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Old 09-13-2011, 04:24 PM
 
9,232 posts, read 5,067,000 times
Reputation: 9171
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYSinger View Post
SAHMs are homemakers as well and take care of the home. No I am not a mother, doesn't mean I have no opinion, just as some of you have an opinion about me. Most moms go back to work where I live and anyone not working is deemed as betraying the feminist sisters.

Our materialistic culture despises it. If feminism works for you, that is great! It led to lots of wonderful things, but it is not perfect and cannot claim to be. No one has the right to discriminate. I've read enough comments on message boards online and IRL about stay at home wives and mothers to know that a lot of people nowadays do not approve of it.

Let's just agree to disagree, shall we.
Again you are not in the same category as stay at home moms. It is not REMOTELY the same thing. SAHMs actually have far more in common with working moms than they do with you. Stop trying to ride on their coat tails.

 
Old 09-13-2011, 04:27 PM
 
9,232 posts, read 5,067,000 times
Reputation: 9171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorthy View Post
I think that NYsinger's point is that homemaking used to be a normal and valuable role for women in our society. Post feminism people tend to look down at homemakers, partcularly those without children. Women without children are expected to work. The choice to stay at home (without kids) is no longer seen as valid or reasonable. A few posters have proven this to be true with their comments in this thread.

Why is the choice to go off to a job more valued then the choice to stay home and take care of the household?
Because regardless of gender, society values that which is productive for society and the community at large. Raising children is productive for society, working outside the home is productive for society, the 50s image of housewife hood (and I am not assuming that is what NYsinger does that it is starting to appear that way) of taking care of the home and husband does not have a larger value to society.

Therefore it is less valuable than working or raising children.
 
Old 09-13-2011, 04:30 PM
 
5,507 posts, read 5,368,766 times
Reputation: 2217
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorthy View Post
I think that NYsinger's point is that homemaking used to be a normal and valuable role for women in our society. Post feminism people tend to look down at homemakers, partcularly those without children. Women without children are expected to work. The choice to stay at home (without kids) is no longer seen as valid or reasonable. A few posters have proven this to be true with their comments in this thread.

Why is the choice to go off to a job more valued then the choice to stay home and take care of the household?
Taking care of a household compared to a full time job really isn't much of a comparison.

I think you get the comments because most people do both while either having jobs or one job with a stay at home mom. I'm not sure anyone really cares until someone suggests "taking care of a household" is work.
 
Old 09-13-2011, 04:31 PM
 
9,232 posts, read 5,067,000 times
Reputation: 9171
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYSinger View Post
I don't expect praise, but when an opinion discriminates, it is not right. Just as gender, sexual, class and racial discrimination are wrong. For the record, I want to clarify that I am not against day cares and fully support stay at home dads. Just as working moms have the choice to work does not give a free pass for other people to insult them. It seems like some of you are saying it is okay to criticize stay at home moms but never okay to criticize working moms. It works both ways. Free speech and choice does not give you a free pass to put down others. I could make a lot of money but choose to be a homemaker.

Dew: Are you a fan of Tori Amos? She used your screen name in a song! Where you live sounds cool!
But you are NOT A SAHM!!!!!

You take care of your house and your husband. And fyi, for someone claiming to be well educated you should know, that discrimination means someone is denying you opportunities based on a grouping or category. What opportunities are you being denied for CHOOSING TO NOT WORK?

I fully support your right to choose to be a housewife. No one is saying you do not have that right. But that does not mean I have to respect or value that choice. Hell, you have the right to be a stripper if it floats you boat it does not make it a respectable CHOICE.
 
Old 09-13-2011, 04:36 PM
 
Location: On a Voyage Around the Sun
21,256 posts, read 11,786,923 times
Reputation: 22707
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYSinger View Post
Dew: Are you a fan of Tori Amos? She used your screen name in a song! Where you live sounds cool!
I use it because it's a family joke. There are Dew Drop Inns in every podunk town in this country and we saw them all on one family vacation or another.

I have to tell you I'm laughing to myself because I live in a VERY conservative area. Very. Like famous-conservatives-live-here-conservative. (You said you were a liberal.) But maybe that's what you need. I'm thinking your basic problem is being judged (rightly or wrongly) by other women? I can't see my conservative neighbors putting you down for your choice.
 
Old 09-13-2011, 04:45 PM
 
4,267 posts, read 2,894,598 times
Reputation: 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
Because regardless of gender, society values that which is productive for society and the community at large. Raising children is productive for society, working outside the home is productive for society, the 50s image of housewife hood (and I am not assuming that is what NYsinger does that it is starting to appear that way) of taking care of the home and husband does not have a larger value to society.

Therefore it is less valuable than working or raising children.
There is more to life them productivity and consumerism.

I can think of numerous benefits to having a stay at home partner. A homemaker has more time to shop for groceries which gives them time to look for the best deals and save the family money. They also have time for a backyard garden if they choose to have one, again, saving money for the family. They have time to cook meals from scratch which means less eating out, less processed foods equaling better health and money in the bank. They have time to clean the house and do laundry, pay the bills, etc. while their partner works which equals more free time to spend together in the evenings and weekends instead of rushing around doing chores. They don't need fancy clothes for work. Less money spent on gas, etc.

The choice to be a housewife is just as valid as the choice to go out and get a job working for someone else.
 
Old 09-13-2011, 04:51 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
3,388 posts, read 1,688,355 times
Reputation: 2352
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYSinger View Post
SAHMs are homemakers as well and take care of the home. No I am not a mother, doesn't mean I have no opinion, just as some of you have an opinion about me. Most moms go back to work where I live and anyone not working is deemed as betraying the feminist sisters.

Our materialistic culture despises it. If feminism works for you, that is great! It led to lots of wonderful things, but it is not perfect and cannot claim to be. No one has the right to discriminate. I've read enough comments on message boards online and IRL about stay at home wives and mothers to know that a lot of people nowadays do not approve of it.

Let's just agree to disagree, shall we.
I'm curious where on LI you are (not really asking, I'm sure that's TMI for a message board), because I grew up on LI and still have family there and the culture you're describing does not sound even vaguely familiar to me, from then or now.

I know a ton of working mothers who live on LI mainly because the cost of living is, compared to other parts of the country, prohibitively expensive for a one-income household. Props to you and your husband that you can make it work for you. For most LIers, everyone works because everyone has to. Granted, I don't know the uber wealthy circles on LI, so maybe it's a different culture there - I can't speak to that.

I do think that one has to separate out SAHW from SAHM, not for purposes of discriminating, but because they are functionally different roles. I also agree that having the freedom to choose different roles is an entirely different beast from having people applaud or respect those decisions. Feminism gave us the space to choose our roles. Nothing gives us the right to have our choices universally admired.
 
Old 09-13-2011, 05:20 PM
 
9,232 posts, read 5,067,000 times
Reputation: 9171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorthy View Post
There is more to life them productivity and consumerism.

I can think of numerous benefits to having a stay at home partner. A homemaker has more time to shop for groceries which gives them time to look for the best deals and save the family money. They also have time for a backyard garden if they choose to have one, again, saving money for the family. They have time to cook meals from scratch which means less eating out, less processed foods equaling better health and money in the bank. They have time to clean the house and do laundry, pay the bills, etc. while their partner works which equals more free time to spend together in the evenings and weekends instead of rushing around doing chores. They don't need fancy clothes for work. Less money spent on gas, etc.

The choice to be a housewife is just as valid as the choice to go out and get a job working for someone else.
I never said it wasn't a perfectly valid choice, what I said and I continue to state is, it is not as valuable to society or has any intrinsic value in my opinion at all

I highly value and teach my daughter as well, to give back to society. My career choices, my lifestyle choices and the majority of my hobbies are connected to the belief that being a PRODUCTIVE (which does not mean monetarily or consumptive in the slightest) member of society. Therefore I, personally and as a family, do not value the choice by anyone (man or woman) to take care of a house and spouse as your primary activity.

And fyi, I cook at home from organic (frequently home grown too) food, do my laundry at home and hang in on the line, clean my house etc and I still work full time.
 
Old 09-13-2011, 05:20 PM
 
369 posts, read 998,315 times
Reputation: 235
I don't live on LI anymore, I should update my profile!

Dew: I live in a very liberal area where more than 80% of women work. But even when I lived elsewhere, women were very quick to insults toward me. I don't know, I was raised to be polite and be respectful. Chatting with other housewives over the years has shown me that they get the same treatment I do, whether they have kids or not.

Dorthy: Thank you! It is what I've been trying to explain in better words!

I think we've all been hurt somewhere somehow and sometimes that means we will think our choice is the better one. I disagree with the OP's posts and felt a need to clarify that being a housewife as a valid position.
 
Old 09-13-2011, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, PA
3,388 posts, read 1,688,355 times
Reputation: 2352
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYSinger View Post
I don't live on LI anymore, I should update my profile!

Dew: I live in a very liberal area where more than 80% of women work. But even when I lived elsewhere, women were very quick to insults toward me. I don't know, I was raised to be polite and be respectful. Chatting with other housewives over the years has shown me that they get the same treatment I do, whether they have kids or not.

Dorthy: Thank you! It is what I've been trying to explain in better words!

I think we've all been hurt somewhere somehow and sometimes that means we will think our choice is the better one. I disagree with the OP's posts and felt a need to clarify that being a housewife as a valid position.
I don't know that I agree with the bolded. I think the choices I've made for myself are good for me, my family and my situation, which is why I made them. But I don't think my choices are better or more valid than anyone else's - we all do what works for us.
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