[TheComputerGuy]

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

Not for long.......don't think there is a NJ Dept of taxation in Mustang.

And for that we are ALL thankful!

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

You would mandate that local citizens electing local school boards be gotten rid of? Who determines what gets spent and where in the school district? What I am talking about is getting rid of unfunded federal and state mandates. Leave the local boards alone.

We pretty much agree here, but apparently my wording was less than optimal.

What I meant is that schools should be under LOCAL control,
and the federal government should get out of the education business.
It's unconstitutional.

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

No, more federal mandates are being handed down without funding so local boards have more to do with less. We spend $150,000 a year to keep a guy in prison who was busted for smoking dope, and we spend $3500 a year to teach a kid how to survive and contribute to society. The problem is not one of too MUCH money......the problem is one of focus.....we need to focus on those who will benefit and ignore those who won't.

We actually agree here also for the most part...

My point was that we're spending more than ever on education,
and each generation comes out less educated than the previous one.
Countries that spend less on education score higher than we do.
There's something very wrong there.

And you're absolutely right about about money for prisons vs. money for education though...

It kills me that a lot of prisoners live better than a lot of working families....
At OUR expense, prisoners get:

Free climate controlled room and board.
Free cable TV and Internet.
Free 3 square meals a day.
Free Hot and cold running water... (Don't drop the soap!)
Free college or vocational educations.
Free health club facilities
Free medical care (Including elective procedures).
Free prescription medication.

Except for Bubba in the next cell who wants you to be his woman,
prison sounds like a pretty sweet deal for some people.

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

I've served on school boards.........indoctrination was never part of any curricula.

Well it is now... Especially in CA and the NorthEast.
I can post a lot of links if you don't believe me.

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

Not really.......the Shah, the dictators in Viet Nam that began our war there.......we actually blow it regularly. Take the current conflict.....we get rid of an a**hole, but fail to have a back up, so we are in a quagmire of country building. If the Iraqi's wanted to get rid of him, they should have done it. Such things cannot be forced on a people. After all, he was THEIR dictator, now ours.

The Shah wasn't a very nice guy, but he was a LOT better than the Ayatolla and his cronies. Carter blew that big time...

While I feel for the South Vietnamese, we went about that all wrong.
If we weren't going to fight to win, we should have stayed out of it...
(Sort of like the Iraq war now...)
Actually, I don't think we should have gone to VN either.
We need to stop being the world's policemen.

And I agree... We shouldn't have gone to Iraq.
Saddam was an EVIL guy, but he was able to keep all the factions there in line.
If the Iraqis didn't like it, they could have done the same thing as we did with the British here.... Eventually.
We were just as outnumbered and almost as out gunned.
Again, we shouldn't be the world's policemen.

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

They do a lot of good in many areas. but like any human enterprise, there is a lot wrong.

And they completely ignored the genocide in Dafur...
They are useless in Lebanon. They commit horrible crimes in Africa.
They took bribes from Iraq (oil for food program) and looked the other way.
They WANT to be the world's policemen, but they're terrible at it.

Okay.... Let's compromise...
You can keep the U.N. but let's relocate them from New York to Toronto.

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

What makes our dollars worth less, is a lack of productivity and an overwhelming debt. Borrowing money to pay your bills is what makes a country go broke.

In the words of your favorite "Bircher" :

"the Federal Reserve, our central bank, fosters runaway debt by increasing the money supply — making each dollar in your pocket worth less. The Fed is a private bank run by unelected officials who are not required to be open or accountable to “we the people.” Worse, our economy and our very independence as a nation is increasingly in the hands of foreign governments such as China and Saudi Arabia, because their central banks also finance our runaway spending."

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

Dad was a Bircher and they sound alike.

Can't comment, haven't met Dad.
But do you disagree that our government should strictly adhere to the U.S. Constitution?

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

So quit borrowing, quit giving tax breaks to move business off shore, and help business reduce expenses.

Agreed...
But there should be tax penalties for corporations that move off shore.

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

I deduct our dinners, so yes, you help pay for them...........

I guess it's legal as long as you discuss some business during said dinner.

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

I do carry a weapon...not registered and not openly.......

While "firearm registration" is not required in OK,
a permit to carry a concealed firearm is required by law,
and in order to get a permit there:

One has to spend about $60 for "required training"
in order to get the "required certificate"
in order to apply for the required permit which costs $100.
That's $160 to comply with an unconstitutional law.

http://www.nraila.org/statelawpdfs/OKSL.pdf

In NH, if you have a clean record, you get your permit in under 2 weeks for $10.
(Also unconstitutional, but much less expensive).
In AK and VT, a permit is not required.

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

NO, that was good shooting from 100yards with an iron sight. There is NO right to life. Life is earned.

It's nice to have acreage!

So dogs are equal to humans?
And yes, there are some dogs I like better than some
humans, but that's not the point.

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

Is your time worth my effort?

If a tree falls in the forest and no hears it, does it make a sound?

[TheComputerGuy]

Originally Posted by Synopsis

It would be a disaster I'm afraid. There would be lootings and crimes committed left and right, probably. Just think if you were the only person in your neighborhood that had lights on because you could afford to pay your bill or something. I'm sure it would be like a magnet for all kinds of ne-er do wells.

Can you say 12 gage?

[TheComputerGuy]

Originally Posted by Synopsis

You two both make good points, but if this is going where I think it might be, I'm going to move it to the politics forum. Agreed?

As far as I know, it's not a "heated discussion",
just a friendly exchange of ideas between two
slightly outspoken smart-*sses.
(DO you concur GP?)

The part that makes it sort of on topic is that it helps
one to gauge the OK political environment and the
opinions of Okie citizens.
These are important things to know when
deciding on where one wants to relocate.

But...
You run a good friendly forum here, so I have NO
problem deferring to your good judgment in order to
keep it that way.

[Synopsis]

It's fine. I just wanted to make sure it didn't go off in the wrong direction. I wish discussions in the Politics forum were as civil as this.

[TheComputerGuy]

Originally Posted by Synopsis

It's fine. I just wanted to make sure it didn't go off in the wrong direction. I wish discussions in the Politics forum were as civil as this.

That's what I LOVE about the OK forum...

People can discuss a LOT of things (in a mature, friendly manner)
that would turn into flame wars on any other forum.

I truly appreciate the Okie temperament.
It's SO refreshing!

[colleeng47]

"Worse, our economy and our very independence as a nation is increasingly in the hands of foreign governments such as China and Saudi Arabia, because their central banks also finance our runaway spending."


This quote CG posted from the Fed is truly scary. We all sit complacent, wondering where we'll buy our next flat screen TV (on credit) while foreign nations are taking us over. The US is turning into a nation of whining, grabbing adolescents (Cali, Nameless and 2010, not referring to you) while the rest of the world sits back and waits amusingly for our fall. We're more interested in our McMansions than we are in the state of our country. Too many sit and stamp there feet like temper tantrum 2 year olds because we can't always have what we are "entitled" to have. God help us.

[karibear]

Originally Posted by colleeng47

"Worse, our economy and our very independence as a nation is increasingly in the hands of foreign governments such as China and Saudi Arabia, because their central banks also finance our runaway spending."


This quote CG posted from the Fed is truly scary. We all sit complacent, wondering where we'll buy our next flat screen TV (on credit) while foreign nations are taking us over. The US is turning into a nation of whining, grabbing adolescents (Cali, Nameless and 2010, not referring to you) while the rest of the world sits back and waits amusingly for our fall. We're more interested in our McMansions than we are in the state of our country. Too many sit and stamp there feet like temper tantrum 2 year olds because we can't always have what we are "entitled" to have. God help us.

I, for one, am not sitting around wondering where I'll buy that flat screen TV - I'm waiting for the day when the perfectly good cheap color one I bought new a couple years ago won't work because technology has changed and it will be all about HD.

If you go to the retirement forum, those people seem to think everyone should have started saving and making plans for retirement when they were in their teens. That's fine, if it can be done. But they also all seem to have McMansions and talk about their portfolios, and so on, and don't take the rest of the world economy into consideration. The place I lived in Alaska was one of the top ports nationally in delivering seafood, usually number one, but varying from first place to maybe fifth. Almost all of the canneries were owned 49% by the Japanese 40 years ago, and the only reason they didn't own a higher percentage was because that was the limit then. A lot of the lumber cut and a lot of the oil also goes overseas, we - the US - don't use it. The county where I live now has one of the highest gas prices in the nation, and yet there are two refineries here. Someone - no one locally - gets the profit.

That whole 'entitlement' thing boggles me. No one ever said life was fair, or that anyone was owed anything simply because they were born. As far as I can tell, all men are created equal only in that they have the ability to make the best of what they are given, or they can choose not to, but IMO that applies to all men and women on the planet. But again, I want to stress that it's MY opinion only, I don't want to start any heated discussions!

[Synopsis]

Originally Posted by colleeng47

"Worse, our economy and our very independence as a nation is increasingly in the hands of foreign governments such as China and Saudi Arabia, because their central banks also finance our runaway spending."


This quote CG posted from the Fed is truly scary. We all sit complacent, wondering where we'll buy our next flat screen TV (on credit) while foreign nations are taking us over. The US is turning into a nation of whining, grabbing adolescents (Cali, Nameless and 2010, not referring to you) while the rest of the world sits back and waits amusingly for our fall. We're more interested in our McMansions than we are in the state of our country. Too many sit and stamp there feet like temper tantrum 2 year olds because we can't always have what we are "entitled" to have. God help us.

Very well put Colleen; you are right on the money. Most everyone I know is more concerned about who wins American Idol (a show I despise - not that there's anything wrong with that!) or as you said, their next flat-screen tv and 3 ton SUV with an entertainment center than who is running the country. It's really sad that the U.S. has degraded to this.

[Synopsis]

Originally Posted by karibear

I, for one, am not sitting around wondering where I'll buy that flat screen TV - I'm waiting for the day when the perfectly good cheap color one I bought new a couple years ago won't work because technology has changed and it will be all about HD.

If you go to the retirement forum, those people seem to think everyone should have started saving and making plans for retirement when they were in their teens. That's fine, if it can be done. But they also all seem to have McMansions and talk about their portfolios, and so on, and don't take the rest of the world economy into consideration. The place I lived in Alaska was one of the top ports nationally in delivering seafood, usually number one, but varying from first place to maybe fifth. Almost all of the canneries were owned 49% by the Japanese 40 years ago, and the only reason they didn't own a higher percentage was because that was the limit then. A lot of the lumber cut and a lot of the oil also goes overseas, we - the US - don't use it. The county where I live now has one of the highest gas prices in the nation, and yet there are two refineries here. Someone - no one locally - gets the profit.

That whole 'entitlement' thing boggles me. No one ever said life was fair, or that anyone was owed anything simply because they were born. As far as I can tell, all men are created equal only in that they have the ability to make the best of what they are given, or they can choose not to, but IMO that applies to all men and women on the planet. But again, I want to stress that it's MY opinion only, I don't want to start any heated discussions!

And Ditto to your post as well karibear. You make a lot of sense, a LOT of sense. I'm glad you are moving to Oklahoma and you too Colleen.

EDIT: Oh yeah, their "next" flat screen tv. We don't even OWN a flat screen TV. It would be nice, but I'm going to pay the bills and get out of debt before I indulge in such things. Then, if I so desire, I will pay CASH.

[colleeng47]

Originally Posted by Synopsis

And Ditto to your post as well karibear. You make a lot of sense, a LOT of sense. I'm glad you are moving to Oklahoma and you too Colleen.

EDIT: Oh yeah, their "next" flat screen tv. We don't even OWN a flat screen TV. It would be nice, but I'm going to pay the bills and get out of debt before I indulge in such things. Then, if I so desire, I will pay CASH.

I REALLY don't want to sound like a doomsdayer, but I think anyone who is really smart will do just this. Get out of debt. Start paying cash. Prepare to take care of yourself and your family without government help. Just look at the mess in Louisiana after the hurricane. So many people couldn't figure out how to get off their backsides and take care of themselves. All we heard were hues and cries about the "government" letting them down. Duh!