Okie's Relocating (Oklahoma City, Tulsa, Muskogee: hoa, travel, job)

[Sooner-On-The-Move]

I'm from Oklahoma and have lived in Kentucky, Tennessee, and Mississippi (don't recommend the last in that list). I'm looking now at a job opportunity in New Mexico. So, no, not everyone here stays forever. But I do tend to keep coming back. Mostly for family.

[qhelly]

I would like one white person to answer this question?
What is wrong with black people? What the hell exactly is the problem?

We all hear about racism.... but never the whys.

Of course it's easy to see what's wrong with racists -- stupid, boring, drab, stupid, boring, drab, hateful, stupid, boring, drab, have no hobbies, have no interests....

[Griffis]

Are you asking if there IS a problem with black people or why there is a perception (on the part of whites) that there is a problem?

Not to sound jerky, it's just a little ambiguous.

[qhelly]

I am asking, What do you have against black people? What exactly is it that bothers you so much.

I'm asking any racist. Because I don't know why and never have. I grew up with racism. I'm a white WASP with New England roots.

I am asking what racism is based on....and I just bet, and am willing to bet all my life savings, that no one can come up with a viable answer.

[AshleyMc]

Hey look at "Best Places to Live" at CNN also... Broken Arrow and Edmond in Okla. were on the List. Tulsa has lots to do from River Parks (Tulsa, Jenks) Beautiful lakes in any direction, Museums, canoe rides on the Illinois river, go to Bartlesville to see Willowroc Wildlife Refuge (Teddy Roosevelt hung out here), etc. but there is lots to do...enjoy

[Griffis]

Originally Posted by qhelly

I am asking, What do you have against black people? What exactly is it that bothers you so much.

I'm asking any racist. Because I don't know why and never have. I grew up with racism. I'm a white WASP with New England roots.

I am asking what racism is based on....and I just bet, and am willing to bet all my life savings, that no one can come up with a viable answer.

Okay, gotcha. I thought you were making a racist comment, i.e. "What the hell is wrong with black people?!?!?!"

Now that I know you mean "Why do racists think there is a problem with black people?", all I can say is, "you got me."

It's very unfortunate that in this day and age people still generalize that way. I have met great and shoddy people from every race. I think social issues such as gang-membership (which crosses all race barriers) is more at play than anything a person can point to as far as being indicative of a racial profile.

I have certainly met racist people in Oklahoma but I'm happy to say most of the people I know are at the very least tolerant; many more would never even think of a person's race.

However, I've lived mostly in larger towns in Oklahoma. The redneck racist views may predominate more in small towns.

But I bet racism is worse in the deeper South than it is in OK.

I don't think anyone has a good reason for being racist. There's just an attitude with some people, born of ignorance or general intolerance, that allows them to say things like "these nasty latinos are moving here and ruining everything" or "those horrible black people are mostly rapists and gangstas". etc.

It's sad. This country still hinges on the old boy network. The rich, white old boys...(see the current administration.)

[qhelly]

Griffis,

I appreciate your reply to a very open-ended question. Yer right, there is no answer, just a teaming up of one group against another out of some sort of pathetic tradition for their culture.

[Griffis]

Originally Posted by qhelly

Yer right, there is no answer, just a teaming up of one group against another out of some sort of pathetic tradition for their culture.

Yes, I have never understood this. It seems like, at base, we are all HUMAN, first and foremost, sort of sailing on this big stone through a massive ocean we know very little about.

Why it is that the racial or patriotic or material concepts divide us so....I mean, people just seem to LOVE saying "I have more wealth than you" or "I'm an AMERICAN!" or "My football team is better than the football team from the neighboring town!" or "People whose skin is THIS color are better than those with THAT color"..."men are 'better' than women", etc., etc.

It's lunacy. I mean, I am glad I was born where and who I am, but that's all it is--an accident of birth.

Hopefully, I'm a human being before I am a white guy, an American, a member of some church or other organization, etc.

[Sooner-On-The-Move]

Originally Posted by qhelly

Griffis,

I appreciate your reply to a very open-ended question. Yer right, there is no answer, just a teaming up of one group against another out of some sort of pathetic tradition for their culture.

Actually, I think you may have nailed it there. If you act like you want to be treated differently (i.e. shoving your personal culture in someone else's face), then you will be treated differently, and from that prejudice ensues. It's nasty, and it's detestable, but it's the truth of our society. Either fit in or prepare for the lambast.

[sstruby]

oklahoma is actually one of the most diverse ecological and beautiful states in the union, 3rd or 4th on the list for ecological regions. most people just don't take or haven't had the time to fully explore it in all it's glory. ironically one of the most beautiful regions is the black mesa area in far western oklahoma. gloriously free of people, has wonderful mesas, hiking, wide-open vistas, fishing, petroglyphs, dinosaur tracks, etc.

there is plenty of culture in both okc & tulsa. tulsa likes to tout its museums and personally comes off snobbish and pretty full of itself, trendy for trendy's sake rather than soulful. okc is more earthy, has an incredible downtown art museum and a diverse ethnic food scene tulsa can't touch -- like okc's thriving asian district. both cities offer all the pros and cons of any major metro area. all the chain stores, etc., honestly they all look alike in the suburbs. the core areas with character are the historical, inner cities and okc really shines down in this area with nine historical districts, a vibrant river scene, thriving entertainment district, goregous downtown park, river walk with parks and trail system, amazing mid-century architecture, etc. tulsa has some equally nice stuff but not on the same scope since okc is also the capital and has a larger population.

all that said, my family and i are planning to move in a couple of years. it's a shame -- because there are many things we love about the state (tulsa is not one of them as you can tell) and especially the diverse beautiful geography.

so why move?
oklahoma's lack of vision and fair, open-minded leadership
shabby and often times abusive treatment of the poor, immigrants, American Indians, etc.
good old boy politics reign supreme
theocracy reigns supreme
fascist heaven
close-minded, repressive approach to issues
generally, although there are a few lonely exceptions, one-sided, one-dimensional media coverage on most issues (both left and right of center) -- shabby, shabby
many money-grubbing greedy corporations
home to a disporportionately large number of lobbyists -- what does that tell you!
really hot long dry summers that are getting every worse with climate change and global warming