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Old 02-16-2014, 09:29 PM
 
Location: Aliso Viejo, Orange County, CA
4,941 posts, read 6,331,448 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuvSouthOC View Post
Thank you!
You're welcome, but all thanks to Fontucky!
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Old 02-16-2014, 09:49 PM
Status: "Stand with Hong Kong" (set 4 days ago)
 
Location: Laguna Niguel, Orange County CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pacific2 View Post
You're welcome, but all thanks to Fontucky!
Yeah, agreed!
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Old 02-16-2014, 09:55 PM
 
Location: Aliso Viejo, Orange County, CA
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Aliso Viejo means Old Alder (tree).

Interesting find on Alder from Wiki:

Middle English alder, aller, from Old English alor, from Proto-Germanic *aluz, *alusō (compare Swedish al, East Frisian šllerboom), variant of *alizō, *alisō (compare Dutch els, German Erle), from Proto-Indo-European *h₂ťlisos (compare Hittite alanza(n), Latin alnus, Latvian ŗlksnis, Polish olcha, Albanian halŽ 'black pine', Ancient Macedonian (Hesychius) άλιχα (Šlicha, “white poplar”)

alder - Wiktionary
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Old 02-16-2014, 10:26 PM
 
Location: GLAMA
16,584 posts, read 33,672,984 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuvSouthOC View Post
Thank you!

I have a question: Where was the town of Native American town of Niguel in Laguna Niguel? I have searched and searched and am guessing it was near Aliso Creek, probably somewhere near where that lake is today. Does anyone know?
Well, that lake wasn't there until the mid-sixties, so it wouldn't have done the Indians any good. My guess would be near Aliso Creek below where Wood Canyon flows into it. That would put them downstream of two good-sized tributaries to an already major source of water that used to see huge steelhead trout runs every year. So look for sources of delicious fish, reliable water, and plenty of oak trees for acorns and you'll find the village sites.
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Old 02-16-2014, 10:33 PM
 
Location: Aliso Viejo, Orange County, CA
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Speaking of Wood Canyon, there are petroglyphs and fossils in some of the caves there.
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Old 02-17-2014, 12:16 AM
 
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From Wikipedia:

"Even so, some 70 major archaeological sites have been discovered along the creek, and it is believed that there was once an Acjachemen Indian village near the confluence of Aliso Creek and Sulphur Creek, named Niguili, which means 'a large spring' in the native LuiseŮo dialect. The spring still exists near the intersection of Alicia Parkway and Highlands Road in present-day Laguna Niguel, about a mile (1.6) km east of Aliso Creek's confluence with Sulphur Creek."

This also:

"Located to the southwest of Aliso Creek, Sulphur Creek historically lay in the territory of the Acjachemen Indian group, whose main population center was actually farther south, at the confluence of San Juan and Trabuco creeks. A nearby village, Niguili, was located near the mouth of Aliso Creek likely near the confluence of Aliso and Sulphur Creeks."

Further searches led me to a book that states:

"A place called Niguili by the Indians is mentioned in Boscana's Chinigchinich before 1831 . . . " Link to the book:

California Place Names: The Origin and Etymology of Current Geographical Names - Erwin Gustav Gudde - Google Books

I then found Boscana's Chinigchinich online, which contained this info (mission referred to is San Juan Capistrano):

"After travelling southwardly seven or eight leagues, or more, they arrived at a place called "Niguiti," which is situated half a league only, N.E. from the mission. Here, they discovered a spring of fresh water, and from the favorable appearance of the neighboring country, they concluded that it was a place well adapted to the founding of a new colony. As soon as the erecting of their habitations was completed, and order had been established, the chief returned to "Sejat," leaving behind, his daughter "Coronne."

This passage can be found starting at the bottom of page 64 in the link below:

http://3rocks.org/publications/Chinigchinich.pdf

Note that in the two online versions of Chinigchinich I found, both referred to the settlement as "Niguiti" rather than "Niguili".

Finally, this map shows the area of the confluence of Aliso and Sulphur Creeks, which is, as LuvSouthOC said, just west of Sulphur Creek Reservoir:

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=33.55...t=h&gl=us&z=18
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Old 02-17-2014, 08:57 AM
Status: "Stand with Hong Kong" (set 4 days ago)
 
Location: Laguna Niguel, Orange County CA
9,753 posts, read 7,636,858 times
Reputation: 7752
That's an interesting reference re Niguiti being a league away from the Mission, then NE. Hmmm.

THat is excellent work CS. I am appalled that there are no markers or plaques or anything delineating the former village's border site. It is a reminder of how we tried to pretend these people never existed. It is possible that many died and the village gradually became uninhabited, but one would still expect some reverence in the form of at least a small monument or something. It is not too late to do this even if we cannot do it on private land. We could still do it in the park there.

Last edited by LuvSouthOC; 02-17-2014 at 09:20 AM..
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Old 02-17-2014, 09:04 AM
Status: "Stand with Hong Kong" (set 4 days ago)
 
Location: Laguna Niguel, Orange County CA
9,753 posts, read 7,636,858 times
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Attention any OC history buffs out there, there is an old (1989) video made by KCET titled "The Story of Orange County" that is found on Ytube and is broken into sections. The first part can be found here.
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Old 02-17-2014, 09:05 AM
 
Location: Aliso Viejo, Orange County, CA
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That's pretty fascinating stuff, C2ShiningC. I agree with LuvSouthOC, I don't understand why there are no markers. OC really needs to educate folks, and preserve its history.



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Old 02-17-2014, 12:02 PM
 
1,369 posts, read 1,767,392 times
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I agree with you both. A plaque in the park is a good idea - time to hit up your City Council.
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