Possible move from Cali (Duncan, Tahlequah: environment, property taxes, vacation)

[mkfarnam]

Jammie Wrote:

Hopefully we can keep the Midwest for just us legal citizens.

AMEN to that.

[nofearfactor]

Well...hmmmm...where to start...Its the opposite for me.I'm from California,and my wife is a lifelong Okie.We live in the Tulsa area.Ive taken her back to North Cali on visits, and she fell in love with the mountains.We have talked about retiring up there some day.

I was born tho in San Diego.My mom and dad were both born and raised in northeastern Oklahoma and my mom moved out to Cali when my dad became a career Marine.My mom left us to go back to Ok when I was 10 and I stayed with my dad in Cali.I went back and forth in the summers my whole childhood.Talk about culture shock.A fair haired surfer/skater dude from So Cal in Oklahoma in the summers.When my dad finished his service,he went back to Oklahoma to live too.My lil bro went to Ok with my mom.My older half sisters and half brother lived with their mom in Anaheim,so,I moved in with them when my dad headed for OK.Today,my sisters still live in the HuntingtonBeach area and Anaheim, and my older brother is up in Monterrey.Born and bred true Californians they all are with no intentions of ever leaving...

I moved to the Bay area after HS,then lived up in the Sierra foothills in small towns-Sonora,San Andreas,Modesto,Mariposa while still working in the Bay area as a musician.Worked at HP for a while,while we lived in Sunnyvale.We lived in a house my gf's mom owned.In the summer of 99, I met a band from Iowa who came to record a record in the recording studio I was working in as a session guitarist in San Fran.Their guitarist quit em while there,and I joined up with them to help them finish the record. and then moved with them back to Des Moines after the record;taking my girlfriend,who grew up in San Fran/San Jose/Sunnyvale all her life.She was a tattooist/piercer and we had a pretty good thing going on in Iowa.Then that first winter hit.She was gone.Cried about the snow and headed back to Cali when it got 30BELOW with 4feet of snow.And it snowed from November to April there.I stayed for a few years,living with a few different girlfriends,and still driving a Camaro and a Harley.The Z28 had no heater.Didnt need one in California!!!

Christmas 02 I found my way down to the Tulsa/Owasso area to visit some friends and family for a month.Met a OK girl.and stayed. 4 years later,I'm still here.and married.Now I'm living in the Broken Arrow area.My wife is a lifelong Okie.Has had one job since college.Shes a professional in the corporate world.Our house is in a 'burb area amidst other $90-150K homes.My wife bought in on the house when it was like about $60K 10 years ago and we have paid it off and doubled her worth in it.Now I drive all over the Midwest region to play in that same band from Iowa;except we now have our rehearsal space/recording studio in KansasCity to soften my drives.I give guitar lessons,build guitar stage rigs for other guitarists,work in studios as a session player,etcetc,and travel the Midwest playing clubs.

My wife, is my total opposite;corporate professional;no tattoos or piercings;Methodist Sunday school teacher;very religious locally well established upper income family;Conservative-Republican.
Then theres me.I have both arms fully sleeved in tattoos along with neck/legs,many piercings,shaved headed.Totally non religious.I have felt out of place here quite a few times,but its mostly out in south Tulsa in a nice restaurant or at the mall.I know its just my appearance.I have never been pushed on about religion or politics tho.and I'm the farfar left liberal-Independant.Raised Catholic by my mothers side.My father was into Buddhism/Zen/Eastern religions and martial arts.He smoked pot and rode a Harley and an old Indian out in the desert.He left me at home in San Diego almost every weekend while he rode all over So Cal with his biker buddies.I surfed and skateboarded and played the guitar in bands.Grew my hair to my waist.Had fun in the sun.

When I moved up into the mountains I snowboarded,skied up at Bear Valley and DonnersPass.Hiked Yosemite alot.Grew my pot up in Sonora.Rode my motorcyle up and down the winding roads to Mariposa, and up to Bear Valley.Went to Reno,or Tahoe, or to the Bay area for fun times.Wet suit surfed in the bay.Got great Chinese food.Badass Mexican.Indian.Sushi.Made the rounds to the wineries in Napa.Tripped off to Big Sur and Carmel and Monterrey on weekends.Walking the GG bridge.Nice parks.the Pier and great seafood.
And paid out the ass for everything.San Fran/Bay area was a nightmare of living costs.Sunnyvale,was even more retarded.Even tho my gf's mom owned the house we lived in,the rent was crazy.The brownouts.Never knew when our neighborhood was gonna get the electric shut off that day.

But,do I miss California?some things yes.some things no.Weird thing is,my wife who has lived in Tulsa her whole life, would move there now in a heartbeat if I gave the word.Ive taken her up to the Sierras to visit,and she just fell in love with the New Melones damn area.Columbia.Sonora.Yosemite.Mariposa.She makes good damn money here,and would probably do as well there,but in a major city.She would never make it up in the mountains for work.And the costs would get to her.And she would get homesick.I know.I like it here, but not love it.I get homesick alot.I miss home and all of my old friends.Alot.I like the costs of living here,and there are alot of lakes and water recreation areas to take out my jetskies.Because I was born and raised by the water,I need my water.No salty sea smell tho.Relative safety here is a plus.I have my CCW permit and can carry a concealed handgun here for protection.Not in Cali.I carried illegal there.Meat.I never ate so much meat in all of my life as I have since Ive been here.BBQ and chili is king here.I never got that much of it back home.I do finally see some Tri-tips now in the stores here.mmmm.missed those Tri-tip sandwiches.and there arent that many corn fields here.Thats Iowa.I live in a pretty urban environment here.not even in the country.I dont hunt or fish at all.I know plenty of people who do tho.But ya know.There were some really scary freaky rednecks up in the mountains in North Cali who drove big trucks and rode horses.Same as here.rednecks are not native to the Midwest.theres rednecks every where Ive ever been.Even on a trip to Europe I came across alot more toothless inbreds there.I know of some who live out in the boonies in Hawaii when we there a few times that rival any Okie redneck.and they grow some really good smoke.oooops.thats a taboo here.The cops,courts and judges here are mean and unforgiving when it comes to herb usuage.o well.quit that stuff years ago anyways...

Only thing missing here tho,really?-the mountains.I really miss the mountains surrounding me, and the old growth trees of the Sierras darkening the sky at sunset.and the ocean.and those sunsets.and seeing the NorthernLights...etcetc................

[Synopsis]

Hi nofear.
California is certainly a beautiful state. I've been there myself and love many parts of California and can understand how you would miss it. The weather, the mountains, the beach, the list goes on and on. I think what alot of people are leaving is the cost of living, the over-priced homes, rampant illegal immigration, overpopulation, etc. No doubt California is a beautiful place; my mom and dad lived there for some time before I was born and have many relatives in California. California has a lot to offer and that's why it's such a heavily populated state. But, many people are finding the simpler life in places like Oklahoma to be their more to their liking and fitting in with their value system. I hope you and your wife find what you want.

[jessaka]

Yes, California is beautiful. San Francisco is wonderful, as is Yosemite and Northern CA, but it is getting so congested in many places that it is not worth it to me to live there. I always joke that I would move back to Berkeley if I could afford a home and a limo driver to take me everywhere. I used to spent a lot of hours driving to get out of town into the country, not it takes me 3 minutes. I would not trade Oklahoma for CA in a heartbeat. I don't even have plans on visiting family and friends there. I just don't want to deal with it anymore.

I lived in San Diego, can't say I liked it at all; been in Los Angeles and consider it a nightmare. San Francisco Bay Area is also a nightmare as is San Jose.

I also agree with you all on the immigration problem. I hope the U.S. can stop it. People should come here legally, and I don't think that we should give those here amnesty. It was shocking to read what one poster said about the **** fights, taking over abandoned homes, etc.

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by jessaka

Yes, California is beautiful. San Francisco is wonderful, as is Yosemite and Northern CA, but it is getting so congested in many places that it is not worth it to me to live there. I always joke that I would move back to Berkeley if I could afford a home and a limo driver to take me everywhere. I used to spent a lot of hours driving to get out of town into the country, not it takes me 3 minutes. I would not trade Oklahoma for CA in a heartbeat. I don't even have plans on visiting family and friends there. I just don't want to deal with it anymore.

I lived in San Diego, can't say I liked it at all; been in Los Angeles and consider it a nightmare. San Francisco Bay Area is also a nightmare as is San Jose.

I also agree with you all on the immigration problem. I hope the U.S. can stop it. People should come here legally, and I don't think that we should give those here amnesty. It was shocking to read what one poster said about the **** fights, taking over abandoned homes, etc.

WE left Ca for all the reasons you mentioned, that was 25 or more years and have never looked back. My brother can't wait to retire so he can build on his newer purchased land in Williams AZ, he wants out; most of our friends that still live in Ca are there because of family and yes, we have a handful of longtime friends that wouldn't move out if someone paid them. It is interesnting, they wouldn't leave, but are the biggest complainers about all the problems.

We are just looking forward to living in the midwest (ok, south) whatever where life is slower, people are friendly and most of them speak English.

Nita

[nofearfactor]

Ive seen the ads lately for the new movie,"Georgia Rules", with Jane Fonda and Lindsey Lohan.The girl is acting up in the front yard, and Jane looks over and sees the neighbors watching the scene and says,"She was raised in California ya know"!!!....

[mkfarnam]

That`s one think I`ll miss when I leave California, The Mountains.
I live at the foothills of the San Bernardino Mountains, below Big Bear, Lake ArrowHead And Crestline.
There`s no question about the beauty of Ca.
But I`ll get over it.

nmnita wrote:

It is interesnting, they wouldn't leave, but are the biggest complainers about all the problems.

They may feel like I did,,,, stuck in the system.

[jessaka]

mkfarnam,

"There`s no question about the beauty of Ca.
But I`ll get over it."

LOL. I believe I will get over some things too, like the good restaurants and great shopping. Here if you find a good restaurant or a nice place to shop, it can be so exciting that you appreciate it more, and you know what? You didn't have to fight a traffic jam to get there, instead you had a nice drive in a small town or country or even a larger town that has so little traffic that it feels like a small town in CA.

When I lived in Berkeley Yosemite could be reached and enjoyed in a day. I never had to have a year in advance reservation like you do now. It was so beautiful back then, and I imagine it still is, but congested. But you know what? I am tired of pine trees, and so I love this area of Oklahoma because the trees are of a large variety and turn colors in the fall.

I live in town, but the birds in my yard are many and of various types. I have wild animals coming into the yard. I know this because my dog barks wildly at night, and I have to bring her back inside. Our neighbor had a skunk in his house when he got up one morning, so he and his dog went back to bed for a couple of hours. We saw wild life in San Diego, like dangerous mountain lions and packs of coyotes, but I am glad that we don't seem to have them around here. At least not in my neck of the woods. I was literally afraid to take walks where I lived after watching news stories of people that were killed by mountain lions and almost by coyotes. But if there is anything I miss in CA outside of food and shopping, it would be Yosemite, but I have not been their in over 35 years anyway.

nmnita,

If you decide on Ok. you are picking the best areas, the eastern parts, and if you decide on AR, well, the Fayetteville is getting expensive, but I don't know how your finances are. I found Tahlequah area to be lest expensive, so few tornadoes that no one thinks about them outside of myself, and you may like the Ft. Smith area. We are going to Ft. Smith for the first time next week, and that will tell me what I think of it.

I know that I don't like to go to Tulsa, but that is because of traffic, and yet there isn't as much as CA. I just find as I age that I don't like driving to new places unless I have been driven there often. I found nothing in Tulsa or Fayetteville, but Muskogee is easy to get around in. Now, this is from a person that hasn't checked out much in those cities, so don't listen to me. I know that the drive to Muskogee from Tahlequah is like being on a road where people are 1/2 a mile from each other. That I like. Then when you get into town they are 6 cars apart on highway. I also like that people don't drive crazy like they do in CA but are courteous to each other. Perhaps my fear of driving is from having been in a car accident in L.A. traffic just over a year ago where I was involved in a 6 car pileup, and we all lived.

I can understand missing the mountains, but the only mountains I miss in CA are those in Yosemite. I have been to Big Bear, as my dad used to live there, and it was pretty, but I prefer here.

There was very little that I loved in San Diego since I am not a beach person, even though I love seeing the ocean from time to time. I did like Balboa Park. There is nothing in L.A. that I would want to see again. I loved Berkeley because those were my college days, and I loved San Francisco, but you pay a big price in nerves, travel, traffic, etc. to be there.

I was raised in Paso Robles, CA near San Luis Obispo, and I still love that area, and the traffic isn't too bad. My sisters go there to visit once a year since our parents died, but I see no reason. Even a Trip to Bountiful doesn't appeal to me.

[Honeybee]

Originally Posted by nofearfactor

Well...hmmmm...where to start...Its the opposite for me.I'm from California,and my wife is a lifelong Okie.We live in the Tulsa area.Ive taken her back to North Cali on visits, and she fell in love with the mountains.We have talked about retiring up there some day.

I was born tho in San Diego.My mom and dad were both born and raised in northeastern Oklahoma and my mom moved out to Cali when my dad became a career Marine.My mom left us to go back to Ok when I was 10 and I stayed with my dad in Cali.I went back and forth in the summers my whole childhood.Talk about culture shock.A fair haired surfer/skater dude from So Cal in Oklahoma in the summers.When my dad finished his service,he went back to Oklahoma to live too.My lil bro went to Ok with my mom.My older half sisters and half brother lived with their mom in Anaheim,so,I moved in with them when my dad headed for OK.Today,my sisters still live in the HuntingtonBeach area and Anaheim, and my older brother is up in Monterrey.Born and bred true Californians they all are with no intentions of ever leaving...

I moved to the Bay area after HS,then lived up in the Sierra foothills in small towns-Sonora,San Andreas,Modesto,Mariposa while still working in the Bay area as a musician.Worked at HP for a while,while we lived in Sunnyvale.We lived in a house my gf's mom owned.In the summer of 99, I met a band from Iowa who came to record a record in the recording studio I was working in as a session guitarist in San Fran.Their guitarist quit em while there,and I joined up with them to help them finish the record. and then moved with them back to Des Moines after the record;taking my girlfriend,who grew up in San Fran/San Jose/Sunnyvale all her life.She was a tattooist/piercer and we had a pretty good thing going on in Iowa.Then that first winter hit.She was gone.Cried about the snow and headed back to Cali when it got 30BELOW with 4feet of snow.And it snowed from November to April there.I stayed for a few years,living with a few different girlfriends,and still driving a Camaro and a Harley.The Z28 had no heater.Didnt need one in California!!!

Christmas 02 I found my way down to the Tulsa/Owasso area to visit some friends and family for a month.Met a OK girl.and stayed. 4 years later,I'm still here.and married.Now I'm living in the Broken Arrow area.My wife is a lifelong Okie.Has had one job since college.Shes a professional in the corporate world.Our house is in a 'burb area amidst other $90-150K homes.My wife bought in on the house when it was like about $60K 10 years ago and we have paid it off and doubled her worth in it.Now I drive all over the Midwest region to play in that same band from Iowa;except we now have our rehearsal space/recording studio in KansasCity to soften my drives.I give guitar lessons,build guitar stage rigs for other guitarists,work in studios as a session player,etcetc,and travel the Midwest playing clubs.

My wife, is my total opposite;corporate professional;no tattoos or piercings;Methodist Sunday school teacher;very religious locally well established upper income family;Conservative-Republican.
Then theres me.I have both arms fully sleeved in tattoos along with neck/legs,many piercings,shaved headed.Totally non religious.I have felt out of place here quite a few times,but its mostly out in south Tulsa in a nice restaurant or at the mall.I know its just my appearance.I have never been pushed on about religion or politics tho.and I'm the farfar left liberal-Independant.Raised Catholic by my mothers side.My father was into Buddhism/Zen/Eastern religions and martial arts.He smoked pot and rode a Harley and an old Indian out in the desert.He left me at home in San Diego almost every weekend while he rode all over So Cal with his biker buddies.I surfed and skateboarded and played the guitar in bands.Grew my hair to my waist.Had fun in the sun.

When I moved up into the mountains I snowboarded,skied up at Bear Valley and DonnersPass.Hiked Yosemite alot.Grew my pot up in Sonora.Rode my motorcyle up and down the winding roads to Mariposa, and up to Bear Valley.Went to Reno,or Tahoe, or to the Bay area for fun times.Wet suit surfed in the bay.Got great Chinese food.Badass Mexican.Indian.Sushi.Made the rounds to the wineries in Napa.Tripped off to Big Sur and Carmel and Monterrey on weekends.Walking the GG bridge.Nice parks.the Pier and great seafood.
And paid out the ass for everything.San Fran/Bay area was a nightmare of living costs.Sunnyvale,was even more retarded.Even tho my gf's mom owned the house we lived in,the rent was crazy.The brownouts.Never knew when our neighborhood was gonna get the electric shut off that day.

But,do I miss California?some things yes.some things no.Weird thing is,my wife who has lived in Tulsa her whole life, would move there now in a heartbeat if I gave the word.Ive taken her up to the Sierras to visit,and she just fell in love with the New Melones damn area.Columbia.Sonora.Yosemite.Mariposa.She makes good damn money here,and would probably do as well there,but in a major city.She would never make it up in the mountains for work.And the costs would get to her.And she would get homesick.I know.I like it here, but not love it.I get homesick alot.I miss home and all of my old friends.Alot.I like the costs of living here,and there are alot of lakes and water recreation areas to take out my jetskies.Because I was born and raised by the water,I need my water.No salty sea smell tho.Relative safety here is a plus.I have my CCW permit and can carry a concealed handgun here for protection.Not in Cali.I carried illegal there.Meat.I never ate so much meat in all of my life as I have since Ive been here.BBQ and chili is king here.I never got that much of it back home.I do finally see some Tri-tips now in the stores here.mmmm.missed those Tri-tip sandwiches.and there arent that many corn fields here.Thats Iowa.I live in a pretty urban environment here.not even in the country.I dont hunt or fish at all.I know plenty of people who do tho.But ya know.There were some really scary freaky rednecks up in the mountains in North Cali who drove big trucks and rode horses.Same as here.rednecks are not native to the Midwest.theres rednecks every where Ive ever been.Even on a trip to Europe I came across alot more toothless inbreds there.I know of some who live out in the boonies in Hawaii when we there a few times that rival any Okie redneck.and they grow some really good smoke.oooops.thats a taboo here.The cops,courts and judges here are mean and unforgiving when it comes to herb usuage.o well.quit that stuff years ago anyways...

Only thing missing here tho,really?-the mountains.I really miss the mountains surrounding me, and the old growth trees of the Sierras darkening the sky at sunset.and the ocean.and those sunsets.and seeing the NorthernLights...etcetc................

Wow! your making me really homesick for Ca. and I haven't even gotton to Broken Arrow yet .I love Ca. also and have been raised and born here in Turlock .I and my family have decieded to move to Broken Arrow due to the cost of living is getting so high here we just need a change .My daughter and her hubby and kids just arrived to there new home there Wensday morning this week . I will I'm sure miss all the things you have decribed in your thread .We also love the Moutains and the Ocean and will really miss them .We have been to many of the places you mentioned and know just what your describing We want to retire early if we can and figure there is no retirement in Ca. So have chosen to try OK. I wish you and your wife the very best .And I told my hubby when we want Moutains we will go over to CO. and Ocean well I guess we will be going there evrytime we come to Ca. to visit are family and friends .Carmel and Big Sur are our favorite spots we always stayed at alittle bed@breakfast in Carmel are last time was last yr. for outr 25 wedding Ann. Ca. is a beautiful place .

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by jessaka

mkfarnam,

"There`s no question about the beauty of Ca.
But I`ll get over it."

LOL. I believe I will get over some things too, like the good restaurants and great shopping. Here if you find a good restaurant or a nice place to shop, it can be so exciting that you appreciate it more, and you know what? You didn't have to fight a traffic jam to get there, instead you had a nice drive in a small town or country or even a larger town that has so little traffic that it feels like a small town in CA.

When I lived in Berkeley Yosemite could be reached and enjoyed in a day. I never had to have a year in advance reservation like you do now. It was so beautiful back then, and I imagine it still is, but congested. But you know what? I am tired of pine trees, and so I love this area of Oklahoma because the trees are of a large variety and turn colors in the fall.

I live in town, but the birds in my yard are many and of various types. I have wild animals coming into the yard. I know this because my dog barks wildly at night, and I have to bring her back inside. Our neighbor had a skunk in his house when he got up one morning, so he and his dog went back to bed for a couple of hours. We saw wild life in San Diego, like dangerous mountain lions and packs of coyotes, but I am glad that we don't seem to have them around here. At least not in my neck of the woods. I was literally afraid to take walks where I lived after watching news stories of people that were killed by mountain lions and almost by coyotes. But if there is anything I miss in CA outside of food and shopping, it would be Yosemite, but I have not been their in over 35 years anyway.

nmnita,

If you decide on Ok. you are picking the best areas, the eastern parts, and if you decide on AR, well, the Fayetteville is getting expensive, but I don't know how your finances are. I found Tahlequah area to be lest expensive, so few tornadoes that no one thinks about them outside of myself, and you may like the Ft. Smith area. We are going to Ft. Smith for the first time next week, and that will tell me what I think of it.

I know that I don't like to go to Tulsa, but that is because of traffic, and yet there isn't as much as CA. I just find as I age that I don't like driving to new places unless I have been driven there often. I found nothing in Tulsa or Fayetteville, but Muskogee is easy to get around in. Now, this is from a person that hasn't checked out much in those cities, so don't listen to me. I know that the drive to Muskogee from Tahlequah is like being on a road where people are 1/2 a mile from each other. That I like. Then when you get into town they are 6 cars apart on highway. I also like that people don't drive crazy like they do in CA but are courteous to each other. Perhaps my fear of driving is from having been in a car accident in L.A. traffic just over a year ago where I was involved in a 6 car pileup, and we all lived.

I can understand missing the mountains, but the only mountains I miss in CA are those in Yosemite. I have been to Big Bear, as my dad used to live there, and it was pretty, but I prefer here.

There was very little that I loved in San Diego since I am not a beach person, even though I love seeing the ocean from time to time. I did like Balboa Park. There is nothing in L.A. that I would want to see again. I loved Berkeley because those were my college days, and I loved San Francisco, but you pay a big price in nerves, travel, traffic, etc. to be there.

I was raised in Paso Robles, CA near San Luis Obispo, and I still love that area, and the traffic isn't too bad. My sisters go there to visit once a year since our parents died, but I see no reason. Even a Trip to Bountiful doesn't appeal to me.

Jessaka, thanks, we have been gone from Ca since 1981 and there isn't much we miss. Hubby really is leaning toward OK. If we do decide on Ar it will not be Fayetteville, our finances are fixed like most seniors; in fact I refer to senior incomes as being broken more than fixed. Time will tell. After our annual trip to Las Vegas (next week as a matter of fact) we will be planning on our first inspection of the areas. I think we intend on venturing over to OK and AR in about 3 or 4 weeks.

Nita