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do you have any links, or books to suggest? i really am interested in learning about this, but most of what i know about it is just the ideas in the OP (which I really enjoy).
There really is not a lot out there written about true shamanism, mainly because we have never put anything down in writing, it is usually passed on from one generation to the next by word of mouth, that's why we are teachers, we teach the next generation, however, if you have a local bookstore you can go into what they call their metaphysical section, and you may find something there that will give you an elementary idea of what our culture is about, but my advice to you is that if you are really serious about this, find a community of local native people and take the time to get to know them, this is not a short-term experience, you will have to take the time to get to know them and they will have to get to know you, so be patient, it will not be easy, but in the end it can be very rewarding. Take the time to experience the journey. osay
we may both believe in God but the aspects that we believe may be different.
My Brother, There is no difference, it's the same Creator, just a different title, you have been taught different aspects about him, just as we have been taught different aspects about him, and yet basically they are all the same, treat each other with respect, help one another out, and work together for all of us, it makes no difference what title you give him, he is still the Creator of us all, we are all the same, and we all need to learn to get along with each other. osay
My Brother, There is no difference, it's the same Creator, just a different title, you have been taught different aspects about him, just as we have been taught different aspects about him, and yet basically they are all the same, treat each other with respect, help one another out, and work together for all of us, it makes no difference what title you give him, he is still the Creator of us all, we are all the same, and we all need to learn to get along with each other. osay
hmmm sorry that I do not agree with that.
Mine bible says that we christians believe it God breath his own word that jesus is the only path to God. does your god preach this?
What are your feelings on spirit animals/ totems (is there a difference or just a difference in terms?)? That's the one spiritual aspect of really anything that I strongly believe in and have personally experienced.
My dad was raised pretty well integrated in Native traditions. By blood he'd only about 1/8 native but since he's missing 3/4 of his heritage (never knew anything about his father/ father's family or maternal grandfather), the 1/4 portion of his ancestry was half a mix of Penobscot and Nipmuk tribes. We forage for food more than the average family. :P
Mine bible says that we christians believe it God breath his own word that jesus is the only path to God. does your god preach this?
just an example
Hopefully, this thread will not turn into a "I am a christian and I believe ...", with the ensuing flood of christian rhetoric and scripture quotes.
Our belief is simple. Let's put it into simple terms.
Great Spirit big and powerful.
Great Spirit create all life and Sun like father, without sun-no life, Mother Earth feed us.
Great Spirit give plenty food, water, and game to hunt.
Great Spirit provide place for Red Man when him die.
You go now, read'um Bible, no makem war of words on Shaman thread.
Great Spirit say, you stay, eat with us, be brother to Red Man.
If your Bible, actually, it is The Bible, teaches that God created Jesus as his Son, that is fine, great, we are happy you shared that with us. We accept that just as we accept the Hindus, Muslims, the Wiccan, the genie in the lamp as beliefs. We just shrug and say okay, cool.
The fundamental difference is you will never hear an Indian say all other beliefs are pagan or whatever and/or we have the ONLY ticket to heaven, which is what christians do.
Before the Christ was born, there were beliefs held by the indigenous people of this continent. The Great Spirit was here long before we humans were here and surely He will be here long after we are dust.
Last edited by _redbird_; 01-06-2008 at 01:34 AM..
Hopefully, this thread will not turn into a "I am a christian and I believe ...", with the ensuing flood of christian rhetoric and scripture quotes.
Our belief is simple. Let's put it into simple terms.
Great Spirit big and powerful.
Great Spirit create all life and Sun like father, without sun-no life, Mother Earth feed us.
Great Spirit give plenty food, water, and game to hunt.
Great Spirit provide place for Red Man when him die.
You go now, read'um Bible, no makem war of words on Shaman thread.
Great Spirit say, you stay, eat with us, be brother to Red Man.
If your Bible, actually, it is The Bible, teaches that God created Jesus as his Son, that is fine, great, we are happy you shared that with us. We accept that just as we accept the Hindus, Muslims, the Wiccan, the genie in the lamp as beliefs. We just shrug and say okay, cool.
The fundamental difference is you will never hear an Indian say all other beliefs are pagan or whatever and/or we have the ONLY ticket to heaven, which is what christians do.
Before the Christ was born, there were beliefs held by the indigenous people of this continent. The Great Spirit was here long before we humans were here and surely He will be here long after we are dust.
Red bird, you inspired me, so here goes......and before I go off on one of my deep thoughts, thank you Redbird for your post.
Here goes.....
Sheesh, I honestly and with all my heart and soul wish, that those who read the Bible would keep it to themselves and stop trying to make, let me repeat that, MAKE everyone else THINK, that b/c they don't believe that way they are no good.
The world is made up of many religions and I really hate to say this, but there is not one religion on this earth that is true...or free from man made rules. We are so primitive in our thinking and if it wouldn't BE for Religion, I believe we'd be so much further along, but people actually kill other people over religions...insane...simply, insane...and people who claim to be Christains, get so confounded upset, and controlling if someone else doesn't believe like they do.
And then all the quoting the Bible starts....I'm sorry, but people should believe in what they feel is good for them...and you all have your little churches to go to and attend where there are others who believe like you do, so, what more should you need? That is the question....Religions should be a personal committment between you and your personal doctrine...Period and you shouldn't shake your head, or raise your eyebrows as if your doctine is better then anyone elses because truth be told, you are not.
If you want to be a good working Christain, then live your life by example and stop putting yourself above anyone else, as if they are a disease.
My goodness, if you look back in history and see how nuts those who claimed to live by the Bible were, they actually burned others at the stake, b/c they had free will and colored outside the lines of Christianity and asked questions that the priests and/or cleargymen could not answer.
Men are men...that's it....they are not Gods....and they are the ones who invented the Bible....and if the Bible works for you, then so be it...great...
Fear...you argue b/c you are not confident in your faith enough to simply allow someone else their beliefs...there is always someone who needs to force their ideas of what religion should be down someone else's throats...
I'm sorry I mean no offense, but it is true...if we were all confident in our love for God, we wouldn't be discussing this issue or trying to prove that someone else's idea is wrong by quoting verses? Rigtht. I believe the question we should ask ourselves is why do we do that...why do we fear anyone elses theroy? It really isn't that important.
If the American Indian believes in their Gods, so be it. If the Baptisys, Jehova Witnesses, Presbetyians, Lutherns, Catholics, whatever, believe, then that is your personal conviction to yourself and God and it doesn't matter if anyone else believes or not, and if your so bound and determined to convince others, then I say, you are not confident in your belief. Otherwise, you'd simply smile and ALLOW others to be who and what they believe.
This comment is not meant to insult anyone, it is though, just my thoughts.
I've seen way to many people die, for the sake of religion and enough is enough, or should be.
It is a shame we can't all get along and just simply allow others to go thru, what they need to go through to get to the end of their lives....
We've got to stop making personal classes for ourselves and stop thinking that our religion is THE religion, it is not.
oh, and Redbird, I quoted you b/c I like what you have to say....
The American Indian was doing fine, until the white man came and forced HIS beliefs on America's people and killed them off b/c they wanted to live in peace, hunt, fish and provide for their families....
all in the name of religion. That is the first thing man uses, is....they are heathens....sheesh??????
And we haven't learned....the moment some stupid movie comes out, someone is out there screaming, "NO FAIR", like some maniac...why, for what...it's a stupid movie and if people want to see it, so what? Its not going to make or break anyone, period. But controlling people think they need to ban these things...Ban cigerretts, when there are all kinds of things leaching in and out of the ground which are natural...then, adding insult to injury, man inserts chemicals in all our foods, which are cancer causing agents...then, man starts getting cancer and all kinds of other diseases and they think by banning cigerettes its going to keep people from getting cancer....your drinking water with chemicals, breathing air with chemicals...and this is just one example of how uneducated man really is...and how religion stagnates b/c we all believe God is going to come down and perform some miracle and make everything all right...that is our fear....and it drives us to kill others over it....fear is very very dangerous....and if anyone of us, really loved Christ and God, we wouldn't be having this conversation, it wouldn't be necessary, it would in fact be moot, wouldn't it.
Do you think, all those people who were on the search and rescue teams at ground zero that day cared about what religion or race everyone was...no, at the time, everyone involved were human beings...as it should be. And that is the way it should be, every day of our lives.
Just my thoughts
hugs
Creme
Last edited by cremebrulee; 01-06-2008 at 06:31 AM..
Redbird and Creme..Thank you, you have just presented me with a Sunday morning sermon that touches me deeply..You show so beautifully that God/great Spirit is not complicated. He created everything for us to sustain ourselves with and wants us to be in touch with the things he provided us with and to respect and replenish the creation..He does not want us to criticize, hate and cause fear in our brothers and sisters, because He loves us all and created us to enjoy and respect each other..People have forever known that there was a God, a creator, a great spirit or any other name..He put His spirit in us at the creation and it has been passed finally to us..My final word is that Gods word is written in our very heart and soul, He allows us a personal relationship that allows us to seek and find our peace with Him..
Oh I love this thread. Thank you for starting it. As a Celtic Pagan since birth (though I did have to attend a school run by religious, until I was 14 years old -- law of the land here -- Ireland) I feel the peace and harmony here that is missing from some other threads, with no one here 'fencing' with written scripture.
Quote:
1) Treat the Earth and all that dwell thereon with respect.
2) Remain close to the Great Spirit.
3) Show great respect for your fellow beings.
4) Worked together for the benefit of all Mankind.
5) Give assistance and kindness whenever needed.
6) Do what you know to be right.
7) Look after the well being of mind and body.
8) Dedicate a share of your efforts to the greater good.
9) Be truthful and honest at all times.
10) Take full responsibility for your actions.
Although the actual wording may differ slightly, this too is how we live.
Redbird and Creme..Thank you, you have just presented me with a Sunday morning sermon that touches me deeply..You show so beautifully that God/great Spirit is not complicated. He created everything for us to sustain ourselves with and wants us to be in touch with the things he provided us with and to respect and replenish the creation..He does not want us to criticize, hate and cause fear in our brothers and sisters, because He loves us all and created us to enjoy and respect each other..People have forever known that there was a God, a creator, a great spirit or any other name..He put His spirit in us at the creation and it has been passed finally to us..My final word is that Gods word is written in our very heart and soul, He allows us a personal relationship that allows us to seek and find our peace with Him..
My Brother, There is no difference, it's the same Creator, just a different title, you have been taught different aspects about him, just as we have been taught different aspects about him, and yet basically they are all the same, treat each other with respect, help one another out, and work together for all of us, it makes no difference what title you give him, he is still the Creator of us all, we are all the same, and we all need to learn to get along with each other. osay
Thank you, ptsum. I enjoy all of your posts. Could you tell me please what "osay" means?
May we all be blessed...
weather...
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