Advice for a parent of a gifted child who is acting up in school. (legally, support)

[Jennibc]

Originally Posted by malamute

True - but the gifted child is probably day dreaming more than disrupting the class. The 8 year old who is pondering whether the blades of the helicopter should go clockwise or counterclockwise in regards to the side of the equator it's on for the most efficiency and then doesn't know what the assignment given was about.

A kid disrupting the class may be bored but more likely is not mature enough for the class he's in. Or he's bored and disruptive because he's not catching on.

It goes both ways. Some kids that are tremendously high IQ can be disruptive because they are seeking stimulation. My son has a friend, who is very very bright (they were in a special class together) and he regularly gets in trouble for disruption. A lot of truly gifted kids are like that. They get so excited that they blurt out answers, they cut off people talking because they are anticipating what others are going to say, etc.

[h886]

Originally Posted by gentlearts

I mention the child is gifted because I think it manifests itself in the child being more aware of things like fairness and how other kids should follow the rules, etc. He is in public school, and the school wanted him to skip first grade, but the parents said no, due to maturity issues. It's not a case where everyone thinks their kid is gifted. The kid is gifted. There are no special classes for first graders.

Today, his mother reported a major meltdown at home last night, but this morning he was good and today had no incidents at school.
I might add that this is an only child to older parents, and they are just not used to anything but a compliant little boy until now, so the mother is doubting herself.

Yes, I can see that the parents think their boy is gifted... but has he actually been tested by a specialist to see if he is gifted? I don't mean this to sound rude, but a little class policeman who hyper-focuses on other kids following the rules while he himself is breaking them does not immediately bring the word "gifted" to mind. Could he be gifted? Certainly, just like a well-behaved child could, but I more often see that sort of behavior from low/average IQ kids with behavioral issues who get in trouble a lot, kids with Aspbergers, etc... you get a lot of hyper-obsession on "fairness" to the point where the room could be on fire and Johnny is sitting there talking to himself about how Susie stole a cookie when no one was looking. It can really be a detriment to some of these kids. Or, this kid could just be acting out because of the divorce and his inability to deal with the stress of it all. Not saying he couldn't be gifted (often Aspbergers kids have high IQs), just that I wouldn't look at this behavior and smack the label of "it's because he's gifted" on it.

[Jennibc]

Originally Posted by h886

Yes, I can see that the parents think their boy is gifted... but has he actually been tested by a specialist to see if he is gifted? I don't mean this to sound rude, but a little class policeman who hyper-focuses on other kids following the rules while he himself is breaking them does not immediately bring the word "gifted" to mind. Could he be gifted? Certainly, just like a well-behaved child could, but I more often see that sort of behavior from low/average IQ kids with behavioral issues who get in trouble a lot, kids with Aspbergers, etc... you get a lot of hyper-obsession on "fairness" to the point where the room could be on fire and Johnny is sitting there talking to himself about how Susie stole a cookie when no one was looking. It can really be a detriment to some of these kids. Or, this kid could just be acting out because of the divorce and his inability to deal with the stress of it all. Not saying he couldn't be gifted (often Aspbergers kids have high IQs), just that I wouldn't look at this behavior and smack the label of "it's because he's gifted" on it.

I don't mean to sound like a know it all here (I know, too late ) but that strong sense of "justice" is actually one of the hallmarks of a gifted kid. I don't know whether the kid the OP is discussing is actually gifted or not, but just because that doesn't sound to you like a trait of a gifted kid, doesn't mean it's not.

[Jennibc]

Since this thread has evolved (or devolved depending on your perspective) into a discussion on traits of kids identified as gifted, I thought I'd attach the following. I wish I could remember the source so that you can evaluate its merit but I cannot remember exactly where I got it. It may have been given to us a few years back after our son was tested by a child psychologist.

Most parents of gifted kids don't brag about it or think that it reflects on their parenting. They do understand that their kids may need a different educational environment because of their emotional intensity and the way they learn.

[h886]

Originally Posted by Jennibc

I don't mean to sound like a know it all here (I know, too late ) but that strong sense of "justice" is actually one of the hallmarks of a gifted kid. I don't know whether the kid the OP is discussing is actually gifted or not, but just because that doesn't sound to you like a trait of a gifted kid, doesn't mean it's not.

I've worked with a lot of kids over the years, gifted and not. I have more often seen that sort of behavior in the "not" category. So while I don't think we have enough information to rule one way or another (OP hasn't really answered), I can't really say that seeing the sort of behaviors she's describing screams "gifted" to me. It certainly could be, but as an example, I have several low IQ kids in my classes this year who would behave as the OP has described. They'll sit there playing class monitor for everyone else in order to get out of doing their own tasks. Could it be the behavior of a gifted child? Sure. It could also be a lot of other things. I think many parents are too quick to slap a gifted label on their kid when it truly isn't warranted. Actual gifted kids comprise a very small percentage of the population.

[Jennibc]

Originally Posted by h886

I've worked with a lot of kids over the years, gifted and not. I have more often seen that sort of behavior in the "not" category. So while I don't think we have enough information to rule one way or another (OP hasn't really answered), I can't really say that seeing the sort of behaviors she's describing screams "gifted" to me. It certainly could be, but as an example, I have several low IQ kids in my classes this year who would behave as the OP has described. Could it be the behavior of a gifted child? Sure. It could also be a lot of other things. I think many parents are too quick to slap a gifted label on their kid when it truly isn't warranted. Actual gifted kids comprise a very small percentage of the population.

Please see the attached sheet in the next post. You may have worked with a lot of kids, but kids that are intellectually gifted are only two out of every hundred. My son attended a public school that only served gifted kids, and that sense of right and wrong is absolutely a hallmark.

Just out of curiosity, how do you know which kids are 'low IQ' in your class? That type of information typically isn't available to teachers unless the parents provide it. Are you making assumptions based on behavior or performance?

[h886]

Originally Posted by Jennibc

Please see the attached sheet in the next post. You may have worked with a lot of kids, but kids that are intellectually gifted are only two out of every hundred. My son attended a public school that only served gifted kids, and that sense of right and wrong is absolutely a hallmark.

Just out of curiosity, how do you know which kids are 'low IQ' in your class? That type of information typically isn't available to teachers unless the parents provide it. Are you making assumptions based on behavior or performance?

It's provided for certain kids, actually, usually with special learning issues. No, we don't know it for all the kids. Seems like you're pretty quick to make some assumptions yourself, eh?

Let me make this simpler for you. If I see this behavior in 20 out of 100 kids and statistically only 2 out of 100 is gifted, it stands to reason (statistically, at least) that 18 out of the 20 are of non-gifted intelligence, right? So while this may very well be a gifted trait (not disagreeing with you and I actually agree, having much personal experience in the matter myself ), it does not mean that seeing this sort of behavior should lead to the assumption of giftedness. Whether a child is in fact gifted is something to be determined by testing, and so far we haven't heard any evidence that this has occurred.

That was my point. We hear the word "gifted" thrown out too liberally. We'll have to agree to disagree.

[ohiogirl22]

I have many gifts. Just last week someone gave me a hat.





Just a little humor.

[Jennibc]

Originally Posted by ohiogirl22

I have many gifts. Just last week someone gave me a hat.





Just a little humor.

Lol.

[Jennibc]

Originally Posted by h886

It's provided for certain kids, actually, usually with special learning issues. No, we don't know it for all the kids. Seems like you're pretty quick to make some assumptions yourself, eh?

Let me make this simpler for you. If I see this behavior in 20 out of 100 kids and statistically only 2 out of 100 is gifted, it stands to reason (statistically, at least) that 18 out of the 20 are of non-gifted intelligence, right? So while this may very well be a gifted trait (not disagreeing with you and I actually agree, having much personal experience in the matter myself ), it does not mean that seeing this sort of behavior should lead to the assumption of giftedness. Whether a child is in fact gifted is something to be determined by testing, and so far we haven't heard any evidence that this has occurred.

That was my point. We hear the word "gifted" thrown out too liberally. We'll have to agree to disagree.

I didn't make an assumption. I asked whether you are making an assumption. When I ask questions I am trying to gather factual information, not using them as a passive aggressive way to suggest something. You're making an inference that wasn't in anything I wrote.

I've taken statistics.

I also took logic in college. It does not stand to reason that just because I have written that most kids that are gifted have a strong sense of right and wrong that one can logically conclude that all kids that have a strong sense of right and wrong are gifted. I didn't imply that, I didn't conclude that. My point of contention with you was your quote:
"but a little class policeman who hyper-focuses on other kids following the rules while he himself is breaking them does not immediately bring the word "gifted" to mind. Could he be gifted? Certainly, just like a well-behaved child could, but I more often see that sort of behavior from low/average IQ kids with behavioral issues who get in trouble a lot, kids with Aspbergers, etc... you get a lot of hyper-obsession on "fairness" to the point where the room could be on fire and Johnny is sitting there talking to himself about how Susie stole a cookie when no one was looking."

The OP pointed out that the kid was upset about his pencil being stolen, he did not get upset about and then break the same rule. He was upset because of the injustice and then broke a different rule (hiding under his desk). This type of behavior is NOT uncommon for a kid that is identified at gifted.

If you read the list attached or researched the traits of gifted kids, you will also know that they can be extremely
"Sensitive: Can overreact and blow things out of
proportion. Can be very dramatic. Worry a great deal.
Highly imaginative. Complex and can turn anything into a drama."

Additionally, writing things on internet message boards like
"Let me make this simpler for you." when responding to someone elses post is mean spirited. I really hope you don't talk to your students that way.