Using a realtor to buy a new home (mortgage broker, lawyer)

[cfIfan]

Originally Posted by runswithscissors

Well, lets be fair, the real estate agents were really helpful in the past few years making everyone's dream come true. Owning a home for everyone, and the bigger the better and it's ok if it's gonna adjust in 3 years cuz you're gonna be making ALOT more money then, right? .....Low or no money down, ARMS, creative financing, optional rate payments where your INTEREST goes on the back end (my personal favorite)....and just because we're in good with the builder and financier they can even give you a HELOC so you can pull all your equity out all the time for shoes and vacations. ....I'm glad there's a Realtor Code of Ethics or we'd be in a big mess right now.

Attorneys may be common place in other states, but apart from contract issues, im not sure how you think an attorney can help you in the build process. Im from the UK originally and studied law for 4 years, then went into conveyencing and finally studied real estate for 3 years which goes far deeper than this countries qualification, and covers building process's etc etc.

I never realized an attorney could walk around the building site and point out what had or hadnt been built to spec.

I think any rational buyer knows that attorneys are pencil pushers who you pay regardless whether your property sells. Realtors give their product knowledge of areas ,builders and the market to buyers and sellers for free. We only make money if the transaction goes through.

Heck, ill charge my fees up front to you if that eases your concern that my interested is vested in the sale going through....lol

[DailyJournalist]

Originally Posted by cfIfan

Attorneys may be common place in other states, but apart from contract issues, im not sure how you think an attorney can help you in the build process. Im from the UK originally and studied law for 4 years, then went into conveyencing and finally studied real estate for 3 years which goes far deeper than this countries qualification, and covers building process's etc etc.

I never realized an attorney could walk around the building site and point out what had or hadnt been built to spec.

I think any rational buyer knows that attorneys are pencil pushers who you pay regardless whether your property sells. Realtors give their product knowledge of areas ,builders and the market to buyers and sellers for free. We only make money if the transaction goes through.

Heck, ill charge my fees up front to you if that eases your concern that my interested is vested in the sale going through....lol

A Realtor is not qualified to walk you through a building site or to advice you on legal matters. An attorney is the only person that can accurately decipher legal issues because he or she is licenced to do so. A property inspector is the only one that is qualified to walk a person through a build site because they are licensed to do so. A realtor is a licensed sales person, no different than a insurance agent or other licensed sales person. Realtors in Florida over step their boundaries.

[runswithscissors]

Originally Posted by cfIfan

Attorneys may be common place in other states, but apart from contract issues, im not sure how you think an attorney can help you in the build process. Im from the UK originally and studied law for 4 years, then went into conveyencing and finally studied real estate for 3 years which goes far deeper than this countries qualification, and covers building process's etc etc.

I never realized an attorney could walk around the building site and point out what had or hadnt been built to spec.

I think any rational buyer knows that attorneys are pencil pushers who you pay regardless whether your property sells. Realtors give their product knowledge of areas ,builders and the market to buyers and sellers for free. We only make money if the transaction goes through.

Heck, ill charge my fees up front to you if that eases your concern that my interested is vested in the sale going through....lol

Thank you for your realtor's point of view it's quite illustrative. Whereas, you apparently didn't really read what I wrote.

Did they teach caveat emptor over in law school? And studying law for 4 years is meaningless, sorry, that's a student and with no real world experience.

im not sure how you think an attorney can help you in the build process.

I wrote that my lawyer would ensure the contract was written properly (to MY needs) with recourse.

Did you even see what I wrote about my neighbor who ended up getting his number 1 lottery lot being the worst property in the neighborhood.

This would never have happened to me. I have real estate buying experience and my contract would have been written such that the lot specs would have been quite clear. It has happened to me before so it's obvious.

I never realized an attorney could walk around the building site and point out what had or hadnt been built to spec.

I wrote that my lawyer would ensure the contract was written so that my INSPECTOR would ensure the house was to spec and properly delivered to contract with recourse.

I think any rational buyer knows that attorneys are pencil pushers who you pay regardless whether your property sells.

- Rational buyer? OH, like all the rational and highly informed buyers that have bought over the past few years with their trusty real estate experts guiding their every move?

- regardless whether your property sells? Who is talking about selling property? We are talking about buying a new construction specifically before it's even built (or even after for that matter).

Realtors give their product knowledge of areas ,builders and the market to buyers and sellers for free. We only make money if the transaction goes through.

Yes, exactly, thank you so much for making my point. The knowledge and expertise (like the past few years)....

For free? LOL, like all salespeople do before closing the consumer in on the sale

WE ONLY MAKE MONEY IF THE TRANSACTION GOES THROUGH!

YEP, whereas, you only make money if the transaction goes through, it defies logic that you would spend any time whatsoever pointing out any errors in any step of the process, particularly at the end when the house is "finished" and ESPECIALLY when sitting at the closing. Like an agent is going to "invest" all their "free" time getting the buyer to the closing and make waves?

Heck, ill charge my fees up front to you if that eases your concern that my interested is vested in the sale going through....lol

Millions of homes have been sold for decades and decades from builders all over the USA without any false security requirement of the buyer needing a middleman. Lawyer, yes it's preposterous to pretend that lawyers are not used since those of us who moved here or part time here know better. IMHO, Florida realtors have just found another way to find a niche income, waltzing people around from neighborhood to neighborhood when they are not familiar with the area.

Fine, charge a consulting fee and be done with it. But don't pretend to be acting in the buyers best interest "against" a builder and ESPECIALLY don't be promising the buyer any "closing table" value.

Further, it is not just a matter of the build process, you are ignoring the entire HOA situation here in FL which several citizens can explain to the new buyer is a potential make or break scenario. AS WELL as the builder shutting down the job prematurely and other such disasters.

Just yesterday I was at a development that was discussed on here, Ameritrend (?). No ground broken. Lovely samples.

The immediate neighboring development was shut down and there are exactly 2 streets built and a couple of random homes standing all alone among the weeds far away in the middle of nothing. Unfinished roads, standing water, trash, no barrier of wall.....I'd have to be a complete fool to buy in Ameritrend next to that mess.

Wonder how those residents feel about their great new home purchase.HA! And we're going to "trust the builder and sales person, real estate agent".

Since the axiom caveat emptor applies, one would be better served to employ the ACTUAL LEGAL knowledge and procedural expertise of an attorney BEFORE the mistake is made not AFTER, which as all lawyers know, is exactly the opposite of what people do. They all go running to any old lawyer AFTER they are in a mess.

I find it quite disturbing that any real estate agent especially in this market would suggest that a lawyer would not be in the best interest of any buyer. Disturbing but not surprising.

[runswithscissors]

BTW, we tort lovers are big on RECOURSE over here.

Something that millions of homeowners in the USA are lacking and I guarantee you most of them did not review their undertakings with a qualified if ANY attorney.

[runswithscissors]

I'm sitting here in shock still LOLOL Like FLORDIA PEOPLE should buy a home from a builder from a PLAN even, and NOT have a lawyer to get recourse in the contract if the builder fails to deliver.

This is just like the other wierd Florida real estate procedure of using a realtor to put a tenant in a property and they walk away after the lease is signed.

This is unheard of where I come from. The agent either MANAGES the property or is not involved. This explains why my kid was guided to so many bad rentals over the years. NO RECOURSE. Broken appliances even the fridge, mold, even a garage that was locked that nobody "COULD" find the key for so he didnt have access to his own garage for 4 months, and finally a forclosure notice in month 9. All leases facilitated by realtors.



Boggles the mind.

[cfIfan]

I think it is obvious from your comments that you are highly ANTI Realtors as that is what comes across in your posts. HMMM Caveat Emptor......buyer beware.

I would suggest you google what a conveyancer does because you are misinformed. I trained at law school for 4 years and then specialized in conveyencing. I could have specialized in criminal law had i wanted to but chose not to. On the side i studied Real Estate over 3 years to give myself a complete understanding from all aspects just for fun. In the UK are education requirements are much stricter than those you have here and i suggest before you comment on them you do some research.

I AM qualified to draw up contracts, in building codes and building practices and so when i see an inspectors report i can interpret and convey clients concerns.

I suggest before making large sweeping statements about realtors in general you do your homework and not assume we all just took part in a 72hr class.

[runswithscissors]

marypoppins, do yourself a favor and buy a home that is already built, in a neighborhood that is already built, get a home inspector that is HIGHLY RECOMMENDED BY SEVERAL PEOPLE (another challenge here) and use a lawyer for your transaction. Further, if there is an HOA, get a condo (or other HOA expert) attorney to review the HOA docs especially (in part) before there is a hurricane and your are assessed thousands or worse, if it is a condo property, you have to move out and are homeless for years because of the instability of the HOA. This is the case in one assoc in Broward that I know of and I'm sure it's not unique. Here in Vero there was a mess of a situation too, with a condo development and they are not yet recovered and made whole, repairs are still going on and the golf course is unusable / or has been until lately. Still doesnt look so great to me, a non golfer.

[runswithscissors]

Originally Posted by cfIfan

I think it is obvious from your comments that you are highly ANTI Realtors as that is what comes across in your posts. HMMM Caveat Emptor......buyer beware.

I would suggest you google what a conveyancer does because you are misinformed. I trained at law school for 4 years and then specialized in conveyencing. I could have specialized in criminal law had i wanted to but chose not to. On the side i studied Real Estate over 3 years to give myself a complete understanding from all aspects just for fun. In the UK are education requirements are much stricter than those you have here and i suggest before you comment on them you do some research.

I AM qualified to draw up contracts, in building codes and building practices and so when i see an inspectors report i can interpret and convey clients concerns.

I suggest before making large sweeping statements about realtors in general you do your homework and not assume we all just took part in a 72hr class.

I am only anti realtor when you guys make promises to citizens that are contrary to my experience and knowledge.

Sorry, until you are a member of the bar, you are not licensed to represent me in court and therefore your lifetime experiences are moot.

FURTHER, even licensed attorneys are not all qualified to represent real estate transactions nor would they, they would refer the client to a colleague.

If you are a licensed realtor in the state of Florida and portraying yourself as being "qualified to draw up contracts, in building codes and building practices" then I assume that declaration is legal.

However, you neither qualified nor legally licensed to advise me what my legal recourse is in the event of my dissatisfaction during any point in the process, and for THAT a consumer is a fool to not consult and employ an attorney.

You said so yourself you are qualified to convey clients concerns. Thanks, that's helpful but not what we're going for LOL

I am not in the least bit interested in buying from a builder, but I am interested in helping people not make the same mistakes as have been made in the past by myself and others.

[GregTraub]

runswithscissors: Have you had a bad experience with a realtor in the past....because seriously you have been spouting some of the most anti-realtor propaganda I've heard on this board. And for what reason...thinking you can get more off the price of a house if you didn't?

And it's quite obvious you never READ MY POSTS. Never did I say to never use a lawyer when dealing with anything involving the law. I encourage their use if something comes up.

"3. "with only the assistance of a representative of the party your purchasing from...someone that's only interest is that of the builder?"

I don't quite understand this. Are you saying you have no financial interest in the sales and closing process going smoothly? I mean, you're getting paid to get the buyer to put out money to the builder right? I don't see really that your interest is any different than any seller, nothing personal or anything. REaltors want the people to buy the house as much as builders do."

Don't put words in my mouth. Of course I have a financial interest in the house closing, everyone knows this. So what are you saying??? Are you saying that every Realtor is out to get you? By your reasoning an attorney should purposely be trying to cause problems in the transaction so they can bill you more hours.
I can't tell you how many times I've advised my clients to NOT buy in a certain community, especially when I see the builder offer well over standard commissions.....dead give away for over priced product. If I where as much of a low life as you say I am I'd be selling those things like hot cakes all day! I took an oath to serve the interests of MY CLIENTS and I have a legal obligation to do so as well.There's a reason Realtors have been around for well over 100 years and will be around doing what we do for some time to come.

You keep mentioning some person that purchased a home back during the boom in a lottery as your poster child. We know he didn't use an attorney, did the guy even use a Realtor? And if so, do you think that "Realtor" is still in the business today or did he just hire a person only in it for the short term, as many agents back then where. I'm willing to guess he didn't use anyones help in the transaction.

I liked your mention of you showing up to the closing table and your promised interest rate being different. I've heard this is pretty common, and I'm glad to hear you had your attorney handle the situation, that's exactly what they are there for. Attorney's are there to fix things that go wrong. Realtors are there to make sure things don't go wrong in the first place. If you where my client, One I'd have had you approved with a reputable lender with their loan ready to go in case a builders lender pulled somthing like that. And two, you would have most likely known all this before you wasted your time going to the closing table.

But in any event, debating with people so totally against something is pointless, most only read/listen to find fodder for their next speach, never to actually take in another point of view. So I leave the above food for thought. I don't plan on being drug into a debate, my time is more important elsewhere.

[runswithscissors]

BTW, cfIfan, any legal "experience" in any other country is irrelevant here, just like any LICENSED ATTORNEY can only practice state law in the state where they have been licensed.

If you are wanting service in another state you must hire an attorney licensed in that state to serve the party.

It has nothing to do with education or "experience" it has everything to do with being licensed in the state as to have knowledge of that state's statutes, rules of law governing dealing with the courts and that state's case law.

Expecting a realtor to be your pseudo-attorney is worse than being pro se. At least pro se you confuse yourself, and aren't misunderstanding your rights and RECOURSE because someone told you something.