OC CA vs Dallas TX - Australian family moving from Tokyo (San Diego: rental car, rental)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
OC CA vs Dallas TX - Australian family moving from Tokyo
Hello all - I'm on the horns of a dilemma, and was hoping you all could help with information.
We are an international family - I'm South African, my wife is English, "home" is Sydney Australia and my 2 kids (4,6) were born there, but we've been living in Tokyo for the last 3 years. Quite a mix, but I'd say we are urban people who love living in/near a big city, but have been spoiled in Sydney with access to mountains, beaches, rivers, bush etc. Tokyo has been amazing in so many ways (culture, vibrancy, food, entertainment, walk/train/cycle everywhere) and still its not more than a couple of hours to get to mountains, skiing, beaches etc.
And now we've been asked to transfer to USA, and we are looking forward to a new adventure for 3+ years. Options for me to work are Dallas TX, or Irvine CA. I've checked out Dallas thoroughly as its the most likely option, and in many ways it is a great place to live. The M-Streets / Lakewood area there looks like a good mix of nice houses, good schools, enough urban activity within walking distance to keep us happy (restaurants, bars, shops). And financially it is a no-brainer - we'd probably have 20%+ disposable income compared to CA, and that would mean tripling our savings!
But TX is flat, and its a 4-hour drive to anywhere interesting.... I'm into rock climbing, surfing, swimming, sailing, cycling, outdoor life generally - and would love to be teaching my boys all these things. Socal just looks fabulous from that perspective, and I'm hugely tempted to be financially irresponsible again and come and live in Laguna Beach / Dana Point area
So go on - twist my arm Any recommendations for other places in this area (max 30 mins drive to Irvine Business Complex) where there are families living as opposed to just holiday renters? Somewhere within walking (or at least cycling) distance of an interesting "town centre" or village centre with decent shops/restaurants/entertainment? Where I can rent a 4-bed house with at least a little garden for $3500/month or so? Near the beach - view would be great... as would being able to walk or cycle to the beach before work, say... or for sundowners after work.
or warn me off! Is California really going to sink into a swamp of debt and raise income taxes to Swedish levels? Are bush-fires likely to burn us out? Am i dreaming that this is a paradise, and instead its a tourist ridden hellhole and the last "real" people left in '76?
Thanks people. My heart says CA, my head says TX - what say you?
Sounds like California would be a better fit for you and your family.
That being said Dallas isn't that far away from Hill Country which offers mountain biking and rock climbing oportunities. And of course they also have a few lakes in the area that offer boating opportunities as well.
The only advantage I can see for Dallas is that it is cheaper to live there. Otherwise, I would think OC has just about every other advantage, especially climate. (I am assuming either place is the same for you professionally.)
OC has a lot of things money can't buy. After a certain income level, the things money can't buy are worth more than the amount you save living in TX. If you rent, the cost of living gap is not as large as if you buy.
Personally if I have enough money that I can get everything I want in both cities without going into debt and still saving some money, I'd take CA. Money can't buy the seasonal produce, weather, mountains/beach, etc. that pervades the area.
or warn me off! Is California really going to sink into a swamp of debt and raise income taxes to Swedish levels? Are bush-fires likely to burn us out? Am i dreaming that this is a paradise, and instead its a tourist ridden hellhole and the last "real" people left in '76?
Thanks people. My heart says CA, my head says TX - what say you?
No, just into the ocean!
Being a native of one and having lived in the other, I say follow your heart.
You really sound like you want to come to California, but hey, go with whatever suits you. No arm-twisting since there are plenty of people already here. The info in this link may be of help, and even though Aliso Viejo is featured, much of what is said applies to just about any city in South County. Aliso just happens to be a very compact city, so everything is close by home. You may, or may not, like its density. Also, check Laguna Niguel, Rancho Santa Margarita, Las Flores, Dana Point, Mission Viejo, San Clemente and Ladera Ranch. Making the move from UK to Aliso Viejo
Hello all - I'm on the horns of a dilemma, and was hoping you all could help with information.
We are an international family - I'm South African, my wife is English, "home" is Sydney Australia and my 2 kids (4,6) were born there, but we've been living in Tokyo for the last 3 years. Quite a mix, but I'd say we are urban people who love living in/near a big city, but have been spoiled in Sydney with access to mountains, beaches, rivers, bush etc. Tokyo has been amazing in so many ways (culture, vibrancy, food, entertainment, walk/train/cycle everywhere) and still its not more than a couple of hours to get to mountains, skiing, beaches etc.
And now we've been asked to transfer to USA, and we are looking forward to a new adventure for 3+ years. Options for me to work are Dallas TX, or Irvine CA. I've checked out Dallas thoroughly as its the most likely option, and in many ways it is a great place to live. The M-Streets / Lakewood area there looks like a good mix of nice houses, good schools, enough urban activity within walking distance to keep us happy (restaurants, bars, shops). And financially it is a no-brainer - we'd probably have 20%+ disposable income compared to CA, and that would mean tripling our savings!
But TX is flat, and its a 4-hour drive to anywhere interesting.... I'm into rock climbing, surfing, swimming, sailing, cycling, outdoor life generally - and would love to be teaching my boys all these things. Socal just looks fabulous from that perspective, and I'm hugely tempted to be financially irresponsible again and come and live in Laguna Beach / Dana Point area
So go on - twist my arm Any recommendations for other places in this area (max 30 mins drive to Irvine Business Complex) where there are families living as opposed to just holiday renters? Somewhere within walking (or at least cycling) distance of an interesting "town centre" or village centre with decent shops/restaurants/entertainment? Where I can rent a 4-bed house with at least a little garden for $3500/month or so? Near the beach - view would be great... as would being able to walk or cycle to the beach before work, say... or for sundowners after work.
or warn me off! Is California really going to sink into a swamp of debt and raise income taxes to Swedish levels? Are bush-fires likely to burn us out? Am i dreaming that this is a paradise, and instead its a tourist ridden hellhole and the last "real" people left in '76?
Thanks people. My heart says CA, my head says TX - what say you?
Couple thoughts based on your post -
OC will beat DFW for outdoor opportunities any day of the week and twice on sundays. The weather is sooooooooo much better here - no Snow/Ice in the winter and no humidity in the summer. CA itself is an outdoorsman's delight - Deserts, mountains, beachs all within a 90 minute drive (tops) and, in the north, forrests and there is a thriving outdoor sports culture here.
One thing OC is not, however, is a traditional city. Think of it as one big jumbled up middle/upper middle income suburban sprawl. If you need an urban "fix" to satisy a city craving, LA is only 40 minutes away, but the whole LA/OC metro area is not a traditional "Suburbs surrounding an Urban core/Downtown" region, it is a sprawling ( in every sense of the word) jumble of urban/suburban/ rural development. As for tourists, although we get plenty, they are not a big part of daily life unless you are going somewhere they congregate like Disney or Laguna Beach. The whole LA area is pretty dense population wise ( by american standards, not Tokyo standards ) so the tourists just fade into the background. Also, Speaking of Disney, that's another thing CA also has way over DFW - Disneyland, Knotts Berry Farm, Lego Land, Sea World, etc - the list can go on and on, OC and nearby San Diego have a ton of family attractions. San Diego is 90 minutes away from OC by car and - aside from Orlando, FL - it is probably the most popular family travel destination in America. For OC families its an easy day trip. I have a 4 & 6 yo kids too, and they love all the stuff there is to do here.
You are right about costs though. EVERYTHING is more expensive in CA vs. TX. And in CA you will pay more in just about every form of taxation. But for a 3 year (-ish) stint, you can live in one of the best climates and geographies on the planet in a pretty nice suburban community for a little extra money. Given your budget and the fact you have enough skills to be employable internationally, I'm guessing you do pretty well financailly. OC is a pretty good place to live if you have the means to afford it. The cost of living IS higher, but if you can pay the price of admission it can be a really fun place to live.
As for California's fiscal woes, not to be glib, but why should you care? You'll only be here for a few years anyway, right? So what difference does it make if you live in a state with a balanced budget or not? You already know taxes are higher here and you can insulate yourself from the worst of the impact by picking an area with good schools that will continue to be good regradless of state funding. Kind of like wondering if your rental car has rustproofing on the chasis.
Your budget gives you lots of housing options. You can choose Irvine itself. Great schools, tons of parks for the kids, biking/running trails for you, 20 minutes to the beach and in the center of OC. Mission Viejo is a popular bedroom community that is very family oriented and has really good schools as well. Same for Aliso Viejo and Laguna Niguel. Lastly Laguna and Newport Beach are more expensive and have some other pluses and minuses, but both are within 30 minutes of the IBC, you can live close to the beach and each have good schools.
pacific2, thanks for the advice on places and interesting link - appreciated.
OC Investor 2 - thanks for taking the time to make such a detailed and well reasoned post. You are quite right, as a 3-year visitor I don't have to stress too much about the long-term future of the state, and simply need to make sure the city & schools where I am are well structured / funded. And you have certainly added to the positive impression I have of the area as a place to live with kids. Thanks also for the recommendation of places to check out further.
I think it really will come down to a straight choice between enjoying the lifestyle we really want to live in CA at a higher cost, or living a decent but somewhat bland life in TX and saving a chunk of money.
Thanks all, you have helped me clarify a few things. I hope to be able to come out in the next few months to have a look at both areas.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $53,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
) so the tourists just fade into the background. Also, Speaking of Disney, that's another thing CA also has way over DFW - Disneyland, Knotts Berry Farm, Lego Land, Sea World, etc - the list can go on and on, OC and nearby San Diego have a ton of family attractions. San Diego is 90 minutes away from OC by car and - aside from Orlando, FL - it is probably the most popular family travel destination in America. For OC families its an easy day trip. I have a 4 & 6 yo kids too, and they love all the stuff there is to do here. 
