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Old 12-17-2007, 02:09 PM
 
24 posts, read 76,715 times
Reputation: 18

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattpoulsen View Post
First, nobody knows how Pablo's neighbor's children are being taught in school. All he said is the parents don't speak english. Pablo's post is simply a hateful rant attacking his mexican neighbors for his high taxes. I mean come on! There are thousands of reasons that this guy's property taxes are high. His post sounds about like Hitler blaming the Jews for all of Germany's societal problems. The guy wants to blame someone so he picks his neighbors because they're mexican. I don't want to get into the U.S. immigration policy on this thread. Yes, there are problems with U.S. immigration policy. But the reason his property taxes are high is because Omaha needs to expand its tax base and bring in more business and higher paying jobs. The guy is a bitter person who wants to blame everyone else but himself and I was simply responding to that sentiment.

By the way, there were german speaking teachers "back in the day". It just wasn't official state policy. Furthermore, the way education system works, in this day in age, is drastically different than the way it worked in the 1800's (I'm not saying that's a good thing but its a fact of life). Back then a kid could come in not being able to speak English and just be assimilated without much of a problem. Today, a non-English speaking child would be left in the dust without some sort of outreach. If we would simply cut off spanish assistance in school the only thing that would happen is the Mexican children would stop getting educated. They would see even larger levels of dropouts and you would see a spike in crime. While I agree that the state should adopt different rules in how this assistance is effectuated, it still needs to be there. Education reduces crime...period. It is in the best interest of society to be sure that immigrants get the best education as possible. Would you rather spend your tax dollars on education or jails???

And as for businesses that put up signs in spanish...they do that for one reason....money$$$. Walmart doesn't really aim at getting the american-albanian dollar because they're aren't many albanians here. Spanish is by far the largest non-english language spoke in the U.S. and that is why companies are sure to have spanish signs...because a dollar is a dollar whether it comes out of a mexican pocket or an english speaking american pocket. Its not as though the government is forcing companies to put up spanish speaking signs...they're doing it to protect their bottomline. As for Mexican business, who only have spanish signs, well they cater to spanish speakers only. Yeah, they're probably losing business because they alienate the English speakers, but that's their prerogative. This is simply a case of capitalism at its finest...business only put up signs in Spanish to earn more money...period.

Thank you, Matt, for being the voice of reason...I've enjoyed reading your posts.
I was also thinking that the people responding clearly were not kindergarten teachers and had no idea what "esl" classes are designed to do..it's definitely not to keep the children from speaking english.
And for those of you complaining about these children, fast forward to the day you fall over shoveling your high-tax drive and an ambulance pulls up. Aren't you going to be happy your little spanish-speaking neighbor continued his education far beyond that which you paid for, and is there to save your life?

Last edited by mom2toddlers; 12-17-2007 at 02:11 PM.. Reason: sp
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Old 12-17-2007, 03:56 PM
 
482 posts, read 2,037,714 times
Reputation: 196
mom2toddlers,

I use a snowblower. Shovleing went out a very long time ago for me. Besides I remember that a State of Nebraska employee helping out an elderly couple in the Omaha area by clearing their high-tax driveway after a major snow storm so that the ambulance did have to come to their home and lost his job for helping out.

Besides for me it is not about individuals speaking their own language it is about America having to change the culture and traditions that we have had and made over hundreds of years in order to be politically correct for a very small percentage of individuals living in America today that the majority of them are in America illegally. I guess that with my family coming to America almost 400 years ago and helped make America what we are today, fighting in every major and minor war that America went through. Helping open up the western parts of America so that all of us today live the life style that we have. A life style that other nations want and the main reason that Americans are hated around the world for having. This I know for a fact as I work within the United Nations out of America in third world countries. They hate us because we have what we have not because of who we are. I have had Indians tell me that America was not doing enough after the 2004 tsumani, it was our fault that so many people died in this according to many of the Idians that I worked with. Yet the Americans were the first ones who sent in the military to help with the rescue efforts. Also one of the requirements for many of the jobs in the United Nations today is that you have to speak the English language, not Spanish, French, German or another language. Those who came to America in the past adjusted to become part of America without everyone else adjusting to them, just like my family did when they came to America as Germans as well. They came as ministers of the Lutheran religion, as farmers and craftsmen for the purpose of making a new country which we all live in called America, not African-America, Mexican-American, German-America, Irish-America, Japanese-American or whatever you can come up with, just plain old America where Americans live and go to school to make it even better and greater tomorrow. We have already bowed down to those who don't want to believe in God already by having religious symbols removed from public display because they did not like to look at them. That I am just not ready to bow down to individuals who want to change me to fit their way of life because they want to live in America when they refuse to become apart of America.
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Old 12-17-2007, 04:17 PM
 
Location: West Omaha
1,181 posts, read 3,646,896 times
Reputation: 477
Those are good points. But the U.S. traditions are ever changing. There isn't a period of more than 50 years in which you can look and say things are in anyway static from a societal point of view. When the Irish and Germans came over there were huge areas of segregation where you'd better follow their customs. The reason English was won out is because the power base that already existed had descended from the English colonies. For example, the germans came over and if they were going to rise in society they had better learn english. But the process wasn't automatic...it took a few generations for non-english speaking immigrants to assimilate. I don't think that's much different than what is going on now. Yes, I agree that we do need to stop the influx of illegal immigrants, but a lot of people have this misconception that all Mexican people walking around are illegal immigrants...well you and I both know that isn't true. Many are simply hard working people who came to America for the same reason our ancestors did...for a better life. Give them a few generations and they will feel like true Americans. The Irish, Scottish, German, Japanese, Korean, Vietnamese, and Chinese all have similar stories. They came over and for a while they identified themselves as Irish-American or Korean-American. Well, after a while this distinction disappears.

I'm not sure this has much to do with not having religious symbols in school...which we should not. If we were to have religious symbols in school then what should we have...would you be okay with the star of David? The founding fathers were smart enough to realize that in a pluralistic society it is often best for the government to offer no opinion on religion. In a public school system it is awfully difficult to have "no opinion" if you're bringing in religious teaching and symbols...who gets to decide what is taught and what's banned. That's why its best to leave religion out of the classroom and up to the family.
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Old 12-17-2007, 05:45 PM
 
Location: Omaha, NE
1,119 posts, read 3,813,530 times
Reputation: 405
Default Mexican Immigrants..

In all fairness, I want to mention that in my experience spanish-speaking (including the 'legal' mexicans 'which is most') generally are very hard working and usually are fairly laid back..

I think that these immigrants really have alot to offer. The only thing I worry about are the illegals, but seriously that has ALWAYS been an issue and all we can do is keep working at it. We don't need to get all bunched up over this issue like some are, it's unhealthy to be that way
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Old 12-17-2007, 05:46 PM
 
Location: Omaha
189 posts, read 158,688 times
Reputation: 32
Thanks, Kosnebbear. It has been 10 years since that heart attack, I eventually abandoned the restaurant and probably extended my life. I did not own it, it owned me.
--Ironic, all the foreign born workers at my place were Albanians. I only hired legals, but my workers had dozens of illegal friends and relatives begging for jobs. At that time, 90's the economy was strong and 'dirty jobs' went unfilled at any price. I never learned Albanian, just recognized a few cuss words. 3 years Spanish classes in HS and I can only read some, classes are not the same as 'living' and assimilating.
--One Albanian cook's wife came to US legally ('lottery') and I hired her as dishwasher. She spoke no English, for just a few weeks. The Albanian guy is the one that found me passed out in the parking lot, gave CPR AND called 911 (in English language) The Albanians have a very secretive and 'mafia' culture far worse than the sicilian or hispanic cultures thanks to years of communism, I did not know there were any in NE (my biz was in Mich)
---I once worked in Mich with a Mexican guy from Calif. A customer called, asked for him by name. He handed me the phone- could I translate? He spoke zero Spanish. His family was in CA dating to when it was part of Mexico, making him descended from 300+ years back, a la Mayflower descendents. Mexican surnames, foods, religious customs, etc. BUT noone in his family spoke Spanish- for generations. They long ago assimilated and learned English to communicate with the rest of their country.
--I had a hard time communicating when I visited Costa Rica. Not once did I 'expect' the natives to speak English. I did appreciate finding some that could! However when visiting Montreal I was treated very badly. We were lost, and could not get directions from anyone. After about 10 tries, I told my friends "we're doomed, noone around here speaks English". The same store clerk looked at us, sneered, and said "Why don't you just go back where you came from" Canada has been divided by those speaking English and French. I think it will get as bad in this country if we continue to cater to those who should be learning the native language here. Can't always blame them, merchants and P.C. types are making it easy for them to get by without learning the language.
---Bi lingual signs from stores that 'just want money" are as annoying to me as running Christmas ads the day after haloween. All about money, almost shameless. Signs on stores catering to ethnic groups with ethnic foods/wares do not annoy me at all. Especially the Spanish ones, in Spanish speaking areas. After living around Detroit, sheesh. One suburb is heavily Arabic, and the store signs sometimes have only Arabic- no need for English, that's not their customer base.
---I wonder if having casinos really would lower taxes. Did they in Iowa? Detroit now has 3 casinos, they pay almost $140 million to the city and same amount to the state. Yet both city and state are in worse financial shape than ever and are looking for MORE revenue somewhere/anywhere. If the casino revenues do lower taxes, NE sure is missing alot. About 75% of the cars I saw at casinos in CB last Sat were from NE. And probably mostly Omaha/Sarpy- I saw very few license plates with county #'s.
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Old 12-17-2007, 08:36 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Ne
884 posts, read 756,985 times
Reputation: 119
Yeah, great.

Go ahead everyone; defend Hispanic immigrants all you want while I Vomit.

There is a blatant disrespect for our culture and way of life with all the crime and unwillingness to assimilate into this country we once called great.

In case you are all blind, the only thing that is happening is that Mexicans are creating little Mexicos in all our cities.
That is social and economic. If you can’t see the danger in that you are crazy.

A little example of the respect from the Mexicans.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071217/ap_on_re_us/border_patrol_weapons (broken link)

Last edited by Steve_W; 12-17-2007 at 09:03 PM..
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Old 12-17-2007, 09:11 PM
 
Location: West Omaha
1,181 posts, read 3,646,896 times
Reputation: 477
And the germans, chinese, koreans, and irish made "little germanies", "chinatown", "korea town", and "little Ireland". Assimilate doesn't mean to completely rid oneself of your culture. Every single group of immigrants brings something to America. That is why we're great. While, yes, we must reduce and try to eliminate illegal immigration the assault on "hispanic immigrants" as a whole is without merit. Sorry, but legal Mexican immigrants have as much right come to this country as your ancestors did. That's the plain and simple of it. "THAT" is why america is great.

And your article has nothing to do with legal Hispanic immigrants. Furthermore, there are plenty of whites who are entirely disrespectful of authoritative presence.
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Old 12-18-2007, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Papillion
2,585 posts, read 9,528,705 times
Reputation: 890
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve_W View Post
In case you are all blind, the only thing that is happening is that Mexicans are creating little Mexicos in all our cities.
That is social and economic. If you can’t see the danger in that you are crazy.
Specific to the "little Mexico" and the economics comment.

There is a similiar discussion in the Omaha thread about Black vs White economics. That discussion changed a little to why one major corridor (N 24th st) in the traditionally black poor part of town has no economic development while another major corridor (S 24th st) in the tradditionally hispanic poor part of town has tons of economic development.

Both are major corridors in poor/underpriveledged areas - what's the difference. The difference is the "little Mexico" you reference. The Hispanics in that poor area are self starters and have taken care of their own. They have created businesses for the benefit of that little community. South 24th st in Omaha is a very vibrant living area because of that "little Mexico", while North 24th is just .

I will agree with you on most of your perspectives, but I can't go so far as saying "little Mexico" is all of a sudden bad. "Little Italy" in South Omaha was a similiar situation in the early-mid 20th century. A very vibrant area of first generation italians. Same with the "Little Polish" area in South Omaha.

Once first generation or two passed, those kids were assimiliated into "American" ure and started to move out. Those "little" ethnic areas then changed (or died out). Those "little" areas are part of what makes the ure vibrant and interesting.
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Old 12-18-2007, 01:55 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Ne
884 posts, read 756,985 times
Reputation: 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave1215 View Post
Specific to the "little Mexico" and the economics comment.

There is a similiar discussion in the Omaha thread about Black vs White economics. That discussion changed a little to why one major corridor (N 24th st) in the traditionally black poor part of town has no economic development while another major corridor (S 24th st) in the tradditionally hispanic poor part of town has tons of economic development.

Both are major corridors in poor/underpriveledged areas - what's the difference. The difference is the "little Mexico" you reference. The Hispanics in that poor area are self starters and have taken care of their own. They have created businesses for the benefit of that little community. South 24th st in Omaha is a very vibrant living area because of that "little Mexico", while North 24th is just .

I will agree with you on most of your perspectives, but I can't go so far as saying "little Mexico" is all of a sudden bad. "Little Italy" in South Omaha was a similiar situation in the early-mid 20th century. A very vibrant area of first generation italians. Same with the "Little Polish" area in South Omaha.

Once first generation or two passed, those kids were assimiliated into "American" ure and started to move out. Those "little" ethnic areas then changed (or died out). Those "little" areas are part of what makes the ure vibrant and interesting.
I should have been more specific.

The positive views I have for the Hispanic community’s lies with their ability as self starters and their work ethic.

This time the negatives are the massive amounts of money being shipped back to Mexico when in fact much of that money was tax free from the start.

Also, the obvious disrespect to our hometowns we grew up in and the influx of gangs and crime.

I respect the Hispanics doing what they can to make it in life and support a healthy family but it doesn't have to be at our expense nor do we have to be ok with the disrespect.
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Old 12-18-2007, 02:56 PM
 
Location: Papillion
2,585 posts, read 9,528,705 times
Reputation: 890
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve_W View Post
I should have been more specific.

The positive views I have for the Hispanic community’s lies with their ability as self starters and their work ethic.

This time the negatives are the massive amounts of money being shipped back to Mexico when in fact much of that money was tax free from the start.

Also, the obvious disrespect to our hometowns we grew up in and the influx of gangs and crime.

I respect the Hispanics doing what they can to make it in life and support a healthy family but it doesn't have to be at our expense nor do we have to be ok with the disrespect.

Tend to agree with you, so thanks for the clarification.
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