income in south OC (Irvine, Orange: low income, transplants, real estate market)

[k374]

i'm trying to estimate household income in south OC (Irvine, Aliso Viejo, Laguna Niguel, Mission Viejo), based on talking to many here is what I came up with:

low income - $130k/yr or less (each making $65k/yr)
middle income - $130k/yr - $220k/yr
high income - $220k/yr+

what is your assessment of the above?

[EscapeCalifornia]

$130k is hardly "low income". Remember there's plenty of people who rent or bought before the bubble and don't need big bucks to afford to live there. According to City Data, Irvine's median household income in 2005 was just short of $83k.

[NaplesRes]

There is a lot of pressure in south oc to look wealthy. The vast majority of the area is middle class, they just live over their means. The average income is probably about 75k-85k.

[k374]

Originally Posted by NaplesRes

There is a lot of pressure in south oc to look wealthy. The vast majority of the area is middle class, they just live over their means. The average income is probably about 75k-85k.

is that $75-85k per head? So $150k-170k total per household?

I'm going by the assumption that in the better parts of OC (i.e. South OC), most households are dual income and both working professionals. The average income for entry level graduates is around $65k so I took that as the entry level per head arriving at the $130k figure. A few years experience most professionals make $100k plus bonuses could put them at $110-120k/yr each, even if you assume $85-90k each after a few years that puts the figure at $150-$200k or so for middle class.

[BRinSM]

Originally Posted by k374

The average income for entry level graduates is around $65k

maybe if you have a master's degree. most people i know fresh out of college with a 4 year degree got jobs that paid around $40k/year, myself included. I've been working full time for nearly 4 years now and I'm still not making $65k and neither are nearly all my friends who are my age. the only person I know my age that is doing better than $65k is a firefighter.

IMO, low income in OC or anywhere in southern CA for that matter is probably under $75k per household. middle income is probably from $75-$125k and high income is in excess of $125k. The reason I used $125k at the minimum for high income is because that is about the absolute least amount you need to make to afford a detached home in a decent neighborhood in OC.

[missionhome]

Here are the median family incomes according to CNN's Best Places for the south Orange County cities (lets say Irvine south). I would give you household income numbers, but the statistics from many south OC cities go all the way back to 1999 due to some cities like Aliso Viejo being so new and have not been adjusted for inflation. The household income is usually a bit less than the median family income.

Coto de Caza: $162,065
Laguna Beach: $122,966
Foothill Ranch (now a neighborhood of Lake Forest): $114,138
Laguna Niguel: $108,455
Rancho Santa Margarita: $103,028
Mission Viejo: $102,701
Irvine: $101,564
San Clemente: $91,372
Aliso Viejo: $96,852
Laguna Hills: $94,763
Lake Forest: $87,398
Dana Point: $85,522
San Juan Capistrano: $81,889

As you can see, the area is not super wealthy. The vast majority of families are middle class in the area and most people bought their homes before a 3,000 square foot home cost over a million bucks. There are of course pockets of wealth and communities where there are people with bug bucks like Los Ranchos Estates in Coto de Caza, Nellie Gail in Laguna Hills, or Ritz Cove in Dana Point. Then there are the people in foreclosure who were living beyond their means. My neighbor three doors up the street is a prime example. They moved in with an elitist attitude and had the typical "I need to one up you attitude." They drive a Mercedes S class and Cadillac Escalade (with no plates still and it has been two years), go on vacation to Hawaii, send their kids to private school, etc... Well, now that the real estate market has taken a tumble, they owe $3,400 in association dues, are being foreclosed on by the bank, had the bank take the Escalade because they weren't paying their lease, and are begging for financial aid so their kids can go to private school again next year. They have no clue where they will go once the house is taken either. They might be moving to a condo in the Inland Empire until they can get their finances in order. This is the typical story now for the many people living beyond their means.

[sfaok]

My parents bought their Irvine house in 1984 before the crazy housing prices. Their highest level of education is High School and combined they make around 90k-100k (mostly due to my dad's high seniority in a union job) which definitely would go against people's stereotypes of what a typical Irvine family is like. Today, I would say half of the residents in my parent's neighborhood fit that bill while the Generation X couples and transplants to CA are mostly college educated professionals.

People that have only lived in OC since the late 1980s or those that are younger don't seem to realize that places like Irvine and large portions of South OC back in the mid 1980s and earlier were considered the boonies; thus, the housing prices were much more affordable for a middle class or working class family. Once Irvine began to develop the Spectrum area and South OC built numerous office parks and other office buildings, more employees came into the area which contributed to the greater demand for housing in South OC. When you add into the equation white flight to south OC and the fact that seemingly everyone and their mother wants to move to Southern CA, you have a recipe for expensive housing.

Luckily for my parents and other baby boomers, they lived in the right era and bought at the right time.

[Coldjensens]

Actually, the median incomes set out in the prior post are super wealthy income levels. Remember, that is the MEDIAN income which factors in retired people on limited fixed incomes, immigrants living in apartments, etc. If you consider that some of these people make less than $40,000/year, the numbers set out for the average are very high. Compare those numbers to median incomes in other parts of the country.

[shiksa]

Does this mean that if I make 35,000 a year and my daughter makes half that, we wouldn't be able to make it in Orange County? We visit there twice a year and I don't see a lot of rich people who seem to be making it just fine. I never undertand what people mean when they say you can't live in OC for less than 60,000 or more a year. My power bill in AZ in over $200 a month, water and trash $50 and mortgage $1,300 and our gas is not much cheaper than yours (right now about $4.40 to 4.70 per gal). Does anyones power bill ever actually get up to $200 there?

[missionhome]

^^^^^
Good luck finding a $1,300 mortgage. That is what kills people. That rents a small one bedroom apartment. You could not own a home for $1,300 per month.