, its very low density suburbs. Cincinnati and Dayton are two entirely different cities and I really didnt notice many similarities between the two. Its not really going to help Dayton at all either. Just because its called Cincinnati/Dayton now thats just on paper, its not going to help anything in Dayton in reality. Also, there is no Cincinnati growth around Dayton. There is no way that anybody is going to drive an hour from a Dayton suburb to Cincinnati for work everyday, and vice versa to Dayton. Besides the suburbs they arent growing together at all.

Very true.

Another thing to consider, is that when we look at most of the "dual-city MSA's", such as Dallas-Ft Worth, or the Twin Cities, the dual cities in those cases are actually VERY close to each other. Examples:

DFW: Dallas is in dallas County, and Ft Worth is in the next county over to the west. In between the two cities is the huge, shared, DFW airport, and several large suburbs. One can easily drive from downtown Dallas to downtown Ft Worth in about 25 minutes, in good traffic.

Twin Cities: Minneapolis and St Paul are literally right accross the river from each other, kind of like how Cinci and Covington are right accross the river from each other. Different cities, different counties, unique downtowns, but literally right accross the river from each other.

Cincinnati and Dayton's downtowns are at least 50 miles apart from each other. And it is a LONG boring commute down I-75, through what feels like miles of cornfields, to go back and forth.

Personnally, I always felt that Dayton and Cinci were very different cities, mainly based on topography. Cinci is built on large hills and has very unique architecture from the rest of Ohio, and in some parts of the city, has a look and feel like you were in someplace like Brooklyn, as opposed to being in the midwest, or the gateway to the South. whereas Dayton is mostly flat, and has, in my opinion, a more vanilla architectural style.

Actually, I think that Dayton and Columbus were more alike each other, than Dayton/Cinci were. The two towns are built on mostly flat areas and have some similar suburban traits as well. I think the rationale behind this merger is based on two things:

1. Dayton is closer to Cinci than Columbus, and
2. Dayton and Cinci have overlapping TV and radio markets (I remember growing up, and being able to watch either Dayton's or Cinci's TV channels, take your pick).

[Just as a side note, I have heard that people living in Wilmington, OH, get radio and TV stations from ALL THREE cities, dayton, cinci and columbus.]

[BelieveInCleve]

Very True also.

I think its a sure thing now that by 2010 they are merging Cincinnati and Dayton...at least the metro areas on paper. I think its just due to that the suburbs are meeting now, its getting harder to distinguish if the suburb is Dayton or Cincinnatis. Like I was saying though, personally I think its kind of ridiculous. To me Cincinnati/Dayton would be like Cleveland/Youngstown. Even though there 60 or so miles apart, they have a thin line of suburbs connecting them so we'll just put them in the same metro area. Its not even like on the East Coast where they have dense city after suburb after city connecting places like NYC/Newark or really the whole East Coast. Either way, its happening though and I dont see it helping out Dayton too much, or Cincinnati. Its this way today, its gonna be this way tomorrow.