Anyone near Big Cedar? (McAlester, Poteau: for sale, homes, employment)
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I live in California and have wanted to move for some time now. I took a look at Idaho with my wife since I grew up there. Her answer was a definite "NO". My next look was at Utah. Logan to be precise. And it was beautiful but not being LDS was a problem. Some say it would be fine, some said I would be miserable. For me, I could have lived with it, but with 2 small children and a teenager I was not willing to take a chance.
SO now I am looking at OK. And I found that east OK seems to have the most bang for the buck, so to speak. The prices compared to what I pay in Fresno CA are unbelievable. And my wife has family in Texas so we would be closer than in California.
My question: Does anyone live in or near Big Cedar? And if so, can you tell me anything about the towns, roads and travel to and from places, stores, is there high speed internet, what are the schools like, wildlife, and people?
Big Cedar is a beautiful spot that sits in a valley between the Winding Stair and Kiamichi mountains. There is a monument there where JFK cut a ribbon when they finished the highway through the mountains there. The mountains are about 2000 feet above the valley there. The Kiamichi river runs through there and it is a pretty clear stream. Big Cedar is pretty remote. It is about 20 or so miles to Talihina Oklahoma (to the west) and about 25 miles to Mena Arkansas to the west. It is about 20 miles to Heavener Oklahoma to the north and about 35 to Poteau. You would be needing to go to Mena or Poteau for most things as the other two towns don't have much.
There is no town at Big Cedar. Just a convienance store. There are some homes, double wides and cabins around there. About 10 miles west is Whitesboro which has a store, a post office and a school and fire station.
Big Cedar has all kinds of animals including bears. There are hundreds of miles of trails around there. Cedar lake is just over the hill and lake Wister and Broken Bow and Sardis are all within an hour of there. Also the upper mountain fork and Glover rivers provide some fishing and boating opportunities.
Also there are tons of great spots just over the line in Arkansas.
The bad thing about the area is it is a pretty good haul to a real city. Fort Smith is probably a little over an hour from there and McAlester Oklahoma is probably about the same. The roads to get around aren't a problem though.
I think eastern Oklahoma and Western Arkansas are the most beautiful parts of the central USA. The Ouachitas are the highest mountains between the Rockies and Appalachians if you exclude the Black Hills of South Dakota.
Thank you for your reply. How big is Whitesboro? Will my kids hate me if I moved to a place in that area? I want quiet living but I want my kids to have friends too. How big is the school? Like 20 kids for all grades? And how about high-speed internet? Somehow I fear that in that remote of an area it might not be available. I use broadband now as I live in a town outside Fresno CA where their version of High Speed DSL is slower than dial up. The broadband is great, however.
Whitesboro is tiny. I don't know how big the school is but it is in the smallest class in Oklahoma. If I were advising somebody I would go over to Mena Arkansas or up to Poteau for school issues. Mena is probably about 6-7000 and seems like a nice place. It is really a pretty setting in the pines.
Poteau is in a beautiful valley like Mena but Poteau is north of the "pine line" by about 20 miles. Poteau is about 7 thousand, but it feels more like a town of about 12 to 15 thousand because it has a decent sized service area.
Another advantage of Poteau is that it is only a 35 minute drive to Ft Smith Arkansas which has most of your larger city amenities. Ft. Smith has about a 200K service area but it is considered a part of the NW Arkansas corridor which if you include Fayettville/Springdale and the eastern Oklahoma border towns there is about 700 K in the area. Fayetteville is the home to like four fortune 500 companies.
I bring this up because Poteau feels MUCH less remote than Mena if that matters. Mena is probably 50-60 minutes from Ft. Smith.
Big Cedar DOES seem really remote, but I bet somebody does have a wireless internet tower service you could sign up for. I'm sure Poteau and Mena both have DSL.
I know this is an OLLLLDDD post, but I grew up 6 miles east of Big Cedar, OK, it is REALLLYYYY the middle of nowhere.....!!!!
Nearest town to shop at, is Mena, Ark, which has a Walmart, and other normal small town shops. It is county seat of Polk county.
Jim Jensen
Dayton, OH
Quote:
Originally Posted by Going_Somewhere
I live in California and have wanted to move for some time now. I took a look at Idaho with my wife since I grew up there. Her answer was a definite "NO". My next look was at Utah. Logan to be precise. And it was beautiful but not being LDS was a problem. Some say it would be fine, some said I would be miserable. For me, I could have lived with it, but with 2 small children and a teenager I was not willing to take a chance.
SO now I am looking at OK. And I found that east OK seems to have the most bang for the buck, so to speak. The prices compared to what I pay in Fresno CA are unbelievable. And my wife has family in Texas so we would be closer than in California.
My question: Does anyone live in or near Big Cedar? And if so, can you tell me anything about the towns, roads and travel to and from places, stores, is there high speed internet, what are the schools like, wildlife, and people?
Can you tell me anything about the Big Cedar area? I'm looking for a bit of land and have found a place that has been for sale now for quite a while, it seems. It is off of Hwy 63, about two miles before the AR state line, and to the South off Hwy 63. The plot is 80 acres.
What I'm curious about is what type of land it is up there? Is there any ag value at all? Cows, hay, timber, etc? Also, what kind of "issues" would we run into up there? This would be a weekend spot, with the option of having it as a retirement place later in life. I'm most concerned about illegal stuff going on up in the woods. Any major issues that you're aware of?
Thanks in advance for the reply.
Jason
Dallas, TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by eokie1
I know this is an OLLLLDDD post, but I grew up 6 miles east of Big Cedar, OK, it is REALLLYYYY the middle of nowhere.....!!!!
Nearest town to shop at, is Mena, Ark, which has a Walmart, and other normal small town shops. It is county seat of Polk county.
In the recent past, I have been just a few miles directly west of where you are looking to buy acreage. It was my first and only time up there, although I hope to go back someday. We rode ATVs up to where National Forest Road (NF) 6025 crosses Hwy. 259, which is a few miles south of Hwy. 63. Use the Satellite view on Google Maps to find it (not Google Earth). You will have to zoom almost all the way in to see NF 6025. As I recall, the short length of NF 6025 I was on west of Hwy. 259 was asphalt. The trail leading up to NF 6025 was wide and graded, but there was a continuous covering of rocks big enough and jagged enough to destroy a set of street tires.
Like others have said, it is pretty remote. I saw some satellite TV dishes while I was up there. Not sure whether land phone and land Internet are available. However, it is an AT&T coverage area and depending on where we were standing (the lower areas are in a valley between mountain ranges), we could get service, both cell, and wireless Internet on a notebook PC. I understand that the area near Hwy. 63 and Hwy. 259 is now on the water grid and has 911 service. That area appeared to have electicity, and some people had well water, too. I was actually surprised that so many people lived out there, although everyone had plenty of elbow room (not able to see your neighbor's place).
Most of the area I was in was beautiful and heavily timbered. I found out later they are short leaf pine trees. Looked like they were a hundred feet tall and some were fairly substantial, up to a couple of feet in diameter. Good spacing between trees, but the land area between the trees was very jungle-like and didn't encourage exploration on foot. I did see some cleared, flat land being used for farming, but, where I was, it was mostly sloped land with trees, trees, and more trees.
Not sure about illegal activities, but someone I talked to while up there did mention that there had been some meth labs busted in the past (don't know how many or how long ago). Talk to the locals, they will be able to give you the latest info.
The acreage you are considering probably hasn't sold yet because it appears to be the side of a steep mountain with an even steeper ravine in the middle. That whole tract looks like a watershed that feeds the creek in the bottom of that ravine. That tract doesn't look like it is directly accessible from NF 7322, either, so you may need 4WD and off-road tires to get to the tract. If there aren't many people living in the area, you may well be off-the-grid entirely, with the exception of AT&T wireless at the higher elevations.
To see what I'm talking about, switch Google Maps to Terrain view and look at the shaded relief map with the contour lines. Look how close the contour lines are in the area you are looking at versus the area I was in. The contour lines seem to be as close or much closer to each other in your area. The closer the contour lines are to each other, the steeper the terrain. While riding up the north slope of the mountain (this is essentially the same north slope of the same range that your tract is on) to NF 6025, west of Hwy. 259, I couldn't believe how steep the terrain was on the downhill side of the trail. It must have been at least a 65-75 degree incline. I'm not joking. I now understand how someone can "fall down a mountain." No way to live at that angle, unless you are a mountain goat.
Better take a drive up there and scope things out first. If there are no clear, flat areas at the lower elevations on the north side of the tract with good sun exposure, road access, electric, etc., it may not be do-able unless you are willing to sink some serious money into the project. And since the tract is in a national forest, who knows what laws they have when it comes to clearing timber off your land. Also, in the winter, the sun will be low in the southern sky, which means the north slope of that mountain (your tract) will be cold, damp, and gloomy, made even worse by tall, dense pine forests. It might be like living in a cave made of trees. IMO, you have to have adequate sunlight, especially in the winter, or it could lead to winter depression (the blues) over time. It's one thing to visit a deep forest, but quite another to live in one.
Not trying to talk you out of it, just tossing out a few concerns I would have if I were looking for a place.
Last edited by ondafringe; 06-22-2009 at 03:05 PM..
Reason: Get rid of HTML code
I live in California and have wanted to move for some time now. I took a look at Idaho with my wife since I grew up there. Her answer was a definite "NO". My next look was at Utah. Logan to be precise. And it was beautiful but not being LDS was a problem. Some say it would be fine, some said I would be miserable. For me, I could have lived with it, but with 2 small children and a teenager I was not willing to take a chance.
SO now I am looking at OK. And I found that east OK seems to have the most bang for the buck, so to speak. The prices compared to what I pay in Fresno CA are unbelievable. And my wife has family in Texas so we would be closer than in California.
My question: Does anyone live in or near Big Cedar? And if so, can you tell me anything about the towns, roads and travel to and from places, stores, is there high speed internet, what are the schools like, wildlife, and people?
Thanks in advance!
Ken
All the replies are good and correct. Big Cedar is very isolated. I lived in Mena AR years ago, still have family there and visit as often as possible. The population is about 5,000, good schools, good hospital, good people. It's about an hour to Ft. Smith or Hot Springs for any special medical care or more specialized dining or shopping. Employment will be limited, depending on the training/education/skills of you and your wife. It depends on your mind and heart how well you adapt. As with most communities, large and small, the people will give you what you give them. Anyone with a good attitude can adapt. I know - been there, done that. Good luck.
Can you tell me anything about the Big Cedar area? I'm looking for a bit of land and have found a place that has been for sale now for quite a while, it seems. It is off of Hwy 63, about two miles before the AR state line, and to the South off Hwy 63. The plot is 80 acres.
What I'm curious about is what type of land it is up there? Is there any ag value at all? Cows, hay, timber, etc? Also, what kind of "issues" would we run into up there? This would be a weekend spot, with the option of having it as a retirement place later in life. I'm most concerned about illegal stuff going on up in the woods. Any major issues that you're aware of?
Thanks in advance for the reply.
Jason
Dallas, TX
Jason: ONDAFRINGE has given you good detail info that I agree with 100% and will put in my two-bits-worth. I do volunteer archeology work for the Ouachita National Forest (ONF) and have been in the mountains around Big Cedar. I wasn't looking for that, but I think I remember the upper elevations of the valleys being clay with lots of shale. The lower elevations are alluvial and fertile if they have not been used up with past farming. The mountain sides are rocky and steep. Illegal stuff; The ONF Law Enforcement Officers tell me they still find "pot gardens" on the Forest but most of the meth labs are now mobile, unless set up in a house. They don't set up camp in a remote area and cook meth as much as they once did. In our archeology work, our policy is; If we walk up on one of those situations, we quietly back out, walk away, and report it. I'll confess my bias, but I don't think you could go wrong closer to Mena.
Oh! I almost forgot. If the 80 acre plot you are interested in is "land-locked" by the ONF, you will have to get permission to build an access road through the Forest to it. If there is an old existing road through the Forest to it, you will have to get permission to improve it. If your plot is wooded and you want to cut trees, ONF has no control over that.
What king of archeological stuff are you trying to dig up in ONF? Sounds interesting.
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Anyone near Big Cedar?
