Moving to New Jersey (mortgage, credit, property taxes)

[mike0421]

Please don't make the mistake of moving to the Stroudsburg area, and think you can feasibly commute to Hackensack or NYC. I lived that lifestyle and am now happy to renounce it. For three years I lived in Mount Arlington, which is near Wharton. My commute was to Fort Lee, a little east of Hackensack. I had to quit my job inside a year. It chewed me up and spit me out. You will take years off your life, and you will take out your frustrations on your family when you get home, unless you are very, very patient, and don't mind sacrificing 4 hours of your life 5 days a week, sitting in traffic with your knuckles white, trying to push the BMW ahead of you up another 18 inches every 30 seconds or so.

I moved to New Mexico three years ago, and one of the three best aspects of this move was the escape from the NJ traffic. It's a killer.

[BobKovacs]

As Mike said, Stroudsburg to Hackensack would be a disaster on the best days, and an absolute nightmare on others. Also bear in mind that anything for $120k, even that far from NYC is likely a candidate for a bulldozing, or is so far off the interstate that it'll take you 45 minutes just to see another car.

And there's a reason that you're not likely to find much in the way of decent employment in Allentown, Bethlehem, or even Scranton- there's no big industry there, and they're all basically bedroom communities for Northern NJ and NYC workers. Anything you do find will pay far lower than anything in NJ.

I grew up in NJ, and we moved to North Georgia last year- it was the best decision we ever made. We had looked at moving into Eastern PA to be able to afford more house, and even though my commute would have been around 30 miles less than the ride to Hackensack, it would still have been over an hour at 6am, and 1.5+ at 5pm. I know you've got reasons for considering this move, but please think long and hard, and if you'd like further info or just have questions, feel free to DM me.

[Synopsis]

Thanks. I'm not one for long commutes; been there done that and I would go crazy. I'll focus closer. How about Morristown? Is that a decent area?

[BobKovacs]

Originally Posted by Synopsis

Thanks. I'm not one for long commutes; been there done that and I would go crazy. I'll focus closer. How about Morristown? Is that a decent area?

Morristown is a strange place- there's "The Green" in the center of town which is trying to position itself as an upscale, trendy area, but you go just a few blocks from there in several directions and it's like being in a 3rd world country with a large illegal population. There are other areas of town where you'll spend $500k+ for a 3br/1ba 80 y/o bungalow.

If you can give me an idea of what you need/want in the way of housing size/cost, what type of work you do, and the length of commute you're willing to tolerate (both miles and time) I might be able give you some ideas.

[Synopsis]

Originally Posted by BobKovacs

Morristown is a strange place- there's "The Green" in the center of town which is trying to position itself as an upscale, trendy area, but you go just a few blocks from there in several directions and it's like being in a 3rd world country with a large illegal population. There are other areas of town where you'll spend $500k+ for a 3br/1ba 80 y/o bungalow.

If you can give me an idea of what you need/want in the way of housing size/cost, what type of work you do, and the length of commute you're willing to tolerate (both miles and time) I might be able give you some ideas.

In the way of housing, I'd like to buy a home for under 200k. The size doesn't have to be that big; maybe 1200 square feet. I am a Business Writer/Technical Writer and also a Proposal Writer/Manager (Marketing).

The length of commute about 30-45 min. each way (maybe 15-20 miles?). I hope this helps.

BTW, how do people make a living up there with prices so high? I checked on some of the salaries for my position up there and they are LESS than they are here. And to boot, most of those aren't real jobs, they are contract!

[Jammie]

Synopsis, I'm surprised about this move, but I totally understand the need to relocate to where the right employment is. You know that I wish you well. Geesh, now we'll never be neighbors.

We have some friends who live in NJ and you'd just love them. They're an older couple who live near the coast. I see you're thinking about living across the state from them, but that's still not very far. They came to visit us a couple of years ago and absolutely loved the open spaces. They loved Mt. Rushmore and the Hills and especially liked the town I live in. VERY nice people.

If you're ever interested in meeting them, just DM me. I totally understand about the sticker shock there. From what they said, the cost of living is very high. They spent their entire lives there and it sounds like the cost of living and wages were at one time more in sync then they are now.

Lotsa luck to you and your family.

[colleeng47]

Originally Posted by Synopsis

Although the house they live in is worth well over 2 million so I don't think they may understand a poor man's dilemma.

Sorry, Synopsis, but in NJ, a 2 million dollar house is not necessarily a "rich man's" house. Things have come down a little bit, but there was a woman on the NJ forum recently who was whining about going house hunting in NJ, and she had 2 million to spend, and everything she looked at was so unacceptable that it made her cry.

[colleeng47]

Originally Posted by BobKovacs

Morristown is a strange place- there's "The Green" in the center of town which is trying to position itself as an upscale, trendy area, but you go just a few blocks from there in several directions and it's like being in a 3rd world country with a large illegal population. There are other areas of town where you'll spend $500k+ for a 3br/1ba 80 y/o bungalow.

If you can give me an idea of what you need/want in the way of housing size/cost, what type of work you do, and the length of commute you're willing to tolerate (both miles and time) I might be able give you some ideas.

Hey, Bob, nice to see you posting in my new neck of the woods!

[Synopsis]

Originally Posted by colleeng47

Sorry, Synopsis, but in NJ, a 2 million dollar house is not necessarily a "rich man's" house. Things have come down a little bit, but there was a woman on the NJ forum recently who was whining about going house hunting in NJ, and she had 2 million to spend, and everything she looked at was so unacceptable that it made her cry.

Well, I have never seen the house, and just took a guess. Judging from what my wife and daughter have told me it may be in the tens of millions then. I know it's VERY luxurious and they have a staff that takes care of things.

I'm befuddled how the average person makes a living there. My profession pays pretty well, so up there I'm sure the wages that I'm looking at are not peanuts, but they are LOWER than here and the COL is so much higher. As CG told me on the phone; most people were born there and never attempt to look elsewhere for a better standard of living (i.e. wages more in line with housing and such).

Puzzling.

[colleeng47]

Originally Posted by Synopsis

Well, I have never seen the house, and just took a guess. Judging from what my wife and daughter have told me it may be in the tens of millions then. I know it's VERY luxurious and they have a staff that takes care of things.

I'm befuddled how the average person makes a living there. My profession pays pretty well, so up there I'm sure the wages that I'm looking at are not peanuts, but they are LOWER than here and the COL is so much higher. As CG told me on the phone; most people were born there and never attempt to look elsewhere for a better standard of living (i.e. wages more in line with housing and such).

Puzzling.

Well, what CG told you is somewhat correct, but if you spend some time on the NJ forum, you'll find out that a heck of a lot of people are voting with their feet, and leaving NJ. In my family, my brother moved to Florida, my brothers in law moved to Louisiana and California. My sisters in law moved to Florida and Virginia. Out of eight siblings in my and my husband's family, only two remain in NJ, and that's mostly because their grown children are still there, but I even have one neice who has moved to PA, and another one looking at Delaware.

Things were always expensive in NJ, but they really got out of hand in the last 15 or so years. Taxes are horrendous, which I think is the catalyst that makes most people finally decide to move. As you found out for yourself, the theory that lower COL areas have lower salaries is not necessarily true. The job I just got in OKC pays what I would have started at in the Division of Taxation if I started there now. The jobs Doug is interviewing on also pay very similar to what he was making there. But the cost of living is about 40+% lower in OK.

Economics aside, though, NJ is a really good place to live. Many people are very happy there, and it sounds as though this is not a permanent move for you, so if it isn't, then you can certainly enjoy all that NJ has to offer for the next several years. You'll do fine.