Why doesn't oklahoma city schools have shelters? What a joke. (Tulsa: construction, school districts)

[Globe199]

Here's what I'm guessing happens. Slowly the horror of the tornado will fade. Then it comes time to rebuild a school (or a home or a business), and the question of a shelter comes up. Then somebody sees the price tag. In the case of a school, the taxpayers see the price tag. And they don't like it. So they decide not to pay for it.

the public: "We need shelters for our school children!!"

construction contractor: "OK, the cost will be $X million."

the public: "...umm...well...maybe we don't need it that bad. They can just hide in the hallway, right? OK, Good."

[TX75007]

Originally Posted by bluedog2

Watching the news coverage and wondering how places like schools can be built like crap and without cellars in an area that is so obviously prone to tornados .From debris it looks like the school roof could have ripped off in a common thunderstorm? Not the first time this area has been wiped out.Public officials who built this school should be held responsible.Mind blowing.

Hope our US congress is more sympathetic to the people of Oklahoma than they were to the people in NY and New Jersey in the wake of hurricane Sandy.

I grew up in Oklahoma. Unlike you. And have ridden out a tornado.

An F4/F5 tornado will scrape concrete from the road and asphalt from the street. It will crush in storm cellars. Rip doors off safes.

Looks like three schools took direct hits and most of the kids survived. While most other structures were wiped completely clean. Most of the kids who did not were drowned in a basement. (and people wonder why there are no basements...well, that is why) Looks to me like the schools were the toughest structures in the area and did their job. Sure, they can look into putting in special closets. But even those can get scoured out.

I think Okies know more about building schools for Tornadoes that someone from the Bronx.

[TX75007]

Originally Posted by Globe199

Here's what I'm guessing happens. Slowly the horror of the tornado will fade. Then it comes time to rebuild a school (or a home or a business), and the question of a shelter comes up. Then somebody sees the price tag. In the case of a school, the taxpayers see the price tag. And they don't like it. So they decide not to pay for it.

the public: "We need shelters for our school children!!"

construction contractor: "OK, the cost will be $X million."

the public: "...umm...well...maybe we don't need it that bad. They can just hide in the hallway, right? OK, Good."

Do you know this for a fact or are you on here to insult people?

Are you a serving member of an OK school board? A contractor?

Do you think Okies are stupid?

The schools are built to take direct hits and keep the occupants alive even while the school is destroyed. School design in OK is a big deal.

[Globe199]

Originally Posted by TX75007

Looks like three schools took direct hits and most of the kids survived. While most other structures were wiped completely clean. Most of the kids who did not were drowned in a basement. (and people wonder why there are no basements...well, that is why)

So that's at least the third pop-culture theory I've heard as to why there aren't basements in Oklahoma. (One is that they're sitting on bedrock so it's too expensive. Another is that the frostline doesn't go very deep, so no need to dig a basement.)

I think Okies know more about building schools for Tornadoes that someone from the Bronx.

So if Okies know more about tornado-safe schools, and basements are presumably dangerous, then why did this school have a basement? One minute you're telling us a "good" reason why there aren't basements, next you tell us a bunch of kids died in a flooded school basement. Which is it?

We don't yet know why the school basement was flooded. Also, I haven't heard them say it was an actual basement, just that several children drowned in the "bottom" of the school. Did rainfall collect there? Did a pipe break? What caused the flood?

Do you know this for a fact or are you on here to insult people?

I never said it was a fact, and am not insulting anyone. I think you're being a little sensitive. What I described is pretty common across the country when it comes to spending tax payer dollars. I live in the Twin Cities, where a bridge fell and killed 13 people. We have another freeway bridge that is arguably in worse shape than that one was. Yet they can't seem to find the money to replace it, even though it's apparently an emergency. Tax payers want all kinds of things but don't want to pay for them.

Do you think Okies are stupid?

Did I say that?

The schools are built to take direct hits and keep the occupants alive even while the school is destroyed. School design in OK is a big deal.

See above. I've yet to hear anything to suggest that this school had any special tornado safety provisions. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if it did not. I'm not saying it didn't, but I've been following the story closely, and haven't heard anything like that yet. Evidently they sheltered in a hallway. "Hallway" does not sound like "tornado shelter." Even in tornado alley, I'd imagine that schools get the short end of the construction stick.

[SVTRay]

Originally Posted by Keeper

Please keep this discussion civil and be sensitive to the people of OK who have experienced such a horrible loss. Please report any post that is disrespectful to the citizens of OK. I have zero tolerance for anyone who is insensitive of this situation

Agreed,

There is a time and a place for everything and right now it's time to support our follow Americans during this horrific tradegy.

Originally Posted by TX75007

I grew up in Oklahoma. Unlike you. And have ridden out a tornado.

An F4/F5 tornado will scrape concrete from the road and asphalt from the street. It will crush in storm cellars. Rip doors off safes.


I think Okies know more about building schools for Tornadoes that someone from the Bronx.

An F5 touched down outside Austin Texas and tore up parts of I-35.

[#1soonerfan]

Guys, we really don't need finger wagging from out of staters right now. If the answers are not good enough for you please do not get on your high horse. Teachers are in the hospital right now because they used their bodies as shields for students. Arguing about basements right now is incredibly inappropriate.

[Globe199]

Originally Posted by #1soonerfan

Guys, we really don't need finger wagging from out of staters right now. If the answers are not good enough for you please do not get on your high horse. Teachers are in the hospital right now because they used their bodies as shields for students. Arguing about basements right now is incredibly inappropriate.

I'd argue that now IS the time to be discussing tornado safety measures -- while this tragedy is still fresh in everyone's mind. Let's learn what went wrong and maybe what we can do differently next time to protect ourselves.

According to this page, the students in that hallway may have died because the roof collapsed and a water pipe broke. I don't know if this is accurate.

Are Extreme Tornadoes Becoming More Frequent? | FOX8.com

What especially spooks me is how similar the path of this tornado was to the 3 May 1999 tornado:

http://blogs.smithsonianmag.com/smar...comparison.png

[artsy11]

Oops, I meant to write my response for both homes AND schools. Businesses as well.

[randomparent]

My family was front and center for the Xenia tornado of 1974, an F-5, and I will never, ever forget the devastation. Everything...EVERYTHING...was literally swept away with the wind. My thoughts are with all of you in OKC, and a donation to my preferred aid agency is on its way.

[jyost]

The main reason most of the schools and buildings in Oklahoma do not have basements and storm cellars is that the state sits on an aquifer. This causes issues with mold on a regular basis as well as leaking. Just to give you some of my qualifications, I am a licensed insurance agent and adjuster who owns his own agency in the city of Oklahoma City. I have lived here most of my life. My father is a contractor, my mother works in the school system. I am very educated as to the situation. The schools are built to withstand a traditional tornado. This tornado was an f5 dependent on the time. It was only moving 10-20 mph. This is very slow for a tornado and since it was that powerful it was like a meat grinder going over the land. No building will effectively withstand that. The wind speeds were 200+ mph, it was 1.3 miles wide and traveled for 17 miles. You need to understand if you are not from here the only thing you do is let one of these things come in and take cover. It is like an artillery attack, I say that as a veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom and a prior member of the Oklahoma Army National Guard. You just have to hope and pray you, your family, and your property come out ok. The only answers are preparation, both a plan in case a tornado happens, and proper insurance to put you back where you belong.