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The "spanish" you speak of is called culture, ESMOU. Something OKC doesn't have. Granted there are places in Houston that aren't nice...just like ANY big city. But I'm sorry, there's no way OKC with minimal services for a city of 1 million people will ever be able to offer what Houston (or many other cities have) with > 5 million people. In my opinion, OKC is one of the if not the worst city of 1 million or less residents in the country for those of us who have been out in the world and have actually seen what real cities are and should be able to offer there residents. There is a reason OKC is so cheap...you pay for what you get.
Eh, yeah, I lived in Denver and moved here from Colorado Springs...guess Ive never been in "real citites".
I think Portland is the standard that all of the cities are trying to match. They have streetcars and the most bike riders per capita. They have the largest urban park in a city too. They have revamped their river parks too.
You forgot to mention that Portland has free WIFI all over the city too.
I lived in OKC for nearly 3 years after a move from California and was never SO glad to leave somewhere in my life. Don't get me wrong...the people on the whole are very nice. BUT there is very very little to keep a young couple interested and engaged in the community.
I know we lock horns on posting messages, but my wife and I always found something to do whenever we had time. But then again, we probably had different demands than you. We loved Downtown in December. We loved Blazers hockey. We loved being able to drive a couple of miles to SuperTarget or the lake and just take in the evening.
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Originally Posted by irishlover
We got to the point where we looked at each other on Friday nights and said "well, should we do?... the SAME thing again for the millionth time?" Dinner at cheevers or mama BullBoxer31 or irmas...UGHH so sick of those places after a hundred times. We are avid outdoors people and there is NOTHING of interest in OKC. Yeah yeah lake hefner has some "nice" trails...I guess compared to walking on hot coals....the "nearby" wichita "mountains" are nothing more than bumps on an otherwise featureless boring plain...lake thunderbird is a waste pit basically. There is just NOTHING to do if you don't have kids and don't like to go out to eat every night and get fat. Also, one of my biggest peves with OKC is the lack of NICE grocery stores...or not even the plural...we would have loved just ONE. Homeland..aka Homelessland...buy 4 less...albertsons all insult the name of good grocers around the country.
You have to remember you were living in a city that is the 46th largest market in the country. At this point and time, the market can only offer so much on dining. If we had 3 million + people in OKC, I'm sure your expectations would have been met.
As far as the Wichitas and other natural landscapes, this is where people simply differ. I find the Wichitas a geological, mystical historic fact. It's 800 million years of history, and I love it. Oklahoma City sits on the geographical edge of the Rocky Mountain rain shadow, and while most people don't take an interest, I always found it fascinating that OKC was the only city to sit on the transition zone from rolling tree covered terrain to open prairie which the terrain begins its gradual ascent to the Rockies.
My wife and I didn't have children when we lived in OKC, and were always entertained. But then again, we were from there and had our social circles well established - non-Christian or Christian.
As far as supermarkets, I do agree with you. And there IS a reason why it is that way in OKC, but not because OKC is cheap. It is an end result of one bad circumstance after another, and it is not OKC's fault. But, I CAN tell you, that is going to change very soon because Crest is about to step up to the plate in the realm of quality supermakets. Crapland I hope will die, and SuperTarget can only offer so much. And, the wineries and grocers associations have been working with the legislature to allow supermarkets to sell wine. Should that change, it would mean a larger profit margin for OKC's supermarkets and thus better supermarkets.
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Originally Posted by irishlover
We are settled in Houston now and couldn't be happier...it is hot but we LOVE being back in a city that offers nice services...love HEB grocery stores...huge selection of non-chain restaurants, museums..beaches nearby...hill country nearby...austin/san antonio all close. Oh, and being able to have 25 year old friends that don't have 3 kids by the time they are 25 is nice too!
You can't fault people for having children. It is the order of nature, regardless of age. But right now, I am in Houston, and I am not a Houston fan by any means. There are a lot of exciting things to do... yes... but I am not a recipient. I have goals for OKC and I plan to see them through. I am glad you enjoy Houston but I have a few issues with Houston and Texas. Houston is a top notch example of urban srawl. From Loop 610 to Sawdust Rd. in The Woodlands, there is no character at all. Just random sprawl.
Texas tax rates were the first lesson for me in not to rely on bragging rights concerning better taxes compared between both states. Texas has out-of-control property taxes, higher vehicle sales taxes, deregulated utilities that can ***** you out of a $1,000 utility bill and crappy drivers.
It sounds like you simply prefer a coastal state, and that is okay. But I am not a Texan, I don't buy into the Texas pride thing, and I am not like thousands of Texans that hang a damn star on every single house. And I am f**king sick and tired of being told I should like Texas. I have a purpose in life and it is not to be a Texan.
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Originally Posted by irishlover
In short, the only redeeming quality about OKC is its people...they are very nice on the whole. BUT, all of the MAPS projects, efforts by City leaders and the very few forward thinking young people in the city are synonymous to putting makeup on an ugly girl....what your left with underneath is still an ugly girl. If there is any standard to which OKC is judged it will be what other cities wish not to become.
OKC before MAPS was bad. I mean... it was bad. So the fact that community leaders are coming together to rebuild OKC deserves credit. OKC is a work in progress and genuine change takes time. If OKC leaders just didn't care, and the community just didn't care, I'd have different feelings. We are better than yesterday, but we can... and will... be a better city. I will remind you that many cities in the 1990s sent delegates to OKC to learn about how MAPS became a successful municipal program. Oklahoma City didn't become the way you witnessed during your short tenure, it is pulling itself out of the hole. It gets better every year.
You are more than welcome to revisit OKC anytime when Core 2 Shore and MAPS 3 begins to take shape. If only you could envision OKC the way I do, I bet you'd feel different..
OKC in 20 years will be nothing but a little Mexico City. All you have to do is drive through the area of SW 29th and see how fast it is spreading north.
I know we lock horns on posting messages, but my wife and I always found something to do whenever we had time.
Different strokes for different folks. There are plenty of people who love Oklahoma and plenty more who love Texas. OKC was too sleepy of a town for us, but some folks prefer that. Houston and Texas in general fits what we are looking for in a city/state right now, much bigger, more services, nonstop flights to Europe to see family, the coast, access to Austin and the hill country etc.
My opinion of OKC is somewhat soured by the fact that the house I own on the edge of Crown Heights was burglarized TWICE while I was out of the country in 2008...the OKCPD did absolutely nothing to investigate at all. I know they have "bigger" fish to fry but I was very jaded by the whole experience and lost several thousand dollars in personal possessions during both events. My home insurance went sky high. My property taxes and insurance (not to mention state income tax to OK) easily outpace a similar valued home in Houston/Texas. I cringe my teeth knowing I have to pay property taxes to Oklahoma County again on December 12th. Hopefully the house will sell next year.
Another factor was that I worked for one of the best companies in OKC/US and, even though i LOVED my job and the company nearly all the young people I was surrounded by (average age is 30) just viewed OKC as a stopping point to earn some money at a good company until they can actually get where the WANT to be and raise a family. Most (but not all) hated OK and OKC and that did rub off on me.
Again, these are just personal experiences and in no way should be construed to be a "majority" opinion of the city. But, I feel my experience should be shared because I do own a home in the city, I graduated from a 4 year Oklahoma university, lived in downtown OKC when I was young and lived there for several years so I think I have some fairly informed opinions and information for people of similar background looking to move to OKC.
Different strokes for different folks. There are plenty of people who love Oklahoma and plenty more who love Texas. OKC was too sleepy of a town for us, but some folks prefer that. Houston and Texas in general fits what we are looking for in a city/state right now, much bigger, more services, nonstop flights to Europe to see family, the coast, access to Austin and the hill country etc.
My opinion of OKC is somewhat soured by the fact that the house I own on the edge of Crown Heights was burglarized TWICE while I was out of the country in 2008...the OKCPD did absolutely nothing to investigate at all. I know they have "bigger" fish to fry but I was very jaded by the whole experience and lost several thousand dollars in personal possessions during both events. My home insurance went sky high. My property taxes and insurance (not to mention state income tax to OK) easily outpace a similar valued home in Houston/Texas. I cringe my teeth knowing I have to pay property taxes to Oklahoma County again on December 12th. Hopefully the house will sell next year.
Another factor was that I worked for one of the best companies in OKC/US and, even though i LOVED my job and the company nearly all the young people I was surrounded by (average age is 30) just viewed OKC as a stopping point to earn some money at a good company until they can actually get where the WANT to be and raise a family. Most (but not all) hated OK and OKC and that did rub off on me.
Again, these are just personal experiences and in no way should be construed to be a "majority" opinion of the city. But, I feel my experience should be shared because I do own a home in the city, I graduated from a 4 year Oklahoma university, lived in downtown OKC when I was young and lived there for several years so I think I have some fairly informed opinions and information for people of similar background looking to move to OKC.
I can understand and respect that. I can't blame you either. I'd be equally pissed. I also agree that despite MAPS and the equaled private investment, downtown OKC is still sleepy by current American standards, but this is changing.
I guess my enthusiasm in OKC is fueled by the opportunity that is there to change the city for the better. I want to be one of those people to make that happen. There is so much being planned for OKC every year that within the next 3-5 years people are going to begin to see a serious transformation, and so much opportunity for someone like me.
What does puzzle me is the property taxes. I guess with your home insurance skyrocketing after the burglaries that closed the gap, but property taxes on my house in Conroe is about $3,600 on our home which is valued at $104,000. I checked on a house in far NW Oklahoma City with a similar value. Its property taxes were roughly $850. It's too bad more people our age don't share the same type of enthusiasm for OKC, but that is just the reality of things.
I feel OKC's potential is still mostly untapped, and it is everyone's for the taking.
What does puzzle me is the property taxes. I guess with your home insurance skyrocketing after the burglaries that closed the gap, but property taxes on my house in Conroe is about $3,600 on our home which is valued at $104,000. I checked on a house in far NW Oklahoma City with a similar value. Its property taxes were roughly $850. It's too bad more people our age don't share the same type of enthusiasm for OKC, but that is just the reality of things.
I
Yeah, my home valued at 160k near downtown OKC is assessed at 1800/year tax. I'm on the far west side of Houston in the country now and taxes are really really cheap...On a 150k house with 2.5 acres of land you pay about 1500/year. AND no state income tax which you have to consider as well. Sales tax rates are about the same in OKC as in Houston, Houston slightly more.
It varies from place to place but overall I have definitely saved money since moving back to Texas.
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Wifi too
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