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Old 02-02-2011, 11:14 AM
 
4,267 posts, read 5,145,823 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Sometimes I wonder if anti-vaxers absorb anything that is posted here

Hmmmmm? Lets' see. Do I trust random posters on an internet forum to make medical decisions for my family or do I trust my child's pediatrician? Really tough decision.

 
Old 02-02-2011, 11:24 AM
 
Location: West Orange, NJ
12,542 posts, read 17,747,695 times
Reputation: 3681
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavingMassachusetts View Post
From posting here I have noticed that there are 2 parenting buckets.

Anti-vaxers/Anti-circ/Breast is best/homescoolers/co-sleepers

Vaxers/Circers/Formula/Public School/Mean Moms

Old school versus new school, maybe?
maybe. personally, i think:

vaccination is good.
circum good (though not 100% sold but probably will do it if i'm blessed with a boy)
breast feeding is preferable for as long as possible (within reason!)
no thanks personally to homeschooling, but my personal exposure to it has definitely created a bias (maybe right, maybe wrong).
is co-sleeper having the baby sleep in the bedroom with you? we don't plan on it, but can't say that will stick...does that make us mean? lol
 
Old 02-02-2011, 11:25 AM
 
Location: West Orange, NJ
12,542 posts, read 17,747,695 times
Reputation: 3681
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
When you buy a health insurance policy, you are purchasing a product. The insurance company designs the product --- what will be covered --- and the employer or the individual decides which product fits the needs of the group or that particular individual. You choose the level of deductible and the copayment you are comfortable with. You can even choose whether you want maternity coverage or not with some plans.

Being a member of a group helps spread the risk over multiple individuals and the result is usually a lower premium. If you buy as an individual, you will pay more if you are overweight or you smoke or if you have certain health conditions. If the group is fairly small, and one person generates a large claim, the premium for the whole group may go up the next year.

Factoring in lack of vaccinations as a risk factor would be no different. A person who takes the flu vaccine is less likely to generate a claim for a flu related illness. For the insurance company to reward that person with a lower premium is totally reasonable. If you decide not to take the vaccine, then you accept more risk for yourself, and you should be prepared to pay for it. As bradykp said, there are people whose job it is to quantify those risks. That info is used to set the premium.

The government does not design the insurance product. That is a different issue from mandatory vaccination in order to attend public school. Since one of the functions of the government (which is us, by the way) is to protect the public welfare, which vaccines do very well, then requiring vaccines in order to attend public school is both reasonable and desirable.
funny thing about insurance, it was first created as basically a savings plan for women for when they got pregnant...to cover the costs of pregnancy and early child care!
 
Old 02-02-2011, 11:33 AM
 
1,302 posts, read 1,530,890 times
Reputation: 1916
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradykp View Post
maybe. personally, i think:

vaccination is good.
circum good (though not 100% sold but probably will do it if i'm blessed with a boy)
breast feeding is preferable for as long as possible (within reason!)
no thanks personally to homeschooling, but my personal exposure to it has definitely created a bias (maybe right, maybe wrong).
is co-sleeper having the baby sleep in the bedroom with you? we don't plan on it, but can't say that will stick...does that make us mean? lol
Co-sleeping is having the whole family in bed together, not just babies..toddlers, children, pre-teens etc....
 
Old 02-02-2011, 11:35 AM
 
Location: West Orange, NJ
12,542 posts, read 17,747,695 times
Reputation: 3681
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorthy View Post
You are forced to pay, one way or another (penalty or insurance) and what about medicaid?

Never said that there were no rules. I was just saying that there are already government controls in place. There are vaccination exemptions for schools in many states; medical, religious and philosophical so non-vaxers are often not breaking any rules if they do send their children to school.

Just because people don't hold the same opinion as you does not mean that they need to go and live in isolation. That's really extreme.

what about medicaid? if you're enjoying great insurance benefits from public funding, paid for by the help of my tax dollars...then yes, you should be directed to do certain things. if you don't like it, stop using the great discounted benefits you get from the government. no one forces one to use medicaid.

as for the exemptions, you may be legally exempted, but i don't think that gives one a pass ethically. this is a matter of opinion. everyone's ethics are different.

it's not about holding the same opinion as me. it's about proven science. if you want to go against proven science and put other people at risk, then yeah, you should go live with all the other un-vaxed people. enjoy it. there's no evidence supporting not vaccinating except that "i don't believe the big bad government, the big bad companies, and all those crazy doctors and scientists that tell me it's good. i prefer to believe these 10 doctors that tell me it's not necessarily beneficial, and these 2 that tell me it causes deaths and autism." sure - exagerrated, but where's the evidence to the contrary?
 
Old 02-02-2011, 11:37 AM
 
1,302 posts, read 1,530,890 times
Reputation: 1916
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradykp View Post
what about medicaid? if you're enjoying great insurance benefits from public funding, paid for by the help of my tax dollars...then yes, you should be directed to do certain things. if you don't like it, stop using the great discounted benefits you get from the government. no one forces one to use medicaid.

as for the exemptions, you may be legally exempted, but i don't think that gives one a pass ethically. this is a matter of opinion. everyone's ethics are different.

it's not about holding the same opinion as me. it's about proven science. if you want to go against proven science and put other people at risk, then yeah, you should go live with all the other un-vaxed people. enjoy it. there's no evidence supporting not vaccinating except that "i don't believe the big bad government, the big bad companies, and all those crazy doctors and scientists that tell me it's good. i prefer to believe these 10 doctors that tell me it's not necessarily beneficial, and these 2 that tell me it causes deaths and autism." sure - exagerrated, but where's the evidence to the contrary?
You know what they call the guy who graduated last in his class from medical school?

Doctor.
 
Old 02-02-2011, 11:37 AM
 
4,267 posts, read 5,145,823 times
Reputation: 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradykp View Post
. if you want to go against proven science and put other people at risk, then yeah, you should go live with all the other un-vaxed people. enjoy it.
Ridiculous!
 
Old 02-02-2011, 11:40 AM
 
Location: West Orange, NJ
12,542 posts, read 17,747,695 times
Reputation: 3681
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavingMassachusetts View Post
Co-sleeping is having the whole family in bed together, not just babies..toddlers, children, pre-teens etc....
no thanks on that one! haha
 
Old 02-02-2011, 11:48 AM
 
4,267 posts, read 5,145,823 times
Reputation: 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavingMassachusetts View Post
Co-sleeping is having the whole family in bed together, not just babies..toddlers, children, pre-teens etc....
Not this is even remotely related to the topic at hand but since you brought it up, I feel the need to clarify. Co-sleeping just means sleeping near one's children, as in the same room. Sometimes that means in the same bed other times it means the baby or child is on a bassinet or crib in the same room or on a mattress on the floor. Usually it's babies and small children. Pre-teens are definitely not the norm. It does not mean that the whole family sleeps in one bed together either. It's not as weird as you are trying to make it out to be.
 
Old 02-02-2011, 11:53 AM
 
Location: West Orange, NJ
12,542 posts, read 17,747,695 times
Reputation: 3681
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorthy View Post
Ridiculous!
not any more ridiculous than putting other people at risk based on no evidence and solely based on skepticism.

how would you feel if a person with HIV just started going around, not telling any partners what issues exist...how would you feel if they infected your child?

if i'm sitting at a doctor's office with a 6 month old baby in the waiting room, you can be darn sure i don't want to be sitting amongst unvaccinated children that have to go see the doctor for something...why am i ridiculous in that thought?

facts are, not vaccinated children expose them and others to higher risks...so yes, higher premiums or lack of discount s are perfectly acceptable. and this has zero to do with the government. i'd be happy if my insurance company took this approach. in fact, I might even email their customer service and suggest it!
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