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Old 01-30-2011, 10:41 AM
 
2,726 posts, read 4,369,225 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaade75 View Post
First Id like to say THANK YOU to everyone who has responded to my post...it takes a spark to create an inferno...truly one person can change the world but an idea at a time...and when we come together like this I believe we are gleaning info and experience from one another...bullies do not create themselves there are ALWAYS underlying issues...I commend time outs at a young age..but once that child gets to a point of abusing the mother or father for attention...there is ur warning sign...Its a matter of respect...I do NOT want to compare children to dogs...however I believe its along the same lines at that time in life...you cant be suckers bc of what u went thru in ur life...lets BREAK THE CYCLE....no is no...period If we teach them early enough theyll get it...in my sons life I have tried to inject comic humor for all the well mom I hate this and Im not doin that...I come back w comedy and in the end...hey buddy...lets look at it this way...what if this happened to ur mommy...what would you do and we go from there....But I firmly believe at that young of age you need to be w biters...its a slippery slope truly so put on ya traction shoes...bc WE brought them into this world...and we have a responbility to our family AND the community
I think it is great that you are passionate about this topic but be careful not to sound as intolerant as the bully. It is not so easy "fixing" other people's children. The child may not change simply because the parent approves the behavior. The child may not change simply because they have to go home to their parents everyday who may be bullies themselves.

I think the best solution for me and my family is to know the signs of an unhealthy relationship (taunting vs. teasing, there is a difference), to show support for each other at home (e.g. not trivialize the feelings of my daughter but also teach her that she shouldn't let things happen to her). Other things that come to mind is when the environment tolerates bullying. It is important for my daughter to know that it is okay to not lower your standards just to have these types of children as friends, whether it be the bully or those who support the bully. However, I would never tell her to go around acting like she is better, just different and that is okay. It is also important that she support her friends.

I grew up in an environment where bullying was tolerated, even encouraged. I remember trying hard to be friends with these people which often meant doing things I didn't want to do all because I didn't want to be without friends. Looking back, the quiet ones were the ones I should have attempted at having a friendship with. They were quiet for a reason, they wanted nothing to do with losers.
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Old 01-30-2011, 10:44 AM
 
Location: Western Washington
8,004 posts, read 9,676,318 times
Reputation: 19413
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaade75 View Post
Im curious if parents who are aware that their child is a bully ie. by notification of victims parents...school...police...What steps are they taking to correct this issue with their child. Because truly I have had it up to here and then some with children being tormented to the point of psychological trauma physical damage or worse death...I can not imagine that a great majority of these parents are unaware of their childrens behavior and personalities...Im confident there are exceptions however I feel the majority are quite aware of it...And it kills me to read these parents of bullies feeling now their children are being ostracized...Im in favor of changing the law and holding this tyrants in the making accountable...Listen if you DONT want to be labeled by the community or on your school record youre a deviant..heres a clue...dont bully....We have to teach them somehow...times have changed people....Lets make a difference and Id go so short as sewing a big B on a bullys shirt haha Really it was said well the names of bullies must be shielded because theyre children and this could traumatize them...yeah? one act will traumatize them? ha guess they werent thinkin of that when they were torturing their victims for yearssss sometimes...Just makes me sick...Lets save the children before they kill us all

I don't think that most of the "bullies'" parents see them as bullies at all. As other posters have said, many of their parents are bullies. They justify their behavior in their children as well. Most of the adults who are bullies, probably would still be bullies as adults, even if they were held accountable for it in school. As disgusting as it is, that's just they way some people think. The worst part of it is this...it seems as if "physical" violence is generally the only type that is dealt with. The little buggers who are constantly spreading lies and gossip, surrounded by a pack of their little followers are probably the most malicious bullies of all....and unfortunately, the biggest share of them are the little girls!

Look at all the "cyber-bullying" that goes on these days! You know, on another thread, there was a comment made about "most kids having cell phones these days". Sure, there is some justification in kids having cell phones....but look at how so many of those kids use them for hurtful purposes. I honestly think that if more parents practiced what they preached.....were truly kind and tolerant, and let their children SEE that behavior....constantly, bullying wouldn't be the issue that it is! How can a parent reinforce rules that they, themselves, aren't willing to follow.

I'm probably going to get some scowls on this comment, but it is what it is. When I was a kid, if there was a bully who shoved a kid into a locker, he/she got shoved into a locker....OR he/she was pulled out in the hall or out in front of the other students and was given a hack! Not only did you have the right to defend yourself, but if the "adults" were called in to handle the situation, it was handled promptly.

One of the things I despise about the "zero-tolerance" violence policy is this....the non-bulling children have their hands tied. These monster children are wandering the halls and classrooms, randomly targeting other children. The schools can only "see" so much of what's going on. However, just let the monster child "accidentally" elbow someone (who's HAD IT), one too many times, the "good" child turns around and let's the monster have a taste of his own medicine, and look what happens. The little monster is snickering at his ability to wreak havoc, while the retaliator is sent home for three days! We just had this incident occur in our school. A really wonderful child, whom I've known his entire life, just got suspended for 3 days. The kid who got "decked" has been goading this lovely, sweet boy (albeit, now LARGER) kid with his nasty remarks, elbows to the ribs, tripping incidents, and the boy finally snapped and punched him in the nose. Guess who got suspended? Not the bully! He's the VICTIM!

The truly nauseating part of this whole situation is that this "retaliator" is so incredibly well-liked, always has been, because he has always been one of the nice guys. My son and him have been friends since daycare, both of them took huge growing spurts in the last 2 years, are incredibly gifted athletes, and yet are so amazingly gentle and humble. No one could believe that this boy would EVER strike another child in anger. However, these bullies peck at children like him until they finally break through their reserve. He just got his way....this bully. He finally got this kid to snap and got HIM kicked out of school. The gentle boy's parents....being the great people they are? "Well...he knows there's a zero tolerance policy. You do the crime, you gotta do the time" Blessings to all of you good people who are dealing with this situation. It is a real test of ours and our kids' characters.....do we pass, or do we fail that test. LOL

Okay...needing more coffee...just put in my two cents here. I agree with you OP...something has to be done. Unfortunately, I can't see any easy solution here. I mean, some of us work so hard at teaching our children to be kind, to only have nice things to say or nothing at all. Unfortunately, there will ALWAYS be jealous, spiteful, mean people out there who are raising kids who are not like our children. To many of those parents, we are the ones who are the problem. We are raising wimpy, over-sensitive children who need to be TOUGH to make it in this world. Therefore, "either your kid needs to learn to stand up for him/herself, or forever be the victim". The comical side of it is this, just let one of our "overly sensitive", wimpy children defend him/herself against the bullying little brat, and look who goes screaming INJUSTICE to the school! LOL Yeah, the bullies' parents.

It all boils down to this, IMHO...a huge, huge problem in our society is with DOUBLE-STANDARDS! People have one set of rules for themselves and their children....but the rest of society has to live under an entirely different set of rules....one which conforms to THEIR whims.
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Old 01-30-2011, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Hawaii
2,058 posts, read 2,808,521 times
Reputation: 1572
Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
Lots of two year olds bite and hit because they don't have the language to use their words or out of frustration.

In the daycares I worked in, a biter was usually shadowed and prevented from biting. We actively taught them other ways to interact. We separated the biter for short periods of time and then allowed them to try again. Usually within a few weeks the biter learned new behaviors to replace the old ones and they did not have to be *kicked out* of the center.

Mostly, I do think that 2 year olds eventually grow out of these behaviors especially if parents and teachers work on teaching them empathy, caring and good behaviors.
I agree that it could be because he didn't know another way to get attention because half the time he didn't even seem upset when he did it. Niether I nor the Lead Teacher could change our Center policy though, so giving him more chances wasn't an option.

I agree that most grow out of the behavior but some do become bullies.

When I worked there I was only 18 and mostly did what my lead teacher told me to do and didn't really know how to correct behavior, just try to prevent it. I do wish I could have done more to teach him good behaviors but it probably would have been confusing when he pulls hair to get attention at home. Great suggestions though. Would definetely have tried to put those into practice if I was still there.
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Old 01-30-2011, 07:08 PM
 
Location: New Orleans
9 posts, read 14,997 times
Reputation: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by magoomafoo View Post
I was only making a point that the bully would pick on younger/smaller kids. Hitting girls is not exempt either. Funny thing is that for the first year after his family moved in, our school swept everything under the rug. This only made the situation worse as the other kids were the one's actually getting in trouble for that kid starting the fight. His mother would come barging into the school crying foul-my son is a sensitive loving boy-he has anger/agression issues-he must be having trouble with his add/adhd today-all the other kids in this school are the problem-----Great, one of those "Society is the reason my kid is a bully" mom's.
I LOVE it...it never ceases to amaze me when people use the phrase...Its everybody else...got a lil newsflash for ya...if EVERYBODY else is wrong...Id suggest u take up residence on another planet...it kills me it does...everybody else is wrong and Im right...thats when we need to do a lil self searchin and say...uh ohhhh maybe everybody on the other side has a point...good one...HIGH FIVE
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Old 01-30-2011, 07:11 PM
 
Location: New Orleans
9 posts, read 14,997 times
Reputation: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisan View Post
I think it is great that you are passionate about this topic but be careful not to sound as intolerant as the bully. It is not so easy "fixing" other people's children. The child may not change simply because the parent approves the behavior. The child may not change simply because they have to go home to their parents everyday who may be bullies themselves.

I think the best solution for me and my family is to know the signs of an unhealthy relationship (taunting vs. teasing, there is a difference), to show support for each other at home (e.g. not trivialize the feelings of my daughter but also teach her that she shouldn't let things happen to her). Other things that come to mind is when the environment tolerates bullying. It is important for my daughter to know that it is okay to not lower your standards just to have these types of children as friends, whether it be the bully or those who support the bully. However, I would never tell her to go around acting like she is better, just different and that is okay. It is also important that she support her friends.

I grew up in an environment where bullying was tolerated, even encouraged. I remember trying hard to be friends with these people which often meant doing things I didn't want to do all because I didn't want to be without friends. Looking back, the quiet ones were the ones I should have attempted at having a friendship with. They were quiet for a reason, they wanted nothing to do with losers.
well said...and I did address the issue before that bullies have feelings as well...they certainly didnt pop out pissed off at the world...its a learned behavior...for the most part...starts in the home....u sound like ur doing a wonderful job..kudos to you
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Old 01-30-2011, 07:25 PM
 
Location: New Orleans
9 posts, read 14,997 times
Reputation: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by beachmel View Post
I don't think that most of the "bullies'" parents see them as bullies at all. As other posters have said, many of their parents are bullies. They justify their behavior in their children as well. Most of the adults who are bullies, probably would still be bullies as adults, even if they were held accountable for it in school. As disgusting as it is, that's just they way some people think. The worst part of it is this...it seems as if "physical" violence is generally the only type that is dealt with. The little buggers who are constantly spreading lies and gossip, surrounded by a pack of their little followers are probably the most malicious bullies of all....and unfortunately, the biggest share of them are the little girls!

Look at all the "cyber-bullying" that goes on these days! You know, on another thread, there was a comment made about "most kids having cell phones these days". Sure, there is some justification in kids having cell phones....but look at how so many of those kids use them for hurtful purposes. I honestly think that if more parents practiced what they preached.....were truly kind and tolerant, and let their children SEE that behavior....constantly, bullying wouldn't be the issue that it is! How can a parent reinforce rules that they, themselves, aren't willing to follow.

I'm probably going to get some scowls on this comment, but it is what it is. When I was a kid, if there was a bully who shoved a kid into a locker, he/she got shoved into a locker....OR he/she was pulled out in the hall or out in front of the other students and was given a hack! Not only did you have the right to defend yourself, but if the "adults" were called in to handle the situation, it was handled promptly.

One of the things I despise about the "zero-tolerance" violence policy is this....the non-bulling children have their hands tied. These monster children are wandering the halls and classrooms, randomly targeting other children. The schools can only "see" so much of what's going on. However, just let the monster child "accidentally" elbow someone (who's HAD IT), one too many times, the "good" child turns around and let's the monster have a taste of his own medicine, and look what happens. The little monster is snickering at his ability to wreak havoc, while the retaliator is sent home for three days! We just had this incident occur in our school. A really wonderful child, whom I've known his entire life, just got suspended for 3 days. The kid who got "decked" has been goading this lovely, sweet boy (albeit, now LARGER) kid with his nasty remarks, elbows to the ribs, tripping incidents, and the boy finally snapped and punched him in the nose. Guess who got suspended? Not the bully! He's the VICTIM!

The truly nauseating part of this whole situation is that this "retaliator" is so incredibly well-liked, always has been, because he has always been one of the nice guys. My son and him have been friends since daycare, both of them took huge growing spurts in the last 2 years, are incredibly gifted athletes, and yet are so amazingly gentle and humble. No one could believe that this boy would EVER strike another child in anger. However, these bullies peck at children like him until they finally break through their reserve. He just got his way....this bully. He finally got this kid to snap and got HIM kicked out of school. The gentle boy's parents....being the great people they are? "Well...he knows there's a zero tolerance policy. You do the crime, you gotta do the time" Blessings to all of you good people who are dealing with this situation. It is a real test of ours and our kids' characters.....do we pass, or do we fail that test. LOL

Okay...needing more coffee...just put in my two cents here. I agree with you OP...something has to be done. Unfortunately, I can't see any easy solution here. I mean, some of us work so hard at teaching our children to be kind, to only have nice things to say or nothing at all. Unfortunately, there will ALWAYS be jealous, spiteful, mean people out there who are raising kids who are not like our children. To many of those parents, we are the ones who are the problem. We are raising wimpy, over-sensitive children who need to be TOUGH to make it in this world. Therefore, "either your kid needs to learn to stand up for him/herself, or forever be the victim". The comical side of it is this, just let one of our "overly sensitive", wimpy children defend him/herself against the bullying little brat, and look who goes screaming INJUSTICE to the school! LOL Yeah, the bullies' parents.

It all boils down to this, IMHO...a huge, huge problem in our society is with DOUBLE-STANDARDS! People have one set of rules for themselves and their children....but the rest of society has to live under an entirely different set of rules....one which conforms to THEIR whims.
BRAVOOOOOO You are truly a well versed and passionate person...My hats off to you...I could NOT have said it better myself...my sentiments EXACTLY
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Old 01-31-2011, 09:43 AM
 
Location: Western Washington
8,004 posts, read 9,676,318 times
Reputation: 19413
Quote:
Originally Posted by magoomafoo View Post
My son was bullied beyond belief the past two years by a newcomer to our small town. It started with name calling, throwing rocks/sticks at him. My son was 9 and the bully was 12. It came to a halt when my son was walking home from school one day with a couple of his friends. The bully came barrelling up on him with his bike and tried running him over. My son quickly moved out of the way but the bully turned and came back at him coming a little too close to the girl that walking with my son. My son grabbed the bully off his bike and when he tried to take a swing at my son, was punched right square in the nose. He then called the girl a horrible name and my son proceeded to whitewash the kid. He then dragged the kid to the side of the road and continued home. This whole event was witnessed by several adults including the crosswalk guard. (thank goodness). The bully's mom called me up and preceeded to give me the third degree on how MY son is a bully and she was pressing charges because her son's nose was bleeding. What upsets me is that my son had to resort to physical aggression to PROTECT not only himself but a girl that was with him. Needless to say, he recieved numerous "atta boy's" from alot of parents including his own.
I feel for you magoomafoo... several years ago, my next to youngest son was faced with a similar situation on a bus. Fortunately, he did not get into too much trouble. There were so very many witnesses to the incident and the bus driver had HAD it with this particular bully. Everyone went to bat for my son and let it be known that mine was simply defending himself. My son was not "proud of himself", and appologized profusely for his violence. The poor thing came home "the victor", but still said, "Mom, I'm so sorry, but I couldn't take it anymore! He punched me in the ribs and knocked me into the seat. I hit my head on the bar on the back of the seat and I just snapped! I'm sorry I got into a fight, but Mom, I'm sick of him. I can't even believe he's still in school!" Get this, same age difference. My son was in 8th grade, the bully was a junior in high school! No, he certainly didn't get in trouble at home either. You know, a person can only put up with just so much.
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Old 01-31-2011, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Heart of Oklahoma
1,173 posts, read 1,294,319 times
Reputation: 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zimbochick View Post
It has been my experience that the majority of bullies (not all) have one or both parents that are bullies too. To have any insight mean being accountable for their own actions, which rarely happens. Then I think the remainder are parents that are very passive, and are dominated by their kids. I think the schools could be a lot tougher on bullies. Heaven forbid you draw a pictue of a gun, you'll be booted out ASAP, but you can bully repeatedly with little consequence. If they can impose zero tolerance for a bunch of petty infractions, they should impose it for bullying.
I completely agree with this. If parents aren't correcting the behavior, as they should; then it should be the school's responsibility. Sulphur Elementary School in Sulphur, OK tried to do just that, but the parents freaked out and I'm assuming the bullying is still going on b/c none of the parents think they're "angel" could actually be such a terror.
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Old 02-01-2011, 09:56 AM
 
3,749 posts, read 7,243,388 times
Reputation: 3684
Quote:
Originally Posted by beachmel View Post
I don't think that most of the "bullies'" parents see them as bullies at all. As other posters have said, many of their parents are bullies. They justify their behavior in their children as well.

Agreed - my neighbors are a set of such parents. Their 8 year old is a nightmare - disruptive in school - cant maintain friendships - but wow great at sports and quite aggresive. The mother is IMO an abused spouse, but also rationalizes the behavior of child and spouse and in fact is not a very nice person in some respects herself. My child his age will not play with her son - as wont others on the street, but they still dont see it.

She says in response to the schools administration's constant complaint- "I know he has his faults, but he isnt a bad kid." In fact she is correct - this poor child is a result of his home environment - he speaks at a constant yell, is attention starved, and is so aggressive he cannot maintain a friendship longer than a few months. There isnt much I can do to help - so I just keep my distance and await the trainwreck.
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Old 02-01-2011, 10:04 AM
 
3,749 posts, read 7,243,388 times
Reputation: 3684
As for me - when my son was a victim of bulllying - while i wanted to go to the school and jack up the little girl - I thought it would likely be inappropriate. I told the school after my son got sent to the office about the cause of the situation and requested that the pushing and hitting cease immediately. When it did not- I went back the next morning and explained that my son had been given instructions to warm her once - and if she did it again - to ball up his fist and hit her as hard as he could - I told them that I explained to him that he would be sent to the office and they would call me, but I would not be angry and he would not have consequences at home as the school had been warned, she had been warned and he was defending himself.

Funny - that ended that situation. And, I would do it again.
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