Ohio cities homicide rates (Cleveland, Toledo: credit, buying, movies)

[WeSoHood]

Originally Posted by sleepy eyes 1979

Born in rasied in Cleveland. Chicago has a gang culture that goes back generations. Cleveland has no real gang culture at all. Alot less retaliations if you can't blame someone. If we had a real gang culture it would really be dangerous to go outside at all. SCt

By definition, Cleveland has more gangs than majority of citiesi n the US. Based on statistics, Cleveland is more dangerous than Chicago. In terms of Homicides, Cleveland is one of the worst in the nation. Cleveland had half as many murders as Chicago, yet Chicago has almost 2 million more people...

Originally Posted by sleepy eyes 1979

You will never see Cleveland on an episode of Gangland. Not enough of that going on. Don't get me wrong you got some young cats claiming dis and dat but it is all watered down. Most of the time murder is all bout dat all might dollar or just people being ignorant. You never know when you going to get caught up. Like my mamma use to tell me.Boy don't let dem street lights hit you.

Gangland is a joke TV show. They had an episode based in Anchorage, Alaska. Anchorage had 21 murders last year... that's not "can't go outside" type crime like you are implying if there is a gang culture. Also, Youngstown with 75,000 people had more murders then Anchorage.. yet it doesn't have a "gang" culture.

Also, Ohio supposedly has the 3rd most gangs in the nation behind Illinois and California.

But regardless of all that. Look at the most dangerous cities in the US: Cleveland, Baltimore, Detroit, St. Louis, Washington DC, etc.

They aren't Chicago, NYC, or LA in terms of gangs, but FAR FAR more dangerous.

[BelieveInCleve]

To touch on what sleepyeyes and wesohood are talking about,

Cleveland/Greater Cleveland definitely has a gang culture now, but of course it isn't as organized or as serious as Chicago or LA. Cleveland, EC, Euclid, Lorain, Elyria, Akron, and Canton among many others have had gangs for a long time now, especially Cleveland/EC and Lorain. There's a map I saw that showed major cities with known gangs and what years they got there (became a problem) ranging from 1950s and earlier up to 1990s (when the map was published), Cleveland was one of the 5 or so cities that showed 1950s or earlier along with Chicago, NYC and several others. Cleveland was also ranked as the 5th highest gang presence in the country some years back (I'll try to find that link).

wesohood is correct but made several minor mistakes in the stats. Chicago has a population of 2.836 million and had around 445 murders in 2007, Cleveland has a population of 438k and had 135 murders that same year. Chicagos rate was 15.7/per 100k, Clevelands was 30.8/per 100k (about twice as high). It's true that the majority of the most dangerous cities in America are not nationally known for (or don't have) a gang culture.

[sleepy eyes 1979]

If you live in Cleveland most people will tell you that there is not a real Gang culture. I'm not talking about some young cats running around calling themselves the goonies, next thing you know you will never here about them ever again. If you look at the cities that have the most crime and murders it is always a city that has a serious gang problem. Norfolk Virginia have more of a gang problem than Cleveland I know I lived there for five years when I was in the navy. When I got locked up down there going through processing they asked me if I had any enemies because of the gang problems. I gaurantee you that the majority of the murders that happen in cleveland are not gang related. Don't care what the numbers say if you from Cleveland you know this to be true. Chicago La Detroit Philly NY little rock just to name a few have a real gang culture. There is not one gang that you could at least reconize in the last 30 years. Chicago's specific gangs has been around since the sixtys. I never had a problem walking past the projects and had to worry about snipers on rootops. Cleveland just hood. Some of da realist cats out here a tell you dat.

[sleepy eyes 1979]

You have to read in between the lines. It is a way to add years to a person sentence. The few gangs that are in cleveland are basically in one side of town. waste 5, 7alls, hough heights. What it is really about is protecting drug territory. 10-5 and st. clair is notorius for heorin. St. clair in gerneral is known for all kinds of drugs. Hough are is notorius for wet.(pcp). If you not from dat are or from those hoods you can not slang nothin. That is just a small part of cleveland. We got clicks. It is about where you grew up with and who you roll wit. when you google something on Cleveland gands it mention two that I just mentioned. East Cleveland is nothing but a ghost town. If it was dat serious cats a be getting blown away everyday because everytime you turn around you in some one else turk because it is so small. I lived on woodworth off Hayden and some cats rolled up on me and me and my dawgs and said at no servin round here cause he did not know me and I am not from dat hood. He aint ask me what set I claim. If you not from cleveland don't comment cause any real cat or O.G. tell you it's all bout money up here. If I got arrested with five dudes and I told dem I was part of a gang called cleveland raiders they would belive it and next thing you know it would be listed as a gang. We represent blocks and hoods up here. Dat Gang spit for da weak minded. If anybody ever come up here for any reason just ask around about if they think cleveland got a gang problem from those who be deep in da streets.

[sleepy eyes 1979]

By the way the gangland episode on Alaska was pretty weak. They actually said that it is not a big deal to snitch. would not mind smokin some of dat bud doe.

[sleepy eyes 1979]

I met some cats from chicago at the blood bank on the west side and they agreed that cleveland is bad but you can basically go anywhere you want to. It is how you carry yourself. If you look and walk like a lame somebody gone try you. You said you can not just go anywhere in Chicago like it's all good. Makes sense to me. Cleveland Hard but when you have city with real organized gang it is just a different atmosphere. Met another cat from L.A who called himself blue devil. Said Cleveland nothing like L.A. because of the gang culture. just a fact. also got a cousin who live in stockton california whos population is small but has a crime problem because of gangs. She visits all the time and tells me it is different because of how serious dat gang shi#t is.

[sleepy eyes 1979]

Cleveland is densly populated you could walk from one main strip to another in 2 or 3 minutes depending on what side of town you on. If there was really a problem cats would not be able to go no damn where. especially in East Cleveland. Everybody a be stuck on da porch.

[WeSoHood]

Originally Posted by sleepy eyes 1979

I met some cats from chicago at the blood bank on the west side and they agreed that cleveland is bad but you can basically go anywhere you want to. It is how you carry yourself. If you look and walk like a lame somebody gone try you. You said you can not just go anywhere in Chicago like it's all good. Makes sense to me. Cleveland Hard but when you have city with real organized gang it is just a different atmosphere. Met another cat from L.A who called himself blue devil. Said Cleveland nothing like L.A. because of the gang culture. just a fact. also got a cousin who live in stockton california whos population is small but has a crime problem because of gangs. She visits all the time and tells me it is different because of how serious dat gang shi#t is.

But at the same time, how do you explain Cleveland being more dangerous than both cities listed? LA actually has a relatively low homicide rate in comparison to Cleveland. Yeah, gangs change dynamics of the city... but in Cleveland ANYONE is a target for violence. And you can't walk ANYWHERE in Cleveland at any point and expect to be fine. There are many areas where you'd be on thin ice if you didn't get robbed or shot. Hell, 2 years ago there were reported over 7,000 shootings in Cleveland.

The point I am making is this; people say Cleveland doesn't have a gang problem and that other cities you can't walk in areas because of it.. yet Cleveland is still more dangerous. Doesn't that make your points completely invalid?

Now I will say that Chicago just 20 years ago was 10 times worse than it is now. And I agree that Cleveland gangs are more so groups from the same neighborhoods, etc. But most shootings and crimes happening now are with kids from 12 years - 18 years old carrying guns thinking they are in a gang. They are much more unpredictable and more likely to shoot... which is the reason why Cleveland is more dangerous, just like Detroit and St Louis (2 other cities with similar gangs as Cleveland and both equally more dangerous than LA and Chicago)

[lastonestanding]

Originally Posted by sleepy eyes 1979

If you live in Cleveland most people will tell you that there is not a real Gang culture. I'm not talking about some young cats running around calling themselves the goonies, next thing you know you will never here about them ever again. If you look at the cities that have the most crime and murders it is always a city that has a serious gang problem. Norfolk Virginia have more of a gang problem than Cleveland I know I lived there for five years when I was in the navy. When I got locked up down there going through processing they asked me if I had any enemies because of the gang problems. I gaurantee you that the majority of the murders that happen in cleveland are not gang related. Don't care what the numbers say if you from Cleveland you know this to be true. Chicago La Detroit Philly NY little rock just to name a few have a real gang culture. There is not one gang that you could at least reconize in the last 30 years. Chicago's specific gangs has been around since the sixtys. I never had a problem walking past the projects and had to worry about snipers on rootops. Cleveland just hood. Some of da realist cats out here a tell you dat.

Norfolk, Virginia has more of a gang problem than Cleveland???? I truly doubt that, but I cant really speak on that being I never lived in Cleveland, but I lived in both Toledo and Norfolk and Toledo has way more of a gang problem than Norfolk..... I always thought Clevelands gang problem was worse than Toledos.... Norfolk only has a gang problem because of its influence from New York gangs particularly the Nine-trey blood gang. Thats only been a problem the past couple of years and mainly in areas of Norfolk like Park place and Huntersville.....
As far as Detroit, its more of the organized drug clicks that make Detroit dangerous, not too much gangs.... I agree with you on the rest of your post... Especially Chicago. Chicago has a gang culture that goes back to the 1920s.... Chicago is ridiculous.... I've lived in Chicago for a while and I remember my fam telling me to watch out for snipers on the rooftops of apartments over east especially if they aint know who I was and who I was related to.... and matter of fact theres a clip on youtube of a sniper on the roof of the Dearborn Homes off State Street.... I gotta find that clip and post it....

[lastonestanding]

Originally Posted by WeSoHood

But at the same time, how do you explain Cleveland being more dangerous than both cities listed? LA actually has a relatively low homicide rate in comparison to Cleveland. Yeah, gangs change dynamics of the city... but in Cleveland ANYONE is a target for violence. And you can't walk ANYWHERE in Cleveland at any point and expect to be fine. There are many areas where you'd be on thin ice if you didn't get robbed or shot. Hell, 2 years ago there were reported over 7,000 shootings in Cleveland.

The point I am making is this; people say Cleveland doesn't have a gang problem and that other cities you can't walk in areas because of it.. yet Cleveland is still more dangerous. Doesn't that make your points completely invalid?

Now I will say that Chicago just 20 years ago was 10 times worse than it is now. And I agree that Cleveland gangs are more so groups from the same neighborhoods, etc. But most shootings and crimes happening now are with kids from 12 years - 18 years old carrying guns thinking they are in a gang. They are much more unpredictable and more likely to shoot... which is the reason why Cleveland is more dangerous, just like Detroit and St Louis (2 other cities with similar gangs as Cleveland and both equally more dangerous than LA and Chicago)

I was speaking on this with Cle440 a little earlier in this thread. The reason why Chicago and LA are not as dangerous as Cleveland and Detroit per capita is because they're alot larger in population and have better neighborhoods in different parts of town. Everything you mentioned about Cleveland happens in Chicago as well on a regular basis. Chicago was recently on CNN for the numerous amounts of public school children killed this year and last year.... Cleveland and Detroit has suffered more economically than both LA and Chicago, but both cities have a serious gang culture dating back to the 40s and 50s and most of the crime are concentrated in two areas. In LA its South Central and East LA, in Chicago its the Westside and Southside. When you go to Hollywood or West LA, its a huge difference. When you go to the Northside of Chicago its huge difference. Its literally division between the rich and the poor.....